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Prehistoric Desert Town Found In Western Sahara (15,000 Years Old)
Reuters ^ | 8-19-2004 | Reuters

Posted on 08/20/2004 9:10:09 AM PDT by blam

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1 posted on 08/20/2004 9:10:10 AM PDT by blam
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To: SunkenCiv

GGG Ping.


2 posted on 08/20/2004 9:11:54 AM PDT by blam
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To: blam

I wonder how you figure out the name of a 15000 year old town. Does it have "Welcome to Arghilas pop. 1043" on the road into town?


3 posted on 08/20/2004 9:12:48 AM PDT by KellyAdmirer
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To: blam
Wow!

This is huge news. That level of development, at a time when conventional wisdom says even basic agriculture was rare/non-existent, turns everything we "know" about ancient man upside down.
4 posted on 08/20/2004 9:15:41 AM PDT by EternalHope (Boycott everything French forever. Including their vassal nations.)
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To: KellyAdmirer
I wonder how you figure out the name of a 15000 year old town.

I'd just find a water bill. That would have the name on it.

5 posted on 08/20/2004 9:17:22 AM PDT by jtminton (Kerry/Edwards 2004: It's Boring in America again!)
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To: KellyAdmirer
I wonder how you figure out the name of a 15000 year old town.

I'd just find a water bill. That would have the name on it.

6 posted on 08/20/2004 9:17:47 AM PDT by jtminton (Kerry/Edwards 2004: It's Boring in America again!)
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Comment #7 Removed by Moderator

To: blam
"The latest glaciation ended only 10,000 years ago."

Above from a website on glaciation. Ye Gods---a TOWN from before the end of the last ice age!!!! I wonder what they thought about the "global warming" of the day.

8 posted on 08/20/2004 9:26:37 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog (The Hog of Steel)
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To: blam

The scientists haven't described the location of the holiest structure on the holiest street in the holiest city yet. As soon as the local terrorists establish a base there they will have it located. Or at least it will be established as soon as the media find out where the terrorists are making their stand.


9 posted on 08/20/2004 9:27:17 AM PDT by FreePaul
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To: dead

If people don't live in deserts, then maybe when the town was there, and people were living there...it wasn't a desert.


10 posted on 08/20/2004 9:28:54 AM PDT by stuartcr (Neither - Nor.... in '04)
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To: stuartcr
It wasn't a desert. I believe it's been determined that during the last ice age it was mostly grassy plains and forest.
11 posted on 08/20/2004 9:34:57 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Here, bite down on this.)
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To: KellyAdmirer

> I wonder how you figure out the name of a 15000 year old town.

Ummm... you don't, unless there are stories of such a town being in that area (and then you're still speculating).

If there was text in the town, you might eb able to read it off that... but damn, a written language 15,000 years old... I seriously doubt we'd figure it out.

Now comes the point in the program where people start argueing about the ethnicity of the inhabitants...


12 posted on 08/20/2004 9:39:44 AM PDT by orionblamblam
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To: cripplecreek

I know, but I didn't really understand what dead was trying to say, and it seemed like he wanted attention, so I answered.


13 posted on 08/20/2004 9:44:23 AM PDT by stuartcr (Neither - Nor.... in '04)
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To: stuartcr

He was repeating an old comedy routine. Sam Kinison I believe.


14 posted on 08/20/2004 9:45:28 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Here, bite down on this.)
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To: cripplecreek

OK, thanks.


15 posted on 08/20/2004 9:52:41 AM PDT by stuartcr (Neither - Nor.... in '04)
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To: blam

Out on the coast is a prehistoric seaport dock. It was already old when civilization began in Mesopotamia.


16 posted on 08/20/2004 9:55:07 AM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: blam

The more we look, the older we get.

Great find. WoW! Wonder what else is hidden under the deserts of the world, I've always thought the Gobi desert was a prime candidate for hidden cities. Sahara makes sense, if it was wetter and maybe even, if some of the new researchers claim, this was contemporaneous with ancient, ancient Egypt.


17 posted on 08/20/2004 10:01:12 AM PDT by swarthyguy
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To: blam

They were Berbers? I'm stuned!


18 posted on 08/20/2004 10:03:37 AM PDT by bk1000 ("We will take things away from you for the common good.": -HRC)
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To: bk1000

made a killing in carpets from what ive heard.


19 posted on 08/20/2004 10:22:16 AM PDT by Docbarleypop (Navy Doc)
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To: blam

15,000 years old??? A town??
I could be wrong but isn't it hard to have a town without agriculture?
The first farms discovered so far have been dated to around 9000 yrs old.
This isn't sounding right.


20 posted on 08/20/2004 10:28:55 AM PDT by Adder (Can we bring back stoning again? Please?)
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To: blam


Lost City of Atlantis Found
- Underneath Sahara Desert!

Nov 26 '03


THE LOST City of Atlantis is not deep beneath the ocean -- the ancient metropolis is buried under the sands of the Sahara Desert!

Archaeologist Dr. Carla Sage points out that according to ancient accounts, the Mycenaean, Cretan and Egyptian civilizations all traded with Atlantis -- which would have been unlikely if it lay in the North Atlantic as many believe.

"Atlantis was clearly within easy trading distance of Troy and the other city states of the Mediterranean," she says. "I believe Atlantis was the capital of a vast North African empire with ports on the Gulf of Sidra.

"Atlantis was destroyed, not by earthquake, floods or volcanoes, but by the steady march of desert sands that smothered the civilization.

"The empire did not sink into the sea as is commonly believed -- it was swallowed by the dunes."

While the theory flies in the face of traditional views of Atlantis, Dr. Sage points to tantalizing evidence that supports the Sahara model.

Nomadic desert Bedouins, especially after sandstorms, often see marble columns sticking up out of dunes, notably near the Ahaggar Mountains of southern Algeria, the British expert reveals.

Even more surprising, scientists have discovered that within comparatively recent times in geological terms, the Sahara region enjoyed a temperate climate that would have made it an ideal site for human civilization.

"Eleven thousand to 12,000 years ago, when the ancient Greeks say Atlantis flourished, the Sahara was lush, fertile land," Dr. Sage observes.

"Artwork etched in Saharan rocks at that time depicts giraffes roaming freely. Archaeologists have also found pictograms of domesticated cattle, horse-drawn chariots, as well as large caravans -- confirming that trade played an important role in the region."

But the alarmingly rapid transformation of the region from paradise to dry desert would have wiped out all agriculture and killed off livestock.

"More significantly, as sand encroached on the empire, clogging caravan wheels, it made travel nearly impossible -- which would have put an end to an empire based on trade," Dr. Sage says.

"It was not until centuries later, around 100 B.C., that people began to use camels for transportation in the region -- an innovation that came too late for Atlantis, long since buried and forgotten under the dunes."

A few diehards continue to believe that Atlantis was literally a continent in the midst of the Atlantic Ocean.

But most modern experts agree that theory was blown out of the water in 1912 when scientist Alfred Wegener demonstrated that the known continents once fit neatly together like a jigsaw puzzle and have drifted apart over the eons.

Although Plato, drawing upon earlier accounts, wrote of a watery end to the great Atlantean civilization, Dr. Sage believes that the ancient Greek philosopher misinterpreted an Egyptian word meaning "movement of water."

"It was not water deluging Atlantis, but the departure of water from the region, that caused the calamity," she says.

Next spring, the expert hopes to lead an international expedition, including archaeologists from the United States, Britain, France, Egypt and Saudi Arabia, that will begin combing the 3.5 million-square-mile desert using high-tech equipment in search of traces of the lost empire.

"I am convinced that buried beneath that vast, arid no-man's-land we will find Atlantis," Dr. Sage declares.





21 posted on 08/20/2004 10:30:58 AM PDT by mjp
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To: dead

SK BTTT


22 posted on 08/20/2004 10:32:27 AM PDT by Semaphore Heathcliffe ("Or what? You and the Country Bear Jamboree will banjo me to death?")
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To: blam
I'm amazed this went undiscovered for so long, because there was still an original resident there, serving as caretaker and cleaning lady:


23 posted on 08/20/2004 10:33:01 AM PDT by Hank Rearden (Never allow anyone who could only get a government job attempt to tell you how to run your life.)
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To: Semaphore Heathcliffe

sorry, should read

AAAA AAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAA SK BTTT AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


24 posted on 08/20/2004 10:34:19 AM PDT by Semaphore Heathcliffe ("Or what? You and the Country Bear Jamboree will banjo me to death?")
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To: Wonder Warthog

Considering the age of the earth is roughly 6,000 years, this is tyruly an "interesting" find!


25 posted on 08/20/2004 10:35:08 AM PDT by MrLee
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To: mjp
"THE LOST City of Atlantis is not deep beneath the ocean -- the ancient metropolis is buried under the sands of the Sahara Desert! "

Thanks, this is the first I've heard of this idea.

26 posted on 08/20/2004 11:01:07 AM PDT by blam
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To: Adder

Well, their dating methods are at best unreliable and they like to pontificate about their theories till they end up wearing egg. So I never listen to anything they say about dates. Just watch the find and look at the facts and ignore most of the conclusions unless there is solid support for them.


27 posted on 08/20/2004 11:02:37 AM PDT by Havoc (.)
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To: dead

Wow

Too much coffee this morning?


28 posted on 08/20/2004 11:03:35 AM PDT by Leatherneck_MT (Goodnight Chesty, wherever you may be.)
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To: mjp

More crap. lol


29 posted on 08/20/2004 11:03:52 AM PDT by Havoc (.)
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To: mjp

Interesting. The word 'atl' in one of the mesoamerican languages means water or has something to do with water.


30 posted on 08/20/2004 11:06:57 AM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: blam; RadioAstronomer; Physicist; VadeRetro; Junior; Right Wing Professor
"It appears that scientists have come up with the 15,000-years estimate judging by the style of the engravings and the theme of the drawings," Mustapha Ouachi, a Rabat-based Berber historian, told Reuters. "

They can tell it's 15,000 years old by the style of the engravings???

If man is millions of years old as evolutionists claim, there should be a lot more ruins of civilization and signs of agriculture than what we find. It is simply not believable that man existed for millions of years with current cranial capacity and the ability to use tools, but did not discover agriculture or writing prior to the last 15,000 years.

31 posted on 08/20/2004 11:10:26 AM PDT by DannyTN
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To: DannyTN
If man is millions of years old as evolutionists claim

“Evolutionists” claim no such thing. The species homo sapien is generally considered to be about 300,000 years old.

For most of that time, they lived primarily as hunters and gatherers. It is generally believed that they began forming civilizations about 15,000 years ago, though scientists disagree on that number.

32 posted on 08/20/2004 11:25:45 AM PDT by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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To: blam

33 posted on 08/20/2004 11:27:38 AM PDT by OXENinFLA
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To: dead

THEY DONT NEED MONEY! THEY NEED A F**KING UHAUL!!


34 posted on 08/20/2004 11:35:22 AM PDT by KOZ. (i'm so bad i should be in detention)
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To: dead

300,000 or a million. It's still not believable that man was smart enough to use tools but not smart enough to realize that plants grow from seeds and start planting what he liked.


35 posted on 08/20/2004 11:40:09 AM PDT by DannyTN
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um,...15,000 years ago, it wasn't a desert.


36 posted on 08/20/2004 11:42:58 AM PDT by Legion04
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To: DannyTN
I’m sorry but there is a big difference between “millions of years” and 300,000 years.

Early man lived as hunters and gathers. Many people still live that way. It has nothing to do with “smarts.”

About 15,000 years ago, some enterprising homo sapiens decided that they might try living in one place permanently and see how it worked out. It really caught on and remains the popular choice even today.

37 posted on 08/20/2004 11:50:32 AM PDT by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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To: DannyTN
plants grow from seeds and start planting

It would be hard to miss. First of all, people would chew on all kinds of plants, roots, seeds, berries; some would be tasty enough to look for on purpose like a bear that prefers a particular brand of beer. This time of the year there are seeds flying everywhere on the breeze. If nothing else, children sometimes play with some seeds. It would be no trick to gather some seeds and keep them over the winter rather than eat them and then notice that they sometimes start to grow and become the same kind of plant. You would have to go out of your way to not notice.

38 posted on 08/20/2004 11:54:01 AM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: dead
I'll concede that evolutionists claim modern humans existed for only 300,000 years. They claim Lucy a human predecessor (really an extinct ape) was around 3.2 million years ago. And sometime between 3.2 million years and 300,000 years, evolution did it's magic and transformed the ape into man.

It's still a ridiculously long time to go without discovering agriculture.

I think the Bible is more credible. In one generation (or less) Cain began growing crops while Able became a hunter and livestock herder. And we have been growing and hunting and herding ever since.

39 posted on 08/20/2004 11:59:09 AM PDT by DannyTN
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To: Adder

You think maybe we just don't know everything there is to know?


40 posted on 08/20/2004 12:07:27 PM PDT by dljordan
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To: DannyTN

Why not? It had to have happened sooner or later; it just happened to have happened later.


41 posted on 08/20/2004 12:17:56 PM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: DannyTN

You do realize, of course, that there are people living in South America who never discovered agriculture until contacted by explorers?


42 posted on 08/20/2004 12:19:07 PM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: dead

Channeling Sam Kennison?


43 posted on 08/20/2004 12:20:52 PM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: Junior
It had to have happened sooner or later; it just happened to have happened later.

No, it happened sooner. The start point just wasn't 300,000 years ago.

44 posted on 08/20/2004 12:31:00 PM PDT by DannyTN
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To: Junior
"You do realize, of course, that there are people living in South America who never discovered agriculture until contacted by explorers?"

You have a reference? That's pretty hard to believe given the ancient empires of South America. It is easier to believe that a jungle people might choose not to use much agriculture, simply because the Jungle provides sufficiently. But to not even be aware of it, I think is suspect.

45 posted on 08/20/2004 12:36:28 PM PDT by DannyTN
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To: DannyTN
A few years ago a tribe was discovered in the Amazon that was living a basically stone-age hunter/gatherer existence. They'd never had contact with the outside world until their discovery. And, they weren't the first tribe found in that region who'd never encountered more civilized races.

Hell, in Africa, we have the bushmen of the Kalahari who still lead a stone-age hunter/gatherer existence despite having frequent contact with their more civilized neighbors. IIRC, there are still tribes of pygmies in the central parts of Africa that haven't made the leap from the stone age yet either.

46 posted on 08/20/2004 1:05:55 PM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: Junior

In the latter example, that's a choice. They choose to live a hunter\gatherer lifestyle.

I suspect that is the case in the former example too. I doubt seriously they had never had contact with the outside world. They chose to minimize it.


47 posted on 08/20/2004 1:10:46 PM PDT by DannyTN
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To: DannyTN

And, your point?


48 posted on 08/20/2004 1:14:12 PM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: Junior
That the liklihood that all people would choose not to embrace agriculture for 300,000 years is infinitely small.

It's human nature to have one group not adopt certain advances, i.e. the Menonites with Electricity.

But it is also human nature to explore and expand, even to the point of leaving the tribe to do your own thing.

That a tribe chooses not to embrace certain cultural advances, is far different, from assuming that in 300,000 years ALL men would reject such obvious advances.

49 posted on 08/20/2004 1:18:38 PM PDT by DannyTN
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To: blam

They got 15,000 from the 'style' and theme' of some engravings? yeah right... Might as well throw a dart at a timeline posted on the wall.


50 posted on 08/20/2004 1:26:32 PM PDT by TalonDJ (got caffeine?)
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