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1 posted on 06/04/2014 6:52:46 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: SeekAndFind
If morality is good, then doing the right thing must be its own reward and doing the wrong thing must be its own punishment. To think that a sinner deserves extra, externally imposed suffering presumes that morality isn't good and that those who commit evil deeds benefit from their actions — which is another way of saying that those who do the right thing are fools. The more theologically sound position is to hold that hell is a state of being, whether in this life or the next, in which we confront our own self-imposed alienation from what is truly good — from God, in other words. This educative punishment can be extremely painful, but the pain flows intrinsically from knowledge of our own immoral acts. It isn't inflicted on us by some external tormenter. That, at any rate, was my argument....

....That's right: I think it's likely that if there is an afterlife, everyone — even Judas, even Hitler — eventually ends up in heaven.

This is what happens when you divorce theology from Sola Scriptura. Like liberal Democrat Damon Linker, your thinking takes you anywhere but the place where God has already spoken.

61 posted on 06/04/2014 7:54:27 AM PDT by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
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To: SeekAndFind
Judas is in hell and will be for all eternity. He is a devil. And the lake of fire was prepared for Satan and all his minion to suffer torment forever.

Further, those who reject Jesus Christ and die in their sins will join him there forever ("where the worm dieth not and fires are not quenched.")

Some will try to twist this and similar scriptures and perform all manner of "logic" and creative reinterpreting of words to conclude that once the fuel (the dead) is consumed the fires will end. No verse of scripture is of private interpretation. That is why we use the Bible to clarify itself on this matter. Those tossed in the LOF will suffer ENDLESS torment. We see this from Revelation 14 for those who take the mark of the beast. (BTW this in not their exclusive punishedment, the punishment for all)

9And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name. (Revelation 14:9-11)

And we see that hell is NOT "separation from God" as some teach. The Lamb (Jesus Christ) is there in LOF. We learn from a correctly translated 2 Thessalonians 1:9 that "everlasting destruction" comes "from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his power." The Lord is the source of the destruction.

65 posted on 06/04/2014 8:00:10 AM PDT by nonsporting
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To: SeekAndFind

I would think some people get eternal punishment out of Divine justice. While God’s mercy is without limit God is also just and there are many references in scripture about a Divine judgement when the good will be rewarded and the evil ones punished. I can’t help but to think that Hitler was harshly judged for the evil he did. You also have to consider that Satan is a force of evil who seeks to take souls from God. I believe that the 9/11 hijackers were seduced by Satan and convinced that mass murder was an act of religious piety that would be pleasing to God. I am sure that they found that was not the case.


70 posted on 06/04/2014 8:06:46 AM PDT by The Great RJ
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To: SeekAndFind

Mildred Bailey - When That Man Is Dead And Gone Lyrics

Artist: Mildred Bailey

Satan, Satan thought up a plan
Dressed as a man
Walking the earth and since he began
The world is hell for you and me

But what a heaven it will be
When that man is dead and gone
When that man is dead and gone

We’ll go dancing down the street
Kissing everyone we meet
When that man is dead and gone
What a day to wake up on

What a way to greet the dawn
Hap-hap-happy, yes, indeed
On the morning when we read
That that man is dead and gone

We’ve got a date, to celebrate
The day we catch up with that one man spreading hate
His account is overdrawn
And his chances are in pawn

Some fine day the news will flash
Satan with the small mustache
Is asleep beneath the lawn
When that man is dead and gone

Come on, now, we’re going to celebrate
He’s the guy that’s spreading hate
His account is overdrawn
And his chances are in pawn

Some fine day the news will flash
Satan with the small mustache
Is asleep beneath the lawn
When that man is dead and gone

What a day to wake up on
What a way to greet the dawn!
When a certain man is dead and gone


88 posted on 06/04/2014 8:29:22 AM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Sometimes you need more than seven rounds, Much more.)
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To: SeekAndFind

I believe non-eternal Hell is the Jewish perspective as well.


89 posted on 06/04/2014 8:30:06 AM PDT by martiangohome
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To: SeekAndFind

there are sure a bunch of people here who don’t want the “lake of fire” to be the lake of fire. understandable.


95 posted on 06/04/2014 8:40:55 AM PDT by dadfly
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To: SeekAndFind
The problem with this position is that it seems to be a form of what Friedrich Nietzsche called "Christian malice"

This writer invokes the ideas of an atheist madman as a critic of classical Christian doctrine? Absurd. Another Rob Bell wannabe, apparently.

109 posted on 06/04/2014 9:11:18 AM PDT by SoFloFreeper
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To: SeekAndFind

Judas and Hitler are going to the lake of fire. They never accepted Jesus Christ as Savior. My Bible makes that clear. There is NO other way to the Father. None. There is no purgatory where they can EARN their salvation. NO where in Scripture is there any mention of any such thing. This is all man made up. It is Jesus Christ, WHILE you are alive on this earth, that you must accept. You must do it while you are alive. No one can later on pray you in.


143 posted on 06/04/2014 10:09:05 AM PDT by RetiredArmy (MARANATHA, MARANATHA, Come quickly LORD Jesus!!! Father send thy Son!! Its Time!)
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