Do babies go to Heaven?

[PFKEY]

Hope no one minds the vanity too much.

I was thinking last night about this idea and was trying to make it jive somewhat with the notion of predeterminationalism if that is the correct word.

Also was curious regarding what the various Christian denominations taught on this subject.

[RnMomof7]

Put down the Teqiuza. Put down the Teqiuza. You obviously need two hands to type.

LOL LOL........Happy New Year Wrigley

[xzins]

amish....electricity...business...hypocrisy

I agree unless someone can explain the distinctions clearly.

We had a local woodworker (amish) explain that the issue is "avoiding those things that injure 'community.'" Phones in their homes would enable them to avoid the neighbors. Cars would enable them to avoid their neighbors. Home computers would enable....etc., etc.

I'm not sure how electricity contributes to their injuring community. Electrical heat is bad; propane heat is good. It's obvious that the propane system was made in a technologically modern system and they purchased it.

Happy New Year, Rn. How deep is the snow?

[the_doc]

I guess you and I will wind up exactly splitting the write-in vote.

[Wrigley]

Same to you. Happy New Years.

[restornu]

PSALM 58 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

Is this not a frustraiton of David that he utters in his pray to the Lord?

David reproves wicked judges—They go astray and speak lies. To the chief Musician, Al-taschith, Michtam of David.

OP I think you are taking liberty with this!

[Jael]

Wrong again. Those Landmarkist are just about as fruity as you can get.

[Jael]

I follow no man made creeds. Those are silly.

[xzins]

Second guess is syriac. Am I warmer or colder?

(Is it bigger than a bread box? Animal, vegetable, mineral?) LOL. :>)

[Jael]

I worked for Keyes. I didn't vote for Keyes.

[Jael]

A lot of people post from scripture, from different back grounds with different interruptions of the scripture. Not all of them can be right, someone has to be wrong.

I was told you people believe that no one can come to Christ unless he is drawn. Ok. I posted the words of Jesus Christ saying he will draw all men to him. Now, the problem is yours. All of you ignored that whole post.

Either Jesus didn't mean what he said, or you all are just ignoring plain Bible truth.

That makes your position as a Calvinist, a follower of a man, much more troublesome than the position of a follower of Jesus Christ.

[Jael]

I don't take people like you seriously. You are so misguided you stay in an apostate church which ordains women and sodomites? You have nothing to teach me. You don't have enough discenment to see that ALL of the man made churches that came out of Rome have nothing to show for themselves today except a slavish devotion to the trappings of Rome without the name.

As I said, if you are saying that the only true church was Rome, then you call Christ a liar. If you are half as smart as you like to pretend you are, you would know Rome was not ever a true church.

That leaves it to be fully known that the Body of Christ existed outside of Rome. Independent of Rome. Never a part of Rome.

Which also leads us to the logical conclusion that the daughters of Rome are no better than their mother. They are of her, they came from her, they continue many of her dead works.

God's church never failed, and she certainly wasn't born of a whore in Rome.

[Jael]

Every Calvinist on this form agrees with every scripture that speaks of the necessity to believe..

That isn't true. You have had people here saying (two different ones) that only chosen babies are in Heaven. Those babies didn't believe. You know it.

That just like Catholics saying something besides faith has a saving efficacy.

2 Thessalonians 1:7
 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8  In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

9  Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

If God forces people to believe in him, and gives them no choice at all, why does He tell us that some do not obey the Gospel?

Why is he taking vengeance upon those He supposedly FORCED to disobey???

[Jael]

I am a Christian. I believe that God's word is the final authority in all matters of faith and practice.

Denominations are for the birds. No one ever got saved by being any man made label.

[xzins]

Do you mean "CoC" Christian...do you go to a Church of Christ or Christian Church type of church?

[Jael]

I'ld vote for some one that could take on the Democratics.

Take on the Democrats HOW? Like Bush has? Ha ha ha. He is no better. He is getting a free ride to take away personal freedoms because people who don't think for themselves think a Republican is not dangerous.

[Jael]

cannot even understand the things of the Spirit (I Cor 2).

Do you even know what "the things of the Spirit are"?

1 Corinthians 2:8  Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

9  But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

10  But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

Of course an unsaved person is not going to know the things God has prepared for us. That in no way means that an unsaved person will not be drawn by Jesus Christ, repent and believe.

John 12:32  And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

All men are drawn. Not all men obey the Gospel. Else Christ would not take vengeance upon them.

2 Thessalonians 1:7  And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8  In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

9  Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;<p. 10  When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

[Jael]

To say that he absolutely doesn't understand the Created world would be false.

In regards to what Paul says in Romans 1, or course a newborn does not have that ability or capacity to understand what someone who observes creation has.

The wrath of God because of unrighteousness is not something an infant could comprehend at all, because God has not shown that to them.
Any infant doesn't hold the truth in unrighteousness.

18  For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19  ¶Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20  For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse

Romans 3:20  Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Romans 5:13  (For until the law sin was in the world:

but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

Romans 7:7  ¶What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid.
Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law:
for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

[peter the great]

A few years back, I converted to God having been Baptized in the Orthodox Church as an infant. This more or less means that I started going to confession, receiving communion and practicing the faith. Interestingly enough a dear friend who I worked with played a big role in bringing this about. However, during our many conversations remember hearing a story about a woman who had lost a little child a very young boy, who was hit by a car. The mother shortly thereafter was a basket case, which was understandable, she went into the Church to speak with the Priest, screaming and crying uncontrollably asking God why and how could he let something like this happen. What happened next is that she had a vision. The vision was of when the Child was older, he would have been a drunk and would have lost his soul. So God took him when he was young. To answer your question, "Do babies go to heaven?." My answer is yes. Which further qualified by the teachings of the Church. Finally, there is an excellent book that you may want to read it is "The Soul After Death," by Seraphim Rose hopefully that book will clear up a lot of questions in this area.

[Jael]

Do you mean "CoC" Christian

No, I doubt those Cambellites are even saved. I have never met one I thought might be. They trust the dead works of the Water Company to save them.(Baptism)

I beleieve in salvation by grace, through faith, purchased by Christ alone, through the shedding of his blood.

7  ¶Then said I, Lo, I come
(in the volume of the book it is written of me,)
to do thy will, O God.
~Jesus

If you needed a label for me, I guess you could use Berean, although I don't know of a denomination called that.

Acts 17:10  ¶And the brethren immediately sent away Paul and Silas by night unto Berea: who coming thither went into the synagogue of the Jews.

11  These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

12  Therefore many of them believed; also of honourable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few.

[Jael]

my #178 That is, my #183 in response to #178. *grin*

I will credit your lack of sensical posting last night to the drinking.

Proverbs 20:1  ¶Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.