Cheney to Promote American-Made Nuclear Reactors to China

Associated Press ^ | Apr. 9, 2004 | H. Josef Hebert

[Alter Kaker]

I know China has nuclear reactors. But Cheney is sending superior reactors and technology associated. What is Plutonium among friends?

[oceanagirl]

I hope that you're right and I'll keep your views in mind. I really hate seeing this country fall behind in technology. My strengths do not lie in the tech/science area, so I can't do much to help directly. What are your views as to the reasons for our decline?

[glorgau]

Would you be saying that if it was Clinton's VP who went to China with this sale plan? Just wondering.

No problem. Civilian and military nuclear are two separate things. Besides, China already has nukes. This wouldn't allow them further perfect that art.

[RightWhale]

There would be two reason to explain this. One is that American youth don't study the right subjects. The other is that the rest of the world has discovered that they can do technology, have a policy of developing technologically, and are catching up rapidly. There is nothing to do with the second reason, but the first one is definitely something to work on.

[Maceman]

Ckinton allowed Loral to sell missile technology to the Chinese so that it could get its satellites launched cheaply.

So Clinton and the Democrats got money from Loral and the Chinese, the Chinese got the ability to deliver nuclear weapons to American cities, and Loral got its satellites launched cheaply.

Only Loral ended up going bankrupt anyway, having to sell off its only profitable business -- a number of orbiting satellites. So much for the argument that the deal was helping an American company. The American commercial satellite business went into the trash heap anyway because the economics of the business changed for the worse.

I don't know much about nuclear technology, and it may be true that the Chinese already have all the nukes they need, but I am very fearful that this deal will ultimately be to the detriment of American security.

[meatloaf]

If I recall correctly Westinghouse was able to get export restrictions lifted by Congress during Clinton's time. Close to that time Westinghouse Energy Systems was chopped up and sold, part to British Nuclear Fuels and part to the Washington Group. At this point the heavy manufacturing capability once resident in the US is gone. Westinghouse closed the steam generator facility in Pensacola several years ago announcing that if needed, new units would be manufactured overseas.

Chicago Bridge and Iron had a mammoth facility near Memphis that fabricated reactors. The equipment to bend 4" steel plate wasn't something that was common. I saw the surplus ad for that equipment. If it wasn't sold to an overseas buyer, it may have been scrapped.

The bottom line is that any new Nuclear Steam Supply Systems will consist of a large amount of foreign manufactured goods. We do have one factory, GE in Schnectady, that can still mnaufacturer larger turbine generators. Even for those the main rotor forgings are sourced from overseas. There is no foundry capable of producing forgings of that size left in the US. The last I heard GE got them from Austria.

[GOP_1900AD]

If true, what a blunder. Globalism is a mental illness.

[Alter Kaker]

Civilian and military nuclear are two separate things.

That is completely wrong. This reactor will produce Plutonium of grade which can be used in nuclear weapons.

Besides, China already has nukes. This wouldn't allow them further perfect that art.

And China had rockets in 800 AD. So America should export ICBM technology too?

[oceanagirl]

I've thought that we, as a nation, could do a lot more to encourage study in math/science/tech by increasing scholarships for U.S. citizens and perhaps legal permanent residents studying in those fields and doing well. This is from a former history major who would have been furious about this back in college. I see room for increases both in the private and public sectors. In particular, I would like to see a serious loan forgiveness program for those willing and interested in graduate study. The loan load with which students graduate these days is daunting, and I have read that it is a negative factor in making decisions to attend graduate school.

[RightWhale]

That would be an encouragement. Jobs after graduation is also a problem.

[oceanagirl]

Truly scary. In addition for the need for jobs for all kinds of people here, not just the technological elite, sourcing all sorts of necessary items from overseas would post incredible problems if we ever found ourselves in another conventional war, hot, cold or lukewarm, with an adversary who had a serious fleet, including submarines, or perhaps some asymmetrical naval threat that I cannot imagine. I know that it sounds far-fetched today, but an adversary may arise that did not want to turn its territory radioactive even as it wanted to push us in some way. Shutting down a few key shipping lanes or at least making many routes very hazardous would bring us to our knees.

Globalization of trade to the extent that we are seeing here really assumes a quite peaceful world. I'm not ready to sign on to that assumption.

[oceanagirl]

Yes. Obviously we do not have a good situation here, and I have serious doubts whether the situation will really improve too much so long as (a) the labor cost differential is so extensive between us and China, India, Russia, Bulgaria, etc.; (2) business need not account for the externalized risks and costs of doing many types of activities abroad; (3) currency exchange rates remain fixed in many, many parts of the world; and (4) the U.S. government sees no security risk in sourcing necessary and strategic items solely from abroad. Of course, there are probably many others of which I am unaware.

As long as these conditions, and others, continue to exist, I don't even see changes necessitated by peak oil increasing good employment opportunities significantly here.

[RightWhale]

Right. On top of that, the balance of payments index on technical goods went negative this month for the first time. It's a problem, and will be for a long time.

[glorgau]

This reactor will produce Plutonium of grade which can be used in nuclear weapons.

The Chinese already have plenty of Plutonium, and the ability to produce more.

[oceanagirl]

No wonder Sir John Templeton has stated that U.S. residents should not purchase homes until prices declined to $30,000. That's about what a family could afford making $12,000 a year.

[Ben Ficklin]

Do you think that the US is the only country bidding on this job?

[Ben Ficklin]

US wrestles its rivals for China nuclear deal. France-Russia-Canada.

[oceanagirl]

Thank you for posting the article. This is looking inevitable, and I guess better us than the Russians, the French or the Canadians.

Still, I sometimes get the feeling that many execs and high-level government and think tank folks see the Chinese as their buddies, that the Chinese are just like what everyone thought the western Europeans were before the split over Iraq.

Perhaps I read just enough Chinese history many years ago to make me dangerous, but I don't see them this way and I doubt that they see themselves that way. They have called themselves the "Middle Kingdom," moderate and correct in all ways, and significantly superior to barbarians despite their recent problems. I expect them to act in a relatively benign manner toward us, perhaps the ultimate barbarians, only so long as it suits their purposes. As soon as it doesn't, we may not be able to import what we need from them, and U.S. joint ventures will be dissolved with no compensation. We will then be on our knees because we sold them all our production equipment. At that point we may not have any leverage over them and their contract enforcement system, if any, and really will be able to seize the equipment and haul it to the nearest port or by testing them militarily. I most sincerely hope that I am wrong.

[Alter Kaker]

The Chinese already have plenty of Plutonium, and the ability to produce more.

And now they will have most advanced nuclear reactors. Give them a little more.

[Willie Green]

"To hell with American Energy Independence.
Who ever came up with a birdbrained notion like that anyway?
Heck, we can sell our nukes to the Chicoms and
let THEM build high-speed rail and Maglev.
Afterall, America is RICH!!!
We can AFFORD to be addicted to OPEC Oil.
Spencer Abraham says we can even import liquid natural
gas for another 20 years before we do anything else.
So what if we have to occasionally use the military in the Persian Gulf?
American lives are a small price to pay compared to the
enormous profits that can be made from transnational 'free' trade."