Posted on 11/24/2003 8:58:07 PM PST by kojak
I didn't vote for Davis either time, but I didn't vote for the recall either. Yes, he was an arrogant jerk , into political favors, but he did nothing to deserve being removed. That should be reserved for "high crimes and misdemeanors" (and blow jobs according to the republicans). The recall set a very dangerous president. Davis is not responsible for the down turn in the economy! The Dot.com crash took half the country down with it, but the biggest blow to the economy was the so-called "energy crisis", that was proven to have been a fraud to get California to sign on to higher rates for the next 7 years. The shortage was totally artificial. All the spoiled meat , bankrupt restaurants and dairy farmers, and pictures on the news of baby chickens being dumped into garbage bins because the black outs --was all rigged by companies in Texas, the biggest of which was Enron. They are recorded on tape laughing , saying "its only California--ha-ha"...the typical Texan contempt for California that Jeb Bush recently let slip into a microphone recently too (did you here about that in his home state?-I bet not-more proof the media is rigged). The Federal government deficit is the main cause of the down turn in the economy. But that could be more conspiracy too. Those Bankers and Bond holding interests were angry at Clinton for being the first modern President to have a balanced budget and a surplus in the Treasury, and at the same time having the nerve to be a Democrat. HE had to be destroyed like Nixon and Carter, so he was tempted with a tart from Oregon named Monica when they couldn't find anything bad in the White water deal. So Bush steals an election by stopping the vote count and taking it to his Daddy's Supreme court, so he comes into office an illegitimate Pres....so, let a couple terrorists slip through --make him look like the hero Clinton was after Oklahoma (When his poll # were highest in history for a PRes.) and Wah-La...they got their new war, that will last forever and all the pork military projects and debt payments by the US on the debt will be substantial for years and years to come. Its all about money. The Right wing has been in control of this country since the Kennedy assassination.
I saw Bernard Goldberg on all the talk shows. His argument doesn't hold up any more. Yes, even Walter Cronkite is on record as saying that most people in Journalism are liberals. Of course they are . If you cover the day to day social things in this country, you would have to become compassionate--now called "liberal (as if it were a bad word) by the right. That is not the point! The point is that the media is controlled at the top by the right...you can go down the list, they are all controlled by conservatives. They call the shots. They want what sells soap, not what educates. The left likes information--the right keeps liking to hear over and over what it thinks and already believes is the truth--never alternate views, never facts. Perfect example is the outing of a CIA agent by the Bush administration for political reasons. This is the biggest outrage in history. Bigger that Watergate or Monica. IF Clinton had done this , you would NEVER have heard the end of it. there is not a peep about it on the news any more after the day it broke. Can you imagine ? outing a CIA agent, basically putting a target on her back because her husband told everyone that the President lied about the reasons for going into a war that is killing American daily in his State of the Union Speech no less. This would be the biggest scandal in history if a Democrat were President. And if a Democrat were in office with this economy and not capturing Osama and Saddam, they would be called a disaster (a la Jimmy Carter), a loser, a weak President and he'd be run out so fast...but the public has been dumbed down , and a march in soviet style lock step to the right--never daring to question this President or risk being called "Unpatriotic". The world has gone nuts. This is not America any more. You need to stand up for democracy, against the patriotic act and this phoney war on terrorism. There is no reason why we should not have Osama by now, none. You can lend me Goldbergs book and I'll lend you Al Frankin's...you need to broaden your horizons. I watch Fox daily and listen to Rush. Do you listen to alternate points of view? You can' be serious about the Democrats being better funded. Bush has raised more $$ than any one in history. The Republicans have 5 or 6 Soros's and Buffet's to the Demo's one...this is the first time. It is because Bush is so bad for our country that people are getting involved. Bush is the most dis organized and chaotic presidency ever---he is the classic ex-alcoholic, ADD, hiding behind Christians , hypocrites there has ever been. You are being duped, the guy is a fraud, a patsy for Wolfawitz and the rest of those tri-lateral commission big bankers and military weapons makers..... and what about Bush outing a CIA agent? How can anyone justify that?
· Well, you didn't _"get"_ that the Monica thing was a joke about everything being a conspiracy (you missed my others about Minnesota, and)
· I don't get what you are saying about the CIA outing. Are these opinions or facts? What about the point that Bush _knew_ it was not true and put it in his State of the Union Speech and ...whoever, calling after Wilson writing his column to out his spouse hoping she'd be killed in the service of her country to punish her husband for being a "holdover". ??
· The recall so soon after Davis was reelected for miss gauging the budget shortfall, presumably lying ...isn't that the same as sending people to die in a war for reasons known to be lies? (no wait---that's worse!). So should we start a recall against Bush? All politicians lie, stretch the truth. IT was $$ that made the recall happen , not the people, and it was $$ that got Arnold (a liberal Democrat BTW) in the job...no the people.
· You also didn't _get_ that I was paraphrasing _you_ when suggesting you read a book to broaden your horizons. That is how it sounds when you actually suggest that the World Net News Daily is a credible news source. It is one big Op-ed Column, not news. That would be like me saying the NYTimes is a credible source, or Goldberg's book. It is an opinion. Why is suggesting you read someone you might not agree with... "Arrogant"? Isn't it more arrogant to insist your bias is better than another person's bias?
Gore voters? Maybe. I'm sure there are a few who signed up for the military for the sake of defending the country. Many used it for free college. BUT, now they've learned to love their country, and HATE CNN. They watch FOX, and they're seeing what the Democrats are doing to them. Things change.
Cops? I doubt it. The Democrats are constantly siding with the crimminal element. I'd need major proof to believe that one!
Al Frankin ? Nope, Sorry. I've read they were "polite." I have 2 nephews over there.
Bush is popular enough. The real Iraq sees him as a liberation hero. There was an article about Iraqi grafitti. It tells it all. The military is well loved.
The triangle is still a danger though. Iran is behind it. Their people are fighting for democracy there. Bush comes along and is setting up Iraqi democracy on their right, and on their left in Afganistan. They're surrounded by it. They're fighting for political survival.
Stopping the FLA vote? No, the Democrats were the ones stopping the military ballots from being counted. The FLSC were unsuccessful in changing the law after the votes had be cast and counted. (And I believe it took them almost two years to respond to the USSC on that issue.)
was...
Check your facts. That is one of the Right wing mantras. Gore only tried to stop the absentees, after Bush's lawyers tried to stop the count. It was only for a day on the absentees from the military and they were for Gore, BTW...it actually helped him. Kathleen Harris stopped the recount (that later would have shown Bush won by 304). All Gore wanted was a recount...just ONE. Another republican lie was that there was "Recount, after recount". Wrong, there was never even ONE! That is a fact.
I KNOW that it was Bush who first took the legal action to prevent a recount. He was legally right to do so as it played out. It would have opened a whole can of worms with. As you say WITHOUT MANIPULATION Bush would have won anyway, but IMO it is highly unlikely that Gore would not have exerted extreme pressure and of course this is what Bush successfully prevented. It ended the way it should have. Legally.
Exactly. My favorite way to treat liberals is to start by listening and then slowly asking pointed questions about implementation. They always back down or attack you personally when you burst their balloons.
Another tactic I liked to use (liked in that I got so sick and tired of them I basically stopped talking and socializing with them. Even people I knew for 20 years since college) was to take a new proposal by the left wing Dems and talk it up as a GOP idea at a party. They'd attack the idea and call me names and say it was typical of Republicans, blah, blah, blah. Oops, I'd say, that was Clinton's idea, my mistake.
To watch them stand there with nothing to say was a riot.
I can top that. I once, after calmly and effectively dismantling a leftist' argument over something stupid, got, "at least I have a cause" thrown in my face.
Of course, it was the usual "cause du jour" for them that week. It changed constantly.
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