My friend is seriously considering suicide. Is it ALWAYS wrong?

may 31, 2003 | tame

[tame]

I have a friend who is very seriously considering suicide. This friend is not interested in pity, but rather truly believes that a greater good could be served by his "withdrawel" from this life. He is almost "clinical" in his consideration of the decision.

While he believes suicide is morally wrong in many circumstances, he believes that it is the optimal moral choice in rare circumstances such as his. He is a Christian and he believes he has brought too much shame to his church, God, and his family to the point that less shame would be brought on God's kingdom if he simply "checked out".

His principle for this greater good of suicide is drawn from 1 Corinthians chapter 5 where Paul indicated it was better for a certain man to be handed over to Satan that his flesh may be destroyed but his soul saved in the day of judgement.

Now, I realize the immediate outcry most of you will voice against suicide, but on further contemplation is suicide always wrong without exception? What say you?

[tame]

Please don't shoot from the hip with emotional answers, but think of his theological basis, and then share your thoughts.

[tame]

Any insight on this?

[tame]

How do you feel about this?

[drstevej]

Doesn't seem like your friend is thinking rationally so a logical, theological resonse to him may fall on deaf ears.

Thou shall not kill is both clear and applicable to him. 1 Corinthians 5 delivers the person to Satan not himself. Satancide and suicide are not the same except in a mind bent on rationalization.

Get your friend to competent medical and spiritual help. Use whatever leverage of friendship and relationship you have. You may not be successful but it is clearly worth the effort. Offer to go with the person or take the person.

Am praying for you both.

[Conservative til I die]

Suicide is always a moral wrong. Unless you stretch the definition of suicide, such as say laying down your life for a friend in some way. But killing yourself for a reason like "I'd be better off dead" or "The world would be better without me" is as far from moral as you can get.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

If your friend is a Christian, he must believe that sunny days, children's laughter, good health and love are all gifts from almighty God.

Your friend should also recognize that suffering, remorse and regret are also from God.

We were created for His glory; not our own. If it pleases God to have us stumble openly, with all the attendant shame and hurt, then it is because God wants to use us as an example of His power to stand up again and be healed by His love.

Your friend should know he has only two choices -- obey God and live, or deny God and die, eternally lost.

[MHGinTN]

I will refrain from offering my 'theological' perspective, but I would share with your friend that suicide will end the relationship you have with your friend and that is a tragedy for you (that your friend might want to consider if really a friend) and that a life being lived is so much more than we first perceive or choose to perceive when in a selfish shell (and that is what is necessary for even a mentally ill person to commit suicide). If it were my friend, I would plead with them on the grounds of our friendship and the diminshment I will suffer as I remain alive missing my friend, whereas the friend has gone away purposely, ending our friendship with their selfish act. But know this, suicide is not a rational behavior, and loneliness can occur even in a crowded environment. Be closer to your friend, if you can, to ride this out to the other side of this depression.

[Conservative til I die]

Also, let me add that your friend gives the reason that he feels he's brought shame to God and His Church. Well, theologically speaking, this totally ignores the idea of redemption in Christianity. I dunno if it's just a Catholic idea, with Confession and Last Rites and all, but seriously, if you read the New Testament you see quite a few examples of people who brought shame to themselves, God, and the Church who were redeemed. St. Mary Magdalene, St. Peter, St. Paul and St. Matthew are just four I can think of off the top of my head.

[John_burchett]

I corinthians 5 is about how to deal with scandelous sin in t he church. The "handing over to Satan", I think, refers to explusion of the sinner from said church to both preserve the church's integrity as Christ's body in the eyes of the world, and to serve the good of the offending member by illustrating in human terms the certain separation God's holiness [expressed in His church] has from sin. BUT, that said, the purpose of this separation is not to produce dispair [esp. to the extent of suicide] on the part of the sinner, but to produce sorrow leading to repentence [2 Cor 2:5-11].

2 Cor 4:7-15 -- it discribes the believer's fight with sin just as much as his fight with the world; hard-pressed by temptation, perplexed by our remaining corruption, persecuted by guilt, struck down by failure, but not losing heart. "For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, is working for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory".

I've gone on too long, hope I was helpful. in Him,-john

[Thinkin' Gal]

to the point that less shame would be brought on God's kingdom himself if he simply "checked out".

Now, he can choose to be a coward, or face life like a man. Does he want to risk finding out that God isn't going to fall for his lame pity plea if he chooses to simply "check out"? It's a one-way ticket, after all. He should choose wisely and let God decide how he should live this life. If lightening strikes, so be it. He needs to get off his narcissistic soapbox instead of rationalizing irresponsible behavior.

His life may stink and he's ashamed for some bad behavior, but at least he knows what he's got. Is he sure that when he "checks out", God will "understand" like your average liberal? Or will he get a view of say, all the grieving people he's left behind (he'd be surprised), with no way to make amends, with nothing but a one-way ticket to the outer darkness for being such a selfish moron?

If he's as "clinical" as you say, he needs to do some serious risk-assessment here. He can start this way: instead of reading Scripture in order to justify suicide, he should read it plainly without a preconceived agenda, to see what God wants to say to him.

[Japedo]

He is a Christian and he believes he has brought too much shame to his church, God, and his family to the point that less shame would be brought on God's kingdom if he simply "checked out".

First let me stress that I pray for Peace of mind to your Friend.

secondly, What sin could G-d possibly not forgive? What is "shame" exactly? embarrassment? guilt? broken Pride? I believe all of us have Tests so to say. I don't believe it possible that we are always suppose to "pass" tests, but more so figure how to deal with when we fail. Sometimes I believe people rely upon to much on their "religion" and doctrine instead of their personal walk with G-d. It matters not what any man say's or thinks but what's more the condition of ones heart and humbleness to G-d.

I say this, G-d does give us "free choice" it is up to us to walk sometimes the almost impossible road to take responsibility and face the consequences, to accept our wrong doings and with G-ds love and guidance to fix it. In my opinion I believe that suicide is the easy way out. There is no justification due to shame. G-d gave one the Gift of life, it is up to him when our time is up.

This being said, I do not believe that G-d will give us more then we can handle.

[restornu]

Life is a Gift!

There is a purpose for each of us being here!

Conscience is from God!

Despair is from the Devil!

From the time we are born which bring joy to those around and like in the Movie "Its A Wonderful Life!" in our own life we could never know all of the positive effects we had on those who passed our way!

To TOP one self is selish!It is better to serve your time here on this side!

"You can Not escape Universal Law!" Jesus Christ died to satified the Law and paid the ransom!"

There is forgiveness and the focus should be our relationship with the Lord!

we must for give ourselves after an earnest repentance, if we do NOT than we allow the devil to dictate! It is better to serve your time here on this side!

Suicide is a by product of the devil!

[JesseShurun]

It would be a sin against God to take one's life. It is after all, self murder. Your friend needs to go to God with all of his thoughts and plead for the strength to get through this time in his life. There is a reason for the hills and there's a reason for the valleys, and in the valley, he needs to remember Psalm 23.

[Gamecock]

You will no doubt hear a wide variety of answers, but here is my 0.2 cents.

They Bible clearly states there is only one unpardonable sin, and this ain't it.

I believe a mental illness can affect a Christian to the point that they might commit suicide. Some will say that is nonsense, but we know that we are not immune to physical ailments, and true mental illness has a physiologic basis. If a true Christian has a true mental illness and commits suicide, I think they will enter the Kingdom.

Now, if your friend has shared this with you, I think you have a serious responsibility to discuss it with his family physician, pastor, or someone who can intervene on his behalf. Do not subject yourself to a lifetime of guilt because you are worried about betraying the confidence of a friend.

If by some chance you are talking about yourself, please seek help now.

A better question might be, is he truly saved? If someone commits suicide to avoid shame, humiliation, etc, I wonder if they are truely walking with the Lord.

[aimhigh]

Suicide is a sin because it represents complete lack of faith. Faith requires trust that any trial you are encountering is under God's control. Job was told by his wife to curse God and commit suicide. Are your trials your friend experiencing worse than Job's?

Jesus said, "Blessed are the meek." Meekness means accepting what God sends your way without complaint or rebellion. That includes trials. It's not an easy character trait to develop, but then that's why they are blessed.

[tame]

Are your trials your friend experiencing worse than Job's?

Job was a righteous man, whereas this person has brought disrepute to God, his family, friends, etc. So in that sense he may think his trials are worse?

[tame]

If by some chance you are talking about yourself, please seek help now.

Hey, hey, hey--don't jump to such concluions. Thanks for your insights.

[Gamecock]

Not jumping to any conclusions, just trying to be comprehensive......

[tame]

obey God and live, or deny God and die, eternally lost.

I certainly agree with you that he should obey God and live, but I don't think he would be eternally lost. He doesn't think so either.

[tame]

Suicide is a sin

His argument is that suicide is , but in his case he would be observing a "greater good" as per Paul handing the man over to Satan in 1 Corinthians 5 so his flesh me be destroyed but his soul. Saved. In other words, he argues that Paul's implication was that a Christian who is sooooo deep in problems (although not the kind of the man in 1 Corinthians 5) is better off dead than to bring disrepute to God's kingdom.