RECOVERING THE TRUTH & A COMING TO A CORRECT UNDERSTANDING OF JESUS

Bet Emet Ministries ^ | Unknown | Craig Lyons

[ksen]

According to this teaching, is Jesus the Saviour. Did Jesus die for our sins according to people who espouse these "teaching?"

[ksen]

Ping for your thoughts......

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

This could of been written by a freewheel baptist. :)

BigMack

[CCWoody]

Gee, ksen, this screed is merely watered down milk compared to some of the stuff on that website.

For instance, these people advocate that vast chunks of the Bible are not true.

Woody.

[drstevej]

There's enough hogwash here to "purty-up" a plethora of piggies.

[jboot]

According to this teaching, Jesus was a mere holy man who failed abysmally in His quest to establish an even stricter adherance to the law among Jews. First, He was destroyed by the Gentiles and then his good name was co-opted by the heretic Paul, who established a lawless, anti-semitic religion in His name.

It's a kind of post-Christian Ebionite revival. There are a number of our favorite freeple who adhere to it, as well. I predict they will be along any minute. :-)

[jboot]

BTW, in almost (but not quite) every case, the reluctance to represent any divine name or title in print (i.e. "G-d") is a dead giveaway that the work you are reading is of Jewish rather than Christian origin.

[ksen]

I just don't understand the mindset of people who can claim that, on the one hand, portions of the NT are corrupted, and on the other hand use the NT accounts of Jesus as proof of ANYTHING.

To my mind, if you cast doubt on some of the New Testament, then you cast doubt on the whole thing. Hard to figure out what people base their Christianity on if the New Testament is corrupted.

Disclaimer: I am not claiming the NT is corrupted.....

[Invincibly Ignorant]

To my mind, if you cast doubt on some of the New Testament, then you cast doubt on the whole thing. Hard to figure out what people base their Christianity on if the New Testament is corrupted.

Why does it have to be all or nothing? You've never cut a bad part off of a potato? If you dare read "the Orthodox Corruption of Scripture". Just a little proof for ya that when it came to the scibes disdain for adoptionists and adoptionists viewpoints that there were some scribal corruptions. No reason to throw out the rest of the highly reliabe NT writings.

[ksen]

And now a personal word from Pastor Lyons:

IS THE NEW TESTAMENT REALLY THE WORD OF GOD? DON'T ANSWER TOO QUICKLY......

As Christians and sincere individuals who, seeking to know and do the will of the Almighty, come to such knowledge concerning the tampering of the New Testament and the anti-Semitic agenda of its writers, you are quickly confronted with the most significant question you'll every have to answer in this life: is the New Testament really the Word of God?

I as well as you, most likely since childhood, have been assured by our spiritual leaders that the answer is "yes;" perhaps you have even had some emotional experiences which seem to validate your leaders' assurances while in church. I did. Don't mistake the love of God for His children as an approval for one's disobedience. As you know, though, true faith is based neither upon trust in men (Ps, 146:3), nor even upon occurrences of the supernatural (Deut. 13); nor can we trust our emotions as a barometer for truth.

And so, the question remains:

After having seen the misquotations, mistranslations, and the hundreds of Old Testament passages taken and used out of context on purpose by the New Testament writers...the question is even more alarming.....How can this perversion of the Old Testament be considered as coming from God and how can we in all honesty trust it unquestioningly; let alone believe it and accept it as reliable for faith and practice in many places?

What is of even more importance is that your eternal salvation is contingent upon the answer. Without your personal knowledge about such misquotations, mistranslations, and verses used out of context as contained in the New Testament, you cannot give an intelligent answer, only an emotional one. You might be sincere, but at the same time sincerely wrong and never know it until you die. Bet Emet Ministries makes available to you in this site valuable data, research, and information about such matters; offered in an attempt to help you find the truth about these issues in hopes such knowledge will allow you to make necessary changes in your beliefs and spiritual walk; thus a life more pleasing to God. We ask that you complete these studies in a spirit of earnestness and prayer, asking God to reveal to you His truth in the quietness of your own heart. As you do so, remember that you are a member of a kingdom of priests and a holy nation (Ex.19:6), described in the Scriptures as the "apple of God's eye" (Zech.2:8) and participants in an "everlasting covenant" (Gen. 17:7). As such, rest assured that God will indeed heed your request as you sincerely seek to discover His truth.

[Alex Murphy]

What I want to know is which use of the word "Torah" is in effect here? It keeps being referred to, but it's never defined for the reader. "Torah" has a number of meanings in Jewish literature. Is it used to refer strictly to the Written Law (what we Christians would refer to as the Old Testament, especially the five books of Moses)? Or it it used to include both the Written Law as well as the Oral Law (Talmud)? Which one is held to be more authoritative over the other (Written or Oral)? Why?

Also, I'd like to know what this groups' take is on Rabbi Maimonides. Could the "Torah" being referred to here be his Mishneh Torah?

[jboot]

Man, you type fast!

[Invincibly Ignorant]

lol

[Invincibly Ignorant]

actually that was cut and pasted of the "Torah of Messiah" bulletin board.

[Calvinist_Dark_Lord]

13) Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, weherein dwelleth righteousness.
14) Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be dilligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot and blameless.
15) And account that the long-suffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
16) As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction
17) Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own steadfastness.

II Peter 3:13-17, KJV Emhpasis by Calvinist_Dark_Lord

There is no point in debating with fools. The bible, the Word of God is not negotiable. God does not care if you believe it to be so or not, one is still accountable to it. These crazys have nothing to say to us, THERE IS NOTHING TO "DISCUSS" except maybe their repentence.

CALVINIST SWARM>- STING PING

[ksen]

Thanks for the tidbit about Craig Lyons. I take it you don't consider yourself in his camp?

[Invincibly Ignorant]

Thanks for the tidbit about Craig Lyons. I take it you don't consider yourself in his camp?

That's correct.

[jboot]

Phew! There for a minute, I thought you were downright unnatural.