Posted on 10/29/2016 3:23:42 PM PDT by Maudeen
If you think of Heaven as analogous to God’s home why should he let anyone in His house if they don’t even accept that He exists.
>>> I have a wonderful relative. He wanted to be a priest. Went to seminary and changed — now an agnostic, but a wonderful humanitarian.
>>> My relative goes to hell and they don’t?
If your relative truly gave his life to Jesus, then it doesn’t matter what is going on right now. If his name was ever in the Lamb’s book of life, it will never be removed.
This is a separate issue from what your relative will have to give an account for on current actions or beliefs. He will most likely suffer much loss of reward... but he will still be in heaven.
The sins of Hillary and Bill Clinton have already been paid for, just as the sins of your relative have been paid for.
Receiving that gift is their own choice. How is that not fair?
“They believe in Jesus and go to heaven.”
Belief in Jesus in itself is a necessary condition, but not a sufficient condition to gain entrance to heaven.
For the Jews, according to Jesus (Luke 16), they have the law and the prophets. God's requirements and plan of redemption had already been revealed to them. For everyone else, the existence of God has been abundantly evident in His creation.
The apostle Paul explains all this in Romans chapters 1 & 2.
Implicit salvations, by faith in a Christ who wasn’t yet fully understood by the believer, are testified to in the Old Testament.
With the explicit revelation of Jesus to the world, is that affected — I don’t know. I have met pagans who appear to have been approached by the Holy Spirit and are believing (and even more, displaying in their lives, to an extent that sometimes puts most Christians to shame) things that go beyond their nominal religion. (Karma based religions have no concept of grace.) Perhaps they are destined to later believe on Christ if they haven’t somehow done so already.
Some are making the assumption that because they haven’t heard about missionaries sent to these isolated peoples, those cultures don’t know how to be saved and will be sent to hell.
Read “Eternity in their Hearts” by Don Richardson, where he describes missionaries who HAVE gone to these cultures, only to learn that they DO know about a God trying to save them.
Or, reports about Muslim converts to Christianity show that about 1/3 have done so because Jesus appeared to them in a vision or dream.
In your opinion, are all the righteous Jews of the Old testament inhell, ad a result of NOT believing in Jesus Christ
?
Sincere question.
How about all the little baby boys murdered in Bethlehem by Herod?
Remember, your relative can repent on his deathbed, as well.
There seem to be hints in the bible about the Lord reaching out in search of believers who will reach back. The question may be ill posed. Not whether all salvation is worked through Christ (this is a biblical sine qua non), but whether all people who meet Christ and believe will do so as a result of what we usually know as the Christian church.
Thanks, but even if that’s the right take it only covers God’s interaction will OT Jews - who were only a small minority of humans during the time (before Christ) in question.
Sin. It must be dealt with. We all are sinners.
The Holy God and Creator does not allow sin in his presence.
Jesus Christ gave his perfect and sinless human life as an offering, and as a willing substitute for the rejection and wrath that we are due, and his sacrifice is sufficient to save any sinner who will acknowledge it.
Any righteous acts a human does is not pertinent to whether one goes to heaven. Apart from Jesus’s work, on our own, all of our righteous deeds and good works are like we are clothed with filthy rags; they are not sufficient to hide or reduce our sinfulness. Therefore if we reject the redeemer, we retain our sin, and cannot enter into God’s presence.
Good works cannot get us into heaven; neither saint nor sinner.
He is not the “Jewish/Christian” God.
He is God.
He chose the Jews for a special purpose, which they have fulfilled and are still fulfilling to this day.
Jesus and all the first believers were Jews.
You could think of Biblical Jews as pre-Messianic, and Biblical Christians as post-Messianic.
Everyone is saved the same way: faith in the Messiah to come (Old Testament) or faith in the Messiah who came and is coming again (New Testament).
He made the Gospel so simple, even a child could understand it, and that by design.
You don’t have to give up anything. Simply acknowledge Him for who He is, accept Him as Messiah, and He will transform your life. For some it’s dramatic and sudden. For others, it’s a process over time.
My personal experience was that He cleaned up my speech and my behavior almost immediately. Since being baptized, I have not had, nor desired, an alcoholic drink or a recreational drug, and have not had any sexual relations outside of my marriage.
There are many other matters that are being cleaned up more slowly; my patience with others, my diligence with the finances He so graciously provides me.
Two things I can recommend for you, if you have any interest at all.
First is a dramatization series of people who have been through the ringer and have had their lives completely transformed by faith in Jesus Christ.
https://unshackled.org/listen/browse-all-programs/
Second is J. Vernon McGee, an old-time preacher with a distinct voice and accent. Though he has since left this plane, his messages are as relevant and poignant as ever. He conducts a 5 year Bible Study program that has led many thousands to the bosom of Jesus over the years.
http://www.ttb.org/programs/the-5-year-study
The question may be ill posed.
Nobody in humanity, save for Christ who independently became man, is innocent — due to joint spiritual participation in the fall of mankind.
That said, we have assurances such as “The Lord does not willingly grieve the sons of men.” The dear evangelical pastor of the bible church I used to go to put it this way — if a soul would be willing, the Lord will arrange for a witness somehow.
The question for the believing Christian is, not to worry about people going to hell in the collective (which is vain) but will you be willing to be such a witness (which is NOT vain).
“For everyone else, the existence of God has been abundantly evident in His creation.
The apostle Paul explains all this in Romans chapters 1 & 2.”
==
So, accepting the existence of a generic creator God is what keeps them out of hell?
But, we do know, if you read the Bible. There was a place where the righteous went - read the story of the rich man and Lazarus. When Jesus arose from the dead, the graves were opened and those who had died before Jesus’s resurrection came forth out of their graves. I believe that is in Matthew 24th chapter. So, yes, there was a holding place for those in the Old Testament.
Faith in the gracious Savior aspect of the Lord is needed to head off going to hell.
Hell is a place where human souls, under the perpetual thrall of Satan and the demons, fight vainly against God forever. Sin reveals the risk of entering such a fate. Grace reveals the way of escaping such a fate.
One might think that believing in a gracious Savior is easy. It isn’t, and that’s because we’ve all inherited pride from the fall of mankind. Pride? In a fall? Isn’t that foolish? Well yes it is. But that’s where we are.
Not at all.
Please read this.
http://freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3486544/posts?page=32#32
Also, read the book of Romans written by Saul of Tarsus, in his own words, “a Hebrew of the Hebrews”, taught at the feet of Gamelial, a persecutor of the Christians, who met Jesus on the way to Damascus.
You can read that story in the Book of Acts chapter 9.
Also, if you were ever curious about why the pre-communist Ethiopia was Christian but had the Magen David as their national emblem, read the story of the Ethiopian Eunuch in Acts chapter 8 starting at verse 26.
If your relative truly gave his life to Jesus, then it doesn’t matter what is going on right now. If his name was ever in the Lamb’s book of life, it will never be removed.
Sorry, to disappoint you, but this isn’t Scriptural.
Sorry to disappoint your fallen pride, but it IS scriptural.
Thanks, good answer.
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