Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

At Christ's Tomb, an Angry Mob
Salt Lake Tribune ^ | April 27, 2003 | Peter Hermann

Posted on 04/28/2003 9:51:39 AM PDT by NYer

JERUSALEM -- With a raucous crowd jammed shoulder to shoulder Saturday inside the fortresslike Church of the Holy Sepulchre, a parade of Greek and Armenian Orthodox clergy slowly walked to the tomb of Jesus Christ.
    And that's where the trouble began.
    Priests from the competing sects shoved each other as part of an ancient dispute over who would emerge first with the flame they believe miraculously descends from heaven during the Easter Ceremony of the Holy Fire, celebrated this weekend by the Eastern Orthodox.
    Israeli riot police quelled the small disturbance, which last year erupted in fistfights between Greek and Armenian priests and worshippers and had threatened to explode in violence again Saturday.
    Neither side could come to terms, but the priests did promise to avoid coming to blows after Israeli officials threatened to limit the number of participants to just a few hundred. In the end, police let 6,000 into the stone church built on the spot where it is believed Jesus was buried after his crucifixion.
    Inside, police carrying clubs and guns set up metal barricades to segregate the crowds, which surged forward to touch or photograph the patriarchs and their entourages as they walked three times around the tomb.
    Young Greek and Armenian men climbed onto each others' shoulders, flew flags, beat drums and shouted at each other in biblical verse as armed Jewish police stood between them inside Christianity's holiest shrine.
    The only fracas occurred at the tomb's entrance as the two patriarchs entered the tomb and retrieved the fire. Then, as centuries of protocol dictates, the Greek patriarch emerged first with the flame.
    He raced toward the exit as throngs of frenzied worshippers mobbed him and dipped their candles into the scared fire, which quickly was spread to thousands of candles. Foot-high flames leaped into the air, filling the church with smoke and singing hair and garments amid a deafening sound of church bells and screams of joy.
    Police with small canisters sprayed water over the crowd to control the burning.
    The Easter dispute is just part of the daily friction that governs this church, first erected in the fourth century by the Byzantine Emperor Constantine and rebuilt by the Crusaders in the 11th century. Six Christian sects live in a labyrinth of stacked rooms and darkened grottoes, jealously guarding everything from Mass times to who can clean what, under the belief that merely sweeping a hallway establishes ownership.
    Last summer, Ethiopian and Egyptian monks brawled after one moved a chair to a shady spot on the roof, threatening another's domain and requiring Israeli police to stand guard each time members of the two groups wanted to sit in the same place.
    The latest argument centers on who can come out of the tomb first with the fire. The document laying down the status quo, which dictates protocol, says the Greek patriarch is always first. But the Armenians have been demanding an equal role during the past several years.
    With both sides threatening violence, Israeli authorities tried to mediate, with Natan Sharansky, a Cabinet minister in charge of Jerusalem affairs, leading the way. "As the local authority, we have the right to impose an agreement," he told Israeli Radio last week. "But I don't think it's right for the Jewish state to do so."
    Sharansky said that violence could be deadly with a large crowed packed into an ancient building that has only one exit, especially when everyone is carrying lighted candles and passing them in what can best be described as a mob scene.
   


TOPICS: Activism; Apologetics; Catholic; Current Events; General Discusssion; History; Mainline Protestant; Orthodox Christian; Prayer; Religion & Culture; Worship
KEYWORDS: armenian; easter; greek; holysepulchre; orthodox
And I thought these problems only existed in the Religion Forum on FreeRepublic.
1 posted on 04/28/2003 9:51:39 AM PDT by NYer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Siobhan; american colleen; sinkspur; livius; Lady In Blue; Salvation; Polycarp; narses; ...

A Orthodox Christian pilgrim kisses part of the rock, which is traditionally believed to be the rock which was used to seal Christ's tomb, in the Holy Sepulchre Church during Orthodox Easter Sunday, April 27, 2003. Worshippers visited the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem's Old City which Christian faithful believe is built on the site of Jesus' last resting place after his body was removed from the cross. REUTERS/Gil Cohen Magen


Greek Orthodox priests bless worshippers on Orthodox Easter Sunday at the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem Sunday April 27, 2003. (AP Photo/John McConnico)


A ray of light hits what is traditionally believed to be the tomb of Jesus Christ as an Armenian priest passes Saturday, April 26, 2003 at the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem during the Holy Fire ceremony. The ceremony is meant to assure the worshippers that Jesus has not forgotten them and is sending a message of hope through the fire. (AP Photo/Ricardo Mazalan)

2 posted on 04/28/2003 9:57:13 AM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum Alleluia)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NYer
And I thought these problems only existed in the Religion Forum on FreeRepublic.

ROTFL!

3 posted on 04/28/2003 10:00:56 AM PDT by Alex Murphy (Athanasius contra mundum!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NYer
There's a lot to be said for the Western observance of Easter being on a different day. We don't need the Franciscans to be part of this ongoing public scandal.
4 posted on 04/28/2003 10:05:33 AM PDT by eastsider
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: eastsider
There's a lot to be said for the Western observance of Easter being on a different day. We don't need the Franciscans to be part of this ongoing public scandal. 4 posted on 04/28/2003 10:05 AM PDT by eastsider

LOL! You mean the fundamentalist Baptists and SSPX aren't in there fighting over the holy smoke as well?

5 posted on 04/28/2003 10:17:24 AM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: NYer
Priests from the competing sects shoved each other as part of an ancient dispute over who would emerge first with the flame they believe miraculously descends from heaven during the Easter Ceremony of the Holy Fire, celebrated this weekend by the Eastern Orthodox.
Israeli riot police quelled the small disturbance, which last year erupted in fistfights between Greek and Armenian priests and worshippers and had threatened to explode in violence again Saturday.

You have to wonder about a ceremony that generates this kind of spiritual fruit....

6 posted on 04/28/2003 10:20:43 AM PDT by DouglasKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC
You have to wonder about a ceremony that generates this kind of spiritual fruit....

Took the words right outta my mouth. Make sure you wash your hands afterwards, okay?

What strikes me is that being first to grab this "fire" seems all-important to them, at least for this one day. What does the fire do for them afterwards? Is anyone else reminded of the pool of Bethesda in John 5? "Sir, I have no man to put me into the pool when the water is stirred up, but while I am coming, another steps down before me."

7 posted on 04/28/2003 10:34:17 AM PDT by Alex Murphy (Athanasius contra mundum!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
The SSPXers are too busy fighting over control of the Vatican, and the literalists are too busy fighting over control of the Bible. : )
8 posted on 04/28/2003 10:35:12 AM PDT by eastsider
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC; Alex Murphy; eastsider
You have to wonder about a ceremony that generates this kind of spiritual fruit....

Now, now ... they all seem to be getting along in this photo.

LOL - I would love to substitute freeper names in this thread. It would be so much fun to rewrite this story from the perspective of forum members who are familiar to us all.

9 posted on 04/28/2003 10:38:45 AM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum - Alleluia)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: NYer
See that guy second-in-line? That's me. I'm the one looking off instead of reading from the script! LOL
10 posted on 04/28/2003 10:41:23 AM PDT by Alex Murphy (Athanasius contra mundum!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: eastsider
I don't suppose a Vatican council of progressive, orthodox, and neo-modernist bishops would solve the problem. Maybe Henry Kissinger or Koffi Annan would have a few ideas.

Well, at least Rembert Weakland is not in charge of the Church of the Holy Sepulchre. He would want to renovate, of course. Or the American Jesuits. They would remove all the sacred art, add garish shag carpeting, and turn it into a "multi-purpose room." For "multicultural" students, of course. One wonders....Does "Call to Action" ever "act up" in any of the holy sites in the Holy Land?

11 posted on 04/28/2003 10:44:02 AM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy
What strikes me is that being first to grab this "fire" seems all-important to them, at least for this one day. What does the fire do for them afterwards?

The ceremony is meant to assure the worshippers that Jesus has not forgotten them and is sending a message of hope through the fire.

Is anyone else reminded of the pool of Bethesda in John 5? "Sir, I have no man to put me into the pool when the water is stirred up, but while I am coming, another steps down before me."

Love that story! Have used it many times with Confirmation students in a guided meditation.

12 posted on 04/28/2003 10:46:45 AM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum - Alleluia)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: NYer
And I thought these problems only existed in the Religion Forum on FreeRepublic.

Very, very funny! :-)

I dunno, I thought He said "and the first shall be last and the last shall be first" --- you think they'd be fighting for last place, but human nature being what it is and all...

I just thought of the jockeying of some of the AmChurch bishops... sorta the same except for the fisticuffs.

13 posted on 04/28/2003 10:49:26 AM PDT by american colleen
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
I'm surprised there's not another fight over who gets to rise from the tomb first -- Osama or Saddam.
14 posted on 04/28/2003 10:55:31 AM PDT by eastsider
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: eastsider; american colleen; NYer
Well, it could be much worse. Instead of a Christian church and shrine there...there could be a mosque. Or an apartment building or secularized university. Or a wreckovated parish church.
15 posted on 04/28/2003 11:01:54 AM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: american colleen
you think they'd be fighting for last place

To a certain extent, they are. A little more than 1,000 people were allowed to attend the ceremony this year instead of the usual 10,000 because of squabbling between different denominations. Let mayhem reign!

16 posted on 04/28/2003 11:03:38 AM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum - Alleluia)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: NYer
Why not settle the issue with a coin toss? Or better yet, alternate years, letting the Armenians be first next year.

It would make a great seminary "ecumenism" seminar topic - "Just whose Holy Fire is it anyway?"

17 posted on 04/28/2003 11:13:46 AM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: NYer
"Why seek ye the living among the dead?"
18 posted on 04/28/2003 11:45:35 AM PDT by Freedom'sWorthIt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
LOL! Anyway the whole thing is a misunderstanding. These people are Zorastrians (the ancient Middle Eastern religion of fire worshippers). They got hammered by the Muslims back in the olden days, so they retreated to a building in Jerusalem and held annual interesting fire worshipping displays ...
19 posted on 04/28/2003 6:06:36 PM PDT by BlackVeil
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy; NYer
And I thought these problems only existed in the Religion Forum on FreeRepublic.

ROTFL!


Me too!
20 posted on 04/28/2003 11:04:00 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Salvation; NYer

I'm not entirely sure I believe the fistfights were as bad as the article says, based on the picture above. But, if they were, could you imagine this same picture, only with these guys sporting bruises, cuts, and black eyes, and their robes now torn and bloody?

21 posted on 04/29/2003 6:07:25 AM PDT by Alex Murphy (Athanasius contra mundum!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy
With the way things have been heading lately, it seems almost inevitable that the crass boneheads behind "Reality TV" will eventually present religious wrestling. "Are you ready to... RRRRRRRRUMBLE?"

It might be therapeutic actually to see, say, William Donohue and Barry Lynn or Jerry Falwell and Ted Turner duke it out in a ring. Governor Ventura has already carved out his own role for Christian bashing. Might not be that far of a stretch for him.

It's too bad Stephen Jay Gould wussed out and died because personally, as far as such campy kitsch circuses go, I would have liked to have seen him do a little WWF Fu with the "Church Lady" (of SNL fame).

22 posted on 04/29/2003 10:45:52 AM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: BlackVeil; Alex Murphy
A sort of cross between Survivor and one of those backwoods paintball derbies with militia enthusiasts in camouflage fatigues might be the right model. They could put all of the religious and anti-religious zanies on one deserted island and have at it. Geraldo or maybe Jerry Springer would be the ideal host. You could have Usama bin-Laden and a select Ivy League secular humanist, like maybe Allen Dershowitz, for the season finale. The winner would be awarded an all-expenses paid trip to Disneyworld or Vegas naturally.
23 posted on 04/29/2003 10:59:01 AM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
"Just whose Holy Fire is it anyway?"

Thanks, This made me laugh out loud. (and everyone is looking at me weird)

24 posted on 04/29/2003 11:14:44 AM PDT by american colleen
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: american colleen
Just imagine our own AmChurch "spirit of Vatican II" version of this, say, the "Call to Action" people. Heavy-set ex-nun lectors and eucharistic ministers wrestling over who gets to hold the Holy Fire first. Frances Kissling or Maureen Fiedler would be the ideal candidates for first "women" Holy Fire acolytes. They would figure out a way to integrate liturgical dancing into this somehow. But the ceremony would have to be offered on behalf of social justice or some immediately and socially relevant trendy issue. The flame representing "world peace" and disarmament, preferably under the United Nations or the Committee of Concerned Scientists.
25 posted on 04/29/2003 11:26:52 AM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: NYer
I am atheist.
I study miracles.
About Holy fire.http://www.krtdiv.narod.ru/en.01.htm
In Russian http://www.krtdiv.narod.ru/book1/1book0.htm
I am sorri. I write through the translator. I speak only on Russian.
But I can transfer your answers.

and

http://www.holyfire.org/eng/doc_Guardian2001.htm
"It's not a miracle. The Greek priests bring in a lamp - one that has been kept burning for 1,500 years - to produce the Holy Fire."
26 posted on 09/23/2003 10:47:04 PM PDT by Krot
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson