Posted on 10/22/2013 7:38:45 AM PDT by BlatherNaut
I agree, and 95% still do it.
Almost 100% do. to say they don’t is a lie.
Thank you for your comprehensive reply.
You're right that is hypocrisy however please don't conflate all sinful behaviors that way. IOW, the situation you described is indeed one of a hypocritical person, but simply because it's impossible for someone to say "I will sin no more" that doesn't mean that person shouldn't go to Confession.
Indeed, (again) contrary to popular opinion, there isn't a formulaic approach to Confession. Typically the pennitent says certain words and the priest does too, but the only important words are what the Church says the priest must say at the end. The pennitent is actually quite free to confess as he wishes. The "formula" is only a guide for the pennitent. He just needs to be sincere in his Confession (as others have said to you and you already point out)
So specifically, while some authorities say the pennitent should say "I promise (or pledge) to sin no more", as part of their act of Contrition, this phraseology is not required for Absolution. You are perfectly free to say, "I will try to sin no more".
Or, if this is not to your liking, then all one need do is pay attention to the phraseology immediately preceding the recommended phrase of "I promise to sin no more". Before that, not only comes the phrase "I will avoid all occasions of sin", but also, "With thy Grace...", meaning as long as one stays in the grace of God, willing to accept His strength as help, one actually will "sin no more".
But really, don't get too caught up on the words said. What is important is that one GOES to Confession and intend at the TIME, (at least) to not repeat a sin. That's what's important. Not some formulaic prayer.
Are there any Christian groups that accept divorce and remarriage but not birth control within marriage? I wonder also if there are any that accept birth control within marriage but not divorce and remarriage.
FReegards
“Wouldn’t that depend on why the divorce happened?”
No, because the Catholics stick closer to the Biblical definition of marriage, so they do not consider a civil divorce to end the marriage. Someone who is divorced civilly, but who cannot get their marriage annulled by the church, is still seen as married “in the eyes of God”. Therefore, if they remarry, they are committing adultery, so they cannot be in a state of grace fit to receive communion.
Then if confession has become a meaningless joke as you suggest then wouldn't it be better to just drop it completely?
“I guess this made sense at some point, however with today’s no-fault split ups its just unfair.
Why should a man or woman for that matter be denied communion because their cheating, lowdown, backstabbing wife or husband dumped them for someone else?”
Nobody is being denied simply because they are divorced. They are only denied if they divorce and then remarry, without getting an annulment.
I’m in agreement with the Catholics on the no remarriage issue, no matter how easy divorces are to get. God’s standard for our behavior doesn’t change just because the world makes it easier for us to sin.
The Orthodox, from what I understand, allow a second marriage but don't believe in contraception (but I may be wrong on that).
I wonder also if there are any that accept birth control within marriage but not divorce and remarriage.
I'm not aware of any (which doesn't mean none exist :) I have Protestant relatives (Episcopalian, Lutheran) and from what I understand, the main line Protestants allow both divorce and bc.
Truer words were never spoken.
It does explain why the number of people who claim to be conservative never seems to match up with the turnout for elections, though. A good number of "conservatives" are actually nothing but patsies for various hot button issues and as long as the MSM can hit the right button they'll respond.
Many Catholics have. You don’t really believe that when everyone gets up to go to Communion they went to Confession that Saturday do you?
That is one of the problems with letting people like Pelosi get away with being for abortion and still going to communion, when other Catholics see her and Biden and Sebelius getting away unscathed they start doing the same things.
Mind you I am not saying what is right or wrong only what is happening in the real world.
You are a good person and probably a good Catholic.
I also know better than to argue religion, as I am not good at it.
I know myself and priests know that all of these people going to Communion on Sunday are not in a state of grace.
Most of them have not gone to confession in years.If you do not believe me ask your Priest how many showed up last Saturday as compared with how many went to Communion.
I am not trying to sway anyone here I am only saying that many Catholics today are barely catholic, and follow the rules they make for themselves. Such as Birth Control. Probably 90% of Catholic couples practice it, how many confess it , and how many stop using it after leaving confession.
How many Catholics voted for Barrack Obama and then went to confession and confessed voting for abortion. In reality they voted for abortion, but I would bet 99% did not mention that in the confessional.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Enter ye in at the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there are who go in thereat.
Are you back for real I hope?
The alternative is to not defend the principle of the indissolubility of marriage.
The reception of Communion is a public act. It does not occur strictly between the soul and God.
If you confess that you committed adultry and you are consciously trying not to commit adultry (I mean sex, not living together), that is a sin that can be forgiven. This sin will be repeated. The priest knows this. Sins of the flesh are hard to overcome. The priest will in all liklihood tell you to put God before yourself and to start attending Mass more often. In otherwords he will give you some concrete ways to abstain from having sex.
BUT, if you confess you’re shacking up, he will once again tell you this is wrong and what you are doing is committing a conscious act against the teachings of God. Your sin will be forgiven, but if you think you can trot down to the local parish every other week and or month and confess you are still shacking up, I hope it’s not the same priest. He’s gonna tell you right quick you are not contrite and might not absolve you of this sin.
I take the act of reconciliation so serious that if I have forgotten something that I needed to confess I will make an appointment with Father to confess that also. I go to Confession at once a week because I also confess venial sins.
I also do not go up for Communion if I know I need to go to confession. Some Catholics go to confession once a year, if that. I guess I sin more than they do. I want to be right with the Lord when he calls me home and not playing games with him, because He knows every move we make.
It can do no good, and a great deal of harm, to deal in speculation this way. The marriage bond in a valid sacramental marriage is indissoluble until the death of one of the partners. People are supposed to know that before they get married. It's a matter of a vow.
I guess I just don’t follow what this “discussion” is going to be about.
If changing doctrine is not up for grabs, then why meet? Is the Catholic Church doing something wrong to the divorced and remarried? It seems that the mere fact that there needs to be a discussion means it is. So, if it is doing something wrong, what is it? As far as I know it requires an annulment before communion. How is this not merciful? How is this a problem?
Also, parentheses or not, why is a Catholic pope even considering how the Orthodox do things?
To my understanding the Orthodox allow two additional marriages, each more penitent in nature than the last.
I’ve heard different things from Orthodox about bc within marriage. But most seem to think it is OK as long as the spiritual advisor (usually the local priest) agrees with its use. I have no idea if that permission is almost always given or hardly ever given or somewhere in between.
There seems to be some independent/individual Evangelicals that have rejected bc within marriage and divorce and remarriage, but I don’t know of any group that officially rejects both besides Catholics, the Amish and maybe old order Mennonites.
I can’t think of any group that has one but not the other, maybe before 1930, but again I’m not sure.
Freegards
Not only was it changed it was DRASTICALLY changed. It was changed to make it more palpable to non-Catholics/Protestants.
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