Posted on 08/22/2019 10:35:35 PM PDT by OddLane
To quote Thomas Paine “God reveals himself in the creation we behold”.
In other words the complexity of the universe makes it evident there is an intelligent creator, we see no direct evidence that the creator intervenes in the affairs of man. Bible doesn’t count because it is only hearsay not direct evidence.
Perhaps the creator did write the rules in our heart as we see the in the empathy we naturally feel for those in pain.
Sorry for the double post. Posting from phone and had driven to another location and it looked like I hadn’t posted yet.
Moral based on who’s standards? Apart from a transcendent God there is no basis for objective morality. There would only be personal preference and social convention. If there is no God then nothing is objectively “wrong”
There is a valid reason.
Faith, not reason, brought you to Christianity; therefore no atheist can reason you out of Christianity.
You accepted Jesus on faith, not reason. Atheists also have their position on faith. This must be correct because neither the believer nor non-believer can prove or disprove a creator; both positions are a result of faith.
Wrong. No one in Scripture believed in a creator and continued apart from a degree of evidential warrant, from pagans to Moses to Peter.
This must be correct because neither the believer nor non-believer can prove or disprove a creator; both positions are a result of faith.
"Prove" is one thing, and evidential warrant to take a step of faith is another. You (presuming you are a normal male) do not marry a women based upon blind faith,nor because you know for sure that she will be the Right One, but take a qualified step of faith in marrying her based upon a degree of evidence which warrants this faith.
The atheist typically seems to not want to believe in an ultimate moral judge, even as a hypotheses, and thus explains all evidence away, sometimes while allowing for suchexplanations as the space-seed hypotheses.
Hemant Mehta ("the Friendly Atheist" stated in response to to the query, “What would it take for you to believe in God?,”
“I guess, simply put, I would need to see a miracle. I need evidence for God, and maybe that would come in the form of a miracle that has no possible explanation in the natural world.” - https://www.str.org/blog/why-evidence-will-not-convince-some-atheists
Yet as has been shown, it seems there is nothing that they will attribute to naturalistic causes, from the source of energy to all testimonies of miracles, thus implicitly ascribing powers of deity to matter. -
To quote Paine again this is what I mean about the Bible being hearsay.
“When also I am told that a woman called the Virgin Mary, said, or gave out, that she was with child without any cohabitation with a man, and that her betrothed husband, Joseph, said that an angel told him so, I have a right to believe them or not; such a circumstance required a much stronger evidence than their bare word for it; but we have not even this — for neither Joseph nor Mary wrote any such matter themselves; it is only reported by others that they said so — it is hearsay upon hearsay, and I do not choose to rest my belief upon such evidence.”
None of the Gospels where written by actual witnesses to the events but they relied on hand me down stories so it is hearsay upon hearsay.
Going to the Old Testament biblical scholars have determined that much of it was written 700 years after the alleged facts.
How can a person present something as being fact that they have no direct knowledge of?
There were many contemporary accounts of the Revolutionary war. None for the events of the life of Jesus.
Quite the smorgasbord, while there are variant types of atheists. Those on this officially "pro-God" forum apparently share many conservative values that evangelicals and TradCaths do, yet whom we debate, but at least the latter two have their respective transcendent supreme moral sources by which they can be judged, despite a degree of interpretation being allowed. Not so with atheists.
Great point. Even the Apostle points out that roots of atheism are always moral not intellectual.
bump
Atheists BELIEVE there is NO god.
Agnostics ain't sure.
So did all my kids and grandkids.
It didn't work out very well.
Yup; everyone sure has inherited Adam’s nature all right!
Wait until Winston and the rest of his crew at The Ministry of Truth get done.
The RW will vanish like the Holocaust is doing.
“But; are they sinless?‘
Are all Christians sinless?
We are all human and make mistakes, but it doesn’t follow that we need religion to learn and improve.
And just what principle of Judeo/Christianity lead to the abolition of slavery?
Don't you think "do unto others" is a principle that would apply to abolition?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.