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How Many Miracles are Required to Canonize a Saint?
Canon Law Made Easy ^ | July 18, 2013 | Cathy Caridi, J.C.L.

Posted on 07/18/2013 8:29:53 PM PDT by Weiss White

Q: How many miracles are required before somebody can be canonized a saint? I thought that you needed three. But now the Pope has announced that John Paul II will be canonized after only two miracles, and John XXIII with (I believe) even less than that. Did the rules get changed at some point? Is this even a canon-law question? –Sylvie

A: Sylvie is of course referring to the Vatican’s July 5 announcement that a miracle has been attributed to the intercession of Blessed John Paul II, clearing the way for his canonization. The same decree also indicates that Pope Francis has approved a decision made at the Vatican’s Congregation for Causes of Saints, regarding the canonization of Blessed John XXIII—although no miracle has been attributed to him. What’s going on here?

(Excerpt) Read more at canonlawmadeeasy.com ...


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Current Events; Theology
KEYWORDS: blogspam; canonization; canonize; canonlaw; catholic; checkoutmyblog; comeseemyblog; didjareadmyblog; ihaveablog; iminteresting; listentome; lookatme; payattentiontome; pimpmyblog; readme; readmyblog; readmyramblings; trollingforhits

1 posted on 07/18/2013 8:29:53 PM PDT by Weiss White
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To: Weiss White

42


2 posted on 07/18/2013 8:30:45 PM PDT by mlo
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To: Weiss White
Where did you get the "three" idea? Maybe the three pronouncement steps? Venerable, Blessed, Saint?

Saints [Catholic, Orthodox, Open]
SAINTHOOD 101: Rules for Becoming a Saint [Catholic Caucus]
The Process of Becoming a Saint (Canonization) [Catholic Caucus]
Pope Lists Criteria for Causes of Canonization

3 posted on 07/18/2013 8:37:48 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Weiss White

Zero - nor is “canonization” necessary.


4 posted on 07/18/2013 8:39:11 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

Please read the links above for history of the canonization process in the Catholic Church.


5 posted on 07/18/2013 8:40:55 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: mlo
42

-----------------

I'm assuming you found that regulation right next to the other ones in the Hebrew Scriptures explicitly listing the rules and processes by which men can exalt other men into a super-status of "saint".

Let me pull out my Torah/Tanakh and I'll confirm & cross reference those 101 Sainthood rules with the Word of G-d........in 3.....2.......1.......

......wait I'm still looking.....

While you're waiting I looked up the hebrew root word for "saint" (did the research years ago) and the catholic/christian word "saint" comes from the Hebrew Scriptures in the form of Qodesh or Qodeshim. The literal translation is Set-Apart in or those whom are Set-Apart. The usage of the word in the Hebrew Scriptures and within the Gospels denotes anybody who has cleaved themselves to G-d's Covenant, and lives according to the written Word of G-d. Nowhere is Qodesh or Qodeshim used to denote a higher office within a hierarchy of a religious ruling class.

Anybody who cleaves themselves to the Covenant with G-d, and lives the whole written Word of G-d, just like Jesus did, is Qodesh Set-Apart in G-d.

Well, I gave up trying to cross reference the 101 rules of sainthood with the Hebrew Scriptures because they can't be cross referenced anywhere in Torah/Tanakh or in the teachings of Jesus.
6 posted on 07/18/2013 8:56:23 PM PDT by brent13a
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To: brent13a

Don’t panic.


7 posted on 07/18/2013 9:08:05 PM PDT by mlo
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To: Weiss White

Who canonized the saints at Ephesus, to whom the Apostle Paul penned a letter?


8 posted on 07/18/2013 9:28:52 PM PDT by Elsiejay
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To: Weiss White

The only miracle required for one to become a saint is for one to accept Jesus’s sacrifice on the cross and his resurrection. A saint is simply a believer in Christ according to New Testament reading. There is no process by which a church or group of people must vote on to make a person a saint.


9 posted on 07/18/2013 9:36:35 PM PDT by ScubieNuc (When there is no justice in the laws, justice is left to the outlaws.)
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To: Weiss White

The first of the two miracles, the supposed healing of the French nun of Parkinson’s, is, how does one say it, reverting? Here is a clip from the Guardian:

“But according to the Polish daily newspaper Rzeczpospolita, one of the doctors charged with scrutinising the nun’s case believed she might have been suffering from a similar nervous disease, not Parkinson’s, which could go into sudden remission. A report on the paper’s website went further, saying that the 49-year-old nun had become sick again with the same illness.”

If a miracle does not hold, does it count?


10 posted on 07/18/2013 9:59:01 PM PDT by blackpacific
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To: Weiss White

According to the New Testament all Christians are Saints.


11 posted on 07/18/2013 10:24:20 PM PDT by Ecliptic (.)
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To: Ecliptic

What about the Christians who are living in sin? Pornography, Addiction, Adultery?

I don’t think your premise holds true. What do you think?

How can a Christian living in sin be a saint? Even with a small “s”??

And definitely not with a capital “S”


12 posted on 07/18/2013 10:27:25 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: mlo

Your wrong. 42 is the meaning of life. You obviously don ‘t know where your towel is at. Go read some Vogon poetry. ;)


13 posted on 07/18/2013 10:31:13 PM PDT by deputytess (Men of the West .....stand and FIGHT!)
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To: Weiss White

Three, plus Smokey Robinson.


14 posted on 07/18/2013 11:17:20 PM PDT by married21
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To: brent13a

It was a joke. You don’t know it’s the answer to life, the universe, and everything.

:o)


15 posted on 07/19/2013 1:04:02 AM PDT by quilterdebbie (We will endeavor to persevere!)
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To: Ecliptic

Little “s” in this life, the big “S” in the next.


16 posted on 07/19/2013 3:22:11 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Salvation

Got to remember that we are dealing with the “sola scripture” only folks.


17 posted on 07/19/2013 3:26:20 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Salvation

“Please read the links above for history of the canonization process in the Catholic Church.”

Salvation,

Please see Bible for God’s process for sainthood.
Catholic process invalidates God’s process, by transforming it from dependence upon Christ’s work at the cross into a system of human works.

To create a different process other than the one God declares freely is to minimize the death and resurrection of Christ.

I will continue to prefer God’s declaration that every believer in Christ is now a saint - here on earth or departed to be in the presence of God.


18 posted on 07/19/2013 5:06:34 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus)
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To: Biggirl

“Little “s” in this life, the big “S” in the next.”

And yet, God declares no such false division between saints.


19 posted on 07/19/2013 5:07:17 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

To correct you, it is the reality in this life.


20 posted on 07/19/2013 5:11:39 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Salvation

“What about the Christians who are living in sin? Pornography, Addiction, Adultery?”

Either the person had never entrusted themselves to the grace of God via the completed and perfect sacrifice of Christ, or God will bring them to repentance. HE is perfectly capable of this and demonstrates it in the Scriptures.

If the person has never entrusted themselves to Christ, the person is not a saint.

If someone has entrusted themself to Christ, all their sins are covered by His sacrifice - past, present and future - by His blood. The person themselves is crucified with Christ and the old nature has been put to death. Christ’s work covers both the sins and the sinner.

Glory to God for His unspeakable gift!


21 posted on 07/19/2013 5:12:07 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus)
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To: Biggirl

“To correct you, it is the reality in this life.”

Not according to God. How does your opinion stack up against that declared by the God of the Universe?


22 posted on 07/19/2013 5:14:09 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

Do so first by BELIEVING in God/Christ.


23 posted on 07/19/2013 5:14:58 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

Explain please. Thank-you.


24 posted on 07/19/2013 5:18:55 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Biggirl

“Do so first by BELIEVING in God/Christ.”

Made so in time, continued through eternity, all based on the one sacrifice of His Son.

There are rewards in heaven for a faithful life in the Spirit on earth. He declares it so.
The believer’s position of righteousness as a saint never get’s capitalized by God.

Thanks be to God.


25 posted on 07/19/2013 5:19:40 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus)
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To: Biggirl

“Explain please. Thank-you.”

God addresses every Christian as “saint”, holy one, one who is set apart for Him. He does not distinguish between the frailest believer or the saint who now stands in His presence.

You are welcome.


26 posted on 07/19/2013 5:21:04 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus)
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To: Weiss White

Father Guido Sarducci: To be made a saint in-a the catholic church, you have to have-a four miracles. That’s-a the rules, you know. It’s-a always been that-a. Four miracles, and-a to prove it. Well, this-a Mother Seton-now they could only prove-a three miracles. But the Pope-he just waved the fourth one. He just waved it! And do you know why? It’s-a because she was American. It’s all-a politics. We got-a some Italian-a people, they got-a forty, fifty, sixty miracles to their name. They can’t-a get in just cause they say there’s already too many Italian saints, and this woman comes along with-a three lousy miracles. I understand that-a two of them was-a card tricks.


27 posted on 07/19/2013 6:24:58 AM PDT by Einherjar
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

There is more than just the Bible.


28 posted on 07/19/2013 6:33:44 AM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Einherjar

Did you read what the Catholic Church does in the links above?

Somehow I doubt it. What is the source for your statement?


29 posted on 07/19/2013 6:35:10 AM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

You don’t know who Father Guido Sarducci is?

He was a comedian in the 1970s. Not really a priest. Making jokes.


30 posted on 07/19/2013 7:43:22 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: SoothingDave

I’m still trying to find the Pope in the Pizza.


31 posted on 07/19/2013 7:44:22 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Salvation
"There is more than just the Bible."

But there can never be less than the Bible. If it is less, than it is false.

St. Irenaeus of Lyons (+ca.195):

We have learned from none others the plan of our salvation, than from those through whom the gospel has come down to us, which they did at one time proclaim in public, and, at a later period, by the will of God, handed down to us in the Scriptures, to be the ground and pillar of our faith.

(Against Heresies, 3:1.1, in The Ante-Nicene Fathers, Vol. I, p. 414.)

St. Athanasius (c.296-373):

The holy and inspired Scriptures are fully sufficient for the proclamation of the truth.

(Against the Heathen, I:3, quoted in Carl A. Volz, Faith and Practice in the Early Church [Minneapolis: Augsburg Publishing House, 1983], p. 147.)

St. Cyril of Jerusalem (c.310-386):

For concerning the divine and holy mysteries of the Faith, not even a casual statement must be delivered without the Holy Scriptures; nor must we be drawn aside by mere plausibility and artifices of speech. Even to me, who tell you these things, give not absolute credence, unless you receive the proof of the things which I announce from the Divine Scriptures. For this salvation which we believe depends not on ingenious reasoning, but on demonstration of the Holy Scriptures.

(Catechetical Lectures, IV:17, in The Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers [Grand Rapids, Michigan: William B. Eerdmans Publishing Company, 1983 reprint], Second Series, Vol. VII, p. 23.)

St. Gregory of Nyssa (330-395):

...we are not entitled to such license, namely, of affirming whatever we please. For we make Sacred Scripture the rule and the norm of every doctrine. Upon that we are obliged to fix our eyes, and we approve only whatever can be brought into harmony with the intent of these writings.

(On the Soul and the Resurrection, quoted in Jaroslav Pelikan, The Emergence of the Catholic Tradition [Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1971], p. 50.)

St. Gregory of Nyssa:

Let the inspired Scriptures then be our umpire, and the vote of truth will be given to those whose dogmas are found to agree with the Divine words.

(On the Holy Trinity, in The Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, Second Series, Vol. V, p. 327.)

St. Augustine of Hippo (354-430):

Let them show their church if they can, not by the speeches and mumblings of the Africans, not by the councils of their bishops, not by the writings of any of their champions, not by fraudulent signs and wonders, because we have been prepared and made cautious also against these things by the Word of the Lord; but [let them show their church] by a command of the Law, by the predictions of the prophets, by songs from the Psalms, by the words of the Shepherd Himself, by the preaching and labors of the evangelists; that is, by all the canonical authorities of the sacred books.

(On the Unity of the Church, 16, quoted in Martin Chemnitz, Examination of the Council of Trent, Part I [Saint Louis: Concordia Publishing House, 1971], p. 159.)

St. Augustine of Hippo:

What more can I teach you, than what we read in the Apostle? For Holy Scripture sets a rule to our teaching, that we dare not “be wise more than it behooves to be wise,” but be wise, as he says, “unto soberness, according as unto each God has allotted the measure of faith.”

(On the Good of Widowhood, 2, in The Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, First Series, Vol. III, p. 442. The quotation is from Romans 12:3.)

St. John Chrysostom (c.347-407):

Let us not therefore carry about the notions of the many, but examine into the facts. For how is it not absurd that in respect to money, indeed, we do not trust to others, but refer to [our own] calculation; but in calculating upon [theological] facts we are lightly drawn aside by the notions of others; and that too, though we possess an exact balance, and square and rule for all things, the declaration of the divine laws? Wherefore I exhort and entreat you all, disregard what this man and that man thinks about these things, and inquire from the Scriptures all these things; and having learned what are the true riches, let us pursue after them that we may obtain also the eternal good things...

(Homily 13 on 2 Corinthians, in The Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, First Series, Vol. XII, p. 346.)

St. John Chrysostom:

Regarding the things I say, I should supply even the proofs, so I will not seem to rely on my own opinions, but rather, prove them with Scripture, so that the matter will remain certain and steadfast.

(Homily 8 On Repentance and the Church, in The Fathers of the Church, Vol. 96, p. 118.)

St. John Chrysostom:

They say that we are to understand the things concerning Paradise not as they are written but in a different way. But when Scripture wants to teach us something like that, it interprets itself and does not permit the hearer to err. I therefore beg and entreat that we close our eyes to all things and follow the canon of Holy Scripture exactly.

(Homily 13 on Genesis.)

St. John Chrysostom:

There comes a heathen and says, "I wish to become a Christian, but I know not whom to join: there is much fighting and faction among you, much confusion: which doctrine am I to choose?" How shall we answer him? "Each of you" (says he) "asserts, 'I speak the truth.'" No doubt: this is in our favor. For if we told you to be persuaded by arguments, you might well be perplexed: but if we bid you believe the Scriptures, and these are simple and true, the decision is easy for you. If any agree with the Scriptures, he is the Christian; if any fight against them, he is far from this rule.

(Homily 33 on the Acts of the Apostles [NPNF 1, 11:210-11; PG 60.243-44])

St. Basil the Great (c.329-379):

They are charging me with innovation, and base their charge on my confession of three hypostases [persons], and blame me for asserting one Goodness, one Power, one Godhead. In this they are not wide of the truth, for I do so assert. Their complaint is that their custom does not accept this, and that Scripture does not agree. What is my reply? I do not consider it fair that the custom which obtains among them should be regarded as a law and rule of orthodoxy. If custom is to be taken in proof of what is right, then it is certainly competent for me to put forward on my side the custom which obtains here. If they reject this, we are clearly not bound to follow them. Therefore let God-inspired Scripture decide between us; and on whichever side be found doctrines in harmony with the Word of God, in favor of that side will be cast the vote of truth.

(Letter 189 [to Eustathius the physician], 3, in The Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, Second Series, Vol. VIII, p. 229.)

St. Basil the Great:

What is the mark of a faithful soul? To be in these dispositions of full acceptance on the authority of the words of Scripture, not venturing to reject anything nor making additions. For, if “all that is not of faith is sin” as the Apostle says, and “faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word of God,” everything outside Holy Scripture, not being of faith, is sin.

(The Morals, in The Fathers of the Church, Vol. 9, p. 204.)

St. Basil the Great:

We are not content simply because this is the tradition of the Fathers. What is important is that the Fathers followed the meaning of the Scripture.

(On the Holy Spirit, 7:16.)

St. John of Damascus (c.675-c.749):

It is impossible either to say or fully to understand anything about God beyond what has been divinely proclaimed to us, whether told or revealed, by the sacred declarations of the Old and New Testaments.

(On the Orthodox Faith, I:2, in The Fathers of the Church, Vol. 37.)

32 posted on 07/19/2013 8:50:46 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus)
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To: Salvation

AMEN, thank-you.


33 posted on 07/19/2013 10:42:45 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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