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To: daniel1212

To take the parable as a description of actual persons is to nullify both the words of Eccl. 9:5 for The characters of the parable had died.

That general resurrection Jesus spoke of at John 5:28 had not occurred yet so neither Abraham nor Lazarus or any rich man could be speaking after they had died. They would have wait in death in Hades just as David was.(Acts 2:31-34)

Just as Jesus had told Nicodemus (John 3:13) that no man (that would include Abraham and Lazarus) had ascended into heaven except Christ.

The parable of Luke 16 is just that..as a comparison with what is said else where about the resurrection shows.
Certainly the Pharisees viewing themselves as being in a position of favor with “Abraham” is proved false by Jesus’ comment about the kingdom being taken from them.


101 posted on 08/03/2013 10:16:01 AM PDT by count-your-change (you don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough)
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To: count-your-change
Invoking a book that also says that, "There is nothing better for a man, than that he should eat and drink, and that he should make his soul enjoy good in his labour..." (Ecclesiastes 2:24) is a very weak argument against the substantial teaching i provided.

Eccl. 9:5 is judged by the Lord's words as what the fuller revelation teaches as fact. Solomon often speaks according to the natural man, and in 9:5 is is describing the physical state, and later he said, "Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern. Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it. " (Ecclesiastes 12:6-7)

That general resurrection Jesus spoke of at John 5:28 had not occurred yet so neither Abraham nor Lazarus or any rich man could be speaking after they had died...Just as Jesus had told Nicodemus (John 3:13) that no man (that would include Abraham and Lazarus) had ascended into heaven except Christ.

The general resurrection is not relevant here as this was not Heaven, which has no gulf btwn it and Hell, but The Lord said "Abraham's bosom," which OT saints went to as they could not enter glory yet, as described in this recent thread http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3047735/posts?page=348#348

And obviously before the resurrection, Moses and Elijah and were conscious and the so-called "good thief," Stephen, and the souls who were slain for the word of God who inquired about vengeance in Rv. 6, were with the Lord.

Just as Jesus had told Nicodemus (John 3:13) that no man (that would include Abraham and Lazarus) had ascended into heaven except Christ.

Exactly, as dealt with in the link above and a prior one.

107 posted on 08/03/2013 5:51:57 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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