Posted on 08/02/2004 5:49:37 AM PDT by BluegrassScholar
Edited on 08/02/2004 10:43:46 AM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]
Carrie is 2 years old, with curly brown hair and Windex-blue eyes. In a still-life portrait, she would be adorable. In three dimensions, she's a cross between a Gerber baby and the Tasmanian devil. Bang. Bang, bang, bang, and bang and bang.
That's the noise of the plastic water cup she is whacking against the ceramic-topped table of a neighborhood coffeehouse whose concrete floors function like an echo chamber. If she had a hammer she would have destroyed the table by now, and I'm pretty sure her parents would've let her. People look up from their lattes, squint at the diminutive figure making the big, ear-splitting noise, and try to continue with their newspapers or conversations. The banging goes on for a good 10 minutes. Normally, I would say something -- I'm not shy about these things -- but I'm curious to know just how long her parents, with whom I'm having coffee, will let this go. The answer: Indefinitely. They don't even seem to notice. Maybe they're just used to it?
On some primal level, Carrie must be offended that she's not the center of attention. There is anger in her banging, along with what I read as malice. As she grows even more restive, her father lowers her to the floor. Still clutching the cup, Carrie crawls through the room, pounding on the concrete floor as she goes along, giving everyone an up-close earful of her drum solo.
A few weeks later, I'm at a party, mostly adults with a few kids sprinkled in, among them the volcanically unruly 5-year-old son of a friend. As I squat down to greet him, he responds by biting me in the arm, leaving teeth marks through a shirt and a sweater. I am just about to spank his little behind when I realize I'm in dangerous territory. People go to jail for that these days.
A few years ago, our oldest daughter worked at a day care in Austin and they were told that they could NOT tell the kid (who at the time may have been biting/hitting/whatever another kid) that he/she should stop and not do that. They had to re-direct his activity. They did't want to hurt little "angels" psyche. Time out. Hah! They even stopped that as it was too negative. Watched Bill Engvall last night and he said his dad took "time out" of his busy day to whip his @ss. LOL If ya'll have seen the Blue Collar Comedy Tour, check it out. Bill Engvall is the one who says "here's your sign"
Throw pennies at em.
I can't resist adding my "bad behavior in church" peeve. We attend a church that has one of the soundproof "family rooms" in the back, which we use, as our son is not quite two. I bring quiet toys and books for him, but never food. Once, I will admit, I brought a spillproof cup of milk when we were late and he hadn't finished breakfast, but I try not to do that either! Anyway, the way people treat this room (which is, after all, part of the church) is just gross. I find crackers, raisins, you name it, on the floor, the pews, ground into the carpet, etc. First off, no child who is eating those kind of snacks will starve during a one hour service! And second, if you are rude enough (in my opinion) to bring the food, then at least have the decency to clean up the mess. It also worries me that a younger, mobile child could get a leftover item (raisin, for instance) and choke on it. I see this food behavior at other public places too... library, for example. I think it is just so disrespectful. I also plan not to be using this room once my youngest child is about five. I fervently hope by then, he/she can sit through service in a reasonable manner. I see parents in these rooms with kids as old as seven or eight... look, just because your kid would rather color, eat Cheerios, and have a drink than sit through church, isn't a reason to be sitting in the family room (I think of it as "the baby room"). This food issue also has caused problems when my son sees Cheerios or a cup and wants some. I am just going to teach him "we don't do that in church" and leave it at that, I guess. Probably will offend the feeding parents, but too bad.
Absolutely, if your their friend, you'll smoke dope with them, get a stupid tattoo on your butt, etc. If your their parent, you'll put a stop to that behavior quickly.
Children are perfectly capable of learning proper social behavior at a young age. When our three were growing up, we would have a weekly family outing to one of several nice local restaurants. (We taught our children early that McDonalds is NOT food) Our expectations were that they were to act like ladies and gentleman. On the rare occasion that a problem DID come up, we would skip our night out the following week. Among themselves, the kids made sure that proper peer justice was administered to the offender! As 20 and 30 something adults, they are very well adjusted members of society. They have diverse tastes in foods as a result from their early dining variety and they still hold one another accountable for their actions! I will politely speak up when a child or children are being disruptive in public. There is no excuse.
LOL; He's also said he had ADD once when he was about 10...until his dad smacked him on the head and told him to PAY ATTENTION!
A church I used to attend had a special little area in the janitors closet. Many of us knew about the special area that had a special paddle in a special little place. Many of the kids knew about that special place too.
The board of education worked wonders.
Used judiciously of course.
Yikes.
Oh, as I read the book, the 1-2-3 approach is only for limited situations, but they are the situations that seem to occur during 80% of my day! My son tried to get into the street the other day and that's one of the other situations that guarantees him immediate discipline results. I don't think the 1-2-3 author is advocating counting for instances of immediate danger. In the way I've been using the method, it does seem to be working pretty well so far. It's not that different from the way a lot of parents used to raise their kids. I remember my parents counting when we were growing up. Of course, how funny that nowadays I needed a book to get the idea!
ROTF! Yep. Our son was ADD in school until he had an older woman teacher in the third grade who said she just whacked him on his head with a ruler to get his attention back. LOL He did great in her room.
Picture 4 boys, ages 10, 9, 7 and 2, at a restaurant.
The first time we "acted up" we got "THE LOOK!"
The second time we acted up, we got a rap across the knuckles with the back of a spoon.
The third time, we got sent out to sit in the car while the rest of the family finished their meal.
It only took once to be sent out the car before I knew what was expected of me in a restraints.
Of course, now-a-days with all the butt-in-skis out there, you would fine yourself charged with "Child endangerment" if you left a child alone in a parked car.
I'm with you.
We have ten, the youngest is 2, and a total of three preschoolers. We sit together through the 90 minute sermon easily. Libraries and restaurants are a breeze. I don't think we have ever gone out to eat, in toto, without someone coming up and remarking on the behavior of our children.
Ok, So some observations.
First child training...we have three simple rules for the uninitiated:
1. Obedience should be first time obedience. You'll never yell at your kids.
2. Obedience should be sweet and cheerful.
3. Delayed obedience is disobedience.
Other observations:
If you read at HSLDA's website (www. hslda.org) you will realize that the great frontier of family terrorism is the dreaded new Gestapo- Child Protective Services. Horror stories abound. Liberals consider spanking to be child abuse. Now I don't know how you are going to have authoirty with no real consequences, but the restaurant/ public places stories recounted by my fellow freepers all attest to the folly of this permissive parenting.
We actually enjoy our children immensely- all of them. the best part of all is that the teen years so far ( we have 5 who are 14 tears old and up) have not been what we feared- tug-of-wars, rebellion, youthful alienation. Instead, they are our best friends.
One last thing. We ask successful families as we meet them, what they consider to be key ingredients for the homes they have so wonderfully built. We all expect to hear about making your children mind, giving chores,etc. But one recurrent theme is, we have FUN with our kids. Camping, joking, playing...we make it a point to HAVE LOTS of Fun.
And I second that!
Food is used as a babysitter, just like TV.
No horror stories today. The REAL horror stories are still to come, probably in about 15-20 years when these overindulged, spoiled little punks grow into quasi-adults. Their surprise and shock that the world wasn't made to cater to their every whim will be something to see.
I see your point but everything has a place. 1-2-3 works wonderfully for me. Early on I made it to 3 a few times. But not anymore, they know!!!
If my child was running in the street I run after him. The childs age is always an important part of the equation, if he is 2 the mistake would be mine. If he is 7, I've failed already.
I've got a sister-in-law that let her brat do whatever he wanted. Wasn't potty-trained until age 5, in the July just before entering kindergarten, and up to that point, wouldn't even lay down to have his diaper changed. She once made the comment "he just doesn't seem to mind me". I told her "you get what you settle for". Talk about a fly-by.
You are right!!!
Natural limitations is something that needs to be considered in a child. My older daughter is the group person. She is perfect is a crowd, never had a problem with a large group.
The little one has always been low noise/low input. If one wants this child to behave well, one must limit high input. We do quiet family places. When we have tried the big chains, she is a bear and I will not subject other paying patrons to her. I have walked out with a crying child before. Not a problem.
I give great credit to the mom walking out of the store with the crying child. She is putting in the effort to parenting.
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