The saints in Rev chapter 8 verse 4 are the same ones in chapter 7 (cf Rev 7:14-16), who are the martyred saints who “...are before the throne of God” (verse 15) and they shall “ no longer hunger nor thirst: neither shall the sun fall on them, nor any heat.” (Verse 16). So they are in heaven.
Prediction: you are going to say that the people in 7:14-15 are not the same saints in 8:4 (or elsewhere) because:
1. It doesn’t say they were “saints” in verse 7:14 or...
2. It’s “another chapter” or..
3. The word “heaven” isn’t used in chapter 7, so John isn’t describing heaven until chapter 8 (this would be particularly desperate on your part if you choose this “argument”, because it would ignore the context of Rev 4:1-2) or...
4. Some other made up reason that refuses to see the plain description depicted in the Scripture.
I don’t care what reason you (will) invent to disagree with what I have posted. I absolutely don’t care about any Protestant’s/anti-Catholic’s OPINION of Scripture anymore. So don’t waste your time responding if you disagree.
It will be ignored, because I don’t have time anymore to play the “my opinion of Scripture meaning is better than yours” game all the critics of the Church constantly sucker other hapless Catholics here into playing.
I posted this for the benefit of any reasonable lurker who may be deceived by the claim “there is no evidence the prayers in [Rev 8:4] are the prayers of the saints in heaven.”
They’re still saints in heaven.
Though you will not respond, I will reply anyway, since I think you are misinterpreting or misrepresenting the verses you reference.
You seem to be saying that John is referring to Christians who had been martyred by the time John was on Patmos in his account in the chapters you mention. However, I think most theologians would agree that the chapters in question are John’s description of the events surrounding the Great Tribulation. It is speaking of the four horsemen, the seal judgments, the bowl judgments, etc. Unless you are contending that these have already occurred, I don’t see how your comments line up with the Scriptures you reference.
You are making a BIG stretch here to support your position, one that does not appear to be supported by the text or the context of the passages you quote. But I think most compelling to me and to most non-Catholics is that when Jesus talked of prayer, He always spoke of praying to His Father, not anyone else. If praying to others for assistance was important to our ability to live victorious lives as His disciples, I do not believe He would have left it to be divined by a group of men 300 years after His death and resurrection. I’m sorry, but praying to anyone other than God smacks of idolatry, which is clearly prohibited. Since nothing in the Bible clearly commands us to pray to the dead for help, I will take the Scriptural prohibitions against idolatry and against communing with the dead seriously, and will choose not to pray to anyone other than God. You are free to choose differently.