Russia held Chechen families: Rebels' relatives seized as they slept - Chechens Good/Russians Bad

Boston Globe / LA Times ^ | 9.7.2004 | Kim Murphy

[rface]

It was 6 a.m. when Russian soldiers hoisted themselves over the wall, crashed through the window, and broke down the front door......Altogether, an estimated 40 family members of senior Chechen rebel leaders were assembled at Khankala from Thursday, a day after the hostage seizure in Beslan, until Saturday, the day after it ended.

Semiyev's daughter, Kusama, is the wife of Chechen separatist leader Aslan Maskhadov. Around him were suddenly assembled the entire extended families of Maskhadov, the former Chechen president, and of Chechen warlords Shamil Basayev and Doku Umarov. Maskhadov's brother was in the tent where the men were kept, and in a nearby building with the women and children, his elderly sister. A 5-month-old baby proved to be a distant relative of one of the rebel leaders.

[ snip ]

Maskhadov's spokesman in London, Akhmad Zakayev, said ''They were following the standard practice developed almost a century ago by the Bolsheviks and carried on by Stalin, who believed that every single act of terror should be responded to by an even bigger, more horrendous, more terrifying terrorist act," Zakayev said. ''According to this practice, it is necessary to shock terrorists, and let them know that under no condition will you agree to negotiate with them."

[ snip ]

''There were people making very frightening comments about us [the family detainees] like, 'They should be turned into ashtrays.' I don't know what turning a person into an ashtray means, but it sounds very menacing," Abdul-Kadyrova said.

[Skooz]

My liberal cousin in Atlanta equated the killings of the children with the torture of the prisoners in Abu Ghrab.

So, on the demented planet where liberals live, putting panties on someone's head is the equivalent of murdering defenseless children? These people vote?

[HenryLeeII]

The media's focus on what the Russian government did or didn't do is appalling.

Since Fox News covered nothing but the hurricane this weekend (and as a survivor of Isabel last year, I'm not trying to belittle their devastation) I was forced to watch CNN for coverage of the school siege. Not once did the reporter refer to the terrorists as Islamic or as terrorists. He used the word 'Arab' once in the lengthy segment I saw, but that was about as close to calling a spade a spade as he got.

[TomGuy]

''They were following the standard practice developed almost a century ago by the Bolsheviks and carried on by Stalin, who believed that every single act of terror should be responded to by an even bigger, more horrendous, more terrifying terrorist act," Zakayev said. ''According to this practice, it is necessary to shock terrorists, and let them know that under no condition will you agree to negotiate with them."

That will have to happen again before terrorism will be quelled. We have to look at how various civilizations/leaders in history have treated terrorism and threats from hordes of barbarians.

Some civilizations survived/won. Some civilizations were wiped out by the barbarians. We need to learn the lessons of history and apply historical solutions. It won't be pretty. It won't be very civil. But it will be necessary for our civilization to survive against a barbarous horde of terrorists who are bent on killing and maiming as many people as they can, while they drive the world back into the 7th Century.

[SuziQ]

''They were following the standard practice developed almost a century ago by the Bolsheviks and carried on by Stalin, who believed that every single act of terror should be responded to by an even bigger, more horrendous, more terrifying terrorist act," Zakayev said.

That statement would only be true if the Russians shot all these children in the back like the terrorists at Breslan did.

[SuziQ]

OOPS! I meant BESLAN!

[TomGuy]

My liberal cousin in Atlanta equated the killings of the children with the torture of the prisoners in Abu Ghrab.

I have pounded the podium on FR for months about Abu Ghraib and the Bush team not getting out in front of it PR-wise and quelling it.

[Clinton would have shushed it up in 2 days flat. Bush has let it go on and on and on and now, as signified by your statement, it is ingrained into the minds of people that our military did something very bad. LibDems and LibMedia made a mountain out of a molehill, and Abu Ghraib was allowed to become a great 'atrocity' of the War in Iraq. A good PR team would NEVER have let that happen because they would have been out effectively countering it every day.]

[Mama Shawna]

This morning I heard John Scott of fox use the words
'islamic terrorists' while showing the footage of the rally going on in Moscow today. Was quite surprised to hear that! Not holding my breath that it will start being used more...

Mama

[CindyDawg]

Evil people are also in the US. We aren't immune.

If someone hurt Cindydawg, I would go after him but I wouldn't torture and kill his dog's puppies.

[TXBSAFH]

There is not such thing as a russian aclu.

[TomGuy]

(FoxNews) Scott also called the school assault 'tragic' and 'tragedy'.

After the break, he called the killing of the children 'slaughter.'

[I figure his email box filled up in a hurry with corrections to his error, including my email pointing out the difference in meaning of 'tragedy' and 'atrocity'.]

[moonman]

I wasn't sure about who exactly the Chechen people were, so I did a 'google' search.If anyone would like to read about one person's history research and opinion about the Chechen, go to: http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/63/077.html

[antonia]

a

Allah demands blood sacrifice. Islamofascist; Radical Islam is an insane     death cult, and "moderate" Islam is its    Trojan Horse in the West World.

 

[Lijahsbubbe]

''There were people making very frightening comments about us [the family detainees] like, 'They should be turned into ashtrays.' I don't know what turning a person into an ashtray means, but it sounds very menacing," Abdul-Kadyrova said.

The bad people were making bad talk? Must've been quite scary for you. I'm sure you've never heard your terrorist family members say anything so "menacing".

[WorkingClassFilth]

It is a terrible act - but - if terrifying retribution were to be carried out with resolve for a long enough time, the terrorist cause, recruits and jihad would cease. This is an effective and historically proven tactic.

The same thing is done in every war by deliberate design or inevitable mistake. In modern total war, such as WWII, families, babies, hospitals, schools, nurseries and all other kinds of facilities were de facto targets by deign of being in the target area (i.e., civil population in cities). So, I believe, the difference between what appears to be an impending and savage response by the Russians is little different from what we are already used to accepting as a given action of war.

The image of the dead baby being carried out of the Murrah building and the chilling picture of the people trying to get air in the floors above the fire at the WTC (there appears to be a woman holding a baby in one photo) are evidence enough to me that this deliberate child-killing tactic is being used on us already.

The real question is, are we willing to go to ANY lengths to stop this assualt on Western civilization and protect ourselves (and our children)? At the least, we MUST abandon politically correct limits on military actions. We MUST deny the enemy the freedom to define the limits of warfare (i.e., holy this, holy that, extremely holy whatever). Finally, we MUST act with overwhelming ferocity and anihilate the enemy, and his support, wherever they are found. To do less is to continue to encourage the barbarism of Islamofascism.

The great canard in current thinking is that by brutal actions we become like our enemies. This is laid to rest when the question is examined in light of what we, and they, are like in times of peace. For my money, life in America is as far from the continuing brutality and the low, mean animal barbarism of Islam as you can get. For these animals, the murder and torture never ends. This is why ancients were honest enough to admit to, and practice, the ruthless extermination that is needed in the face of implacable, inhuman enemies.

We can do no less if we wish to survive.

[jwpjr]

re: "We even hugged each other when we left"

The Russians showed a great deal more compassion to these people than the terrorists did to any of the hostages! This one sentence tells it all.

[SeattleNeedsHelp]

Page 3 of 3 -- ''It was a wrong thing to do. We don't approve of this at all," said Islam Islamov, a 27-year-old resident of the Chechen town of Turbino.

[Servant of the 9]

They were following the standard practice developed almost a century ago by the Bolsheviks and carried on by Stalin, who believed that every single act of terror should be responded to by an even bigger, more horrendous, more terrifying terrorist act ....

Sounds like a plan to me.
The trick is to make the reprisal big enough to get their attention, like, maybe, an entire city.

So9

[Eva]

The families of the terrorists are still alive, and it would seem that they are free and well. The torture seems to be limited to threats of violence, hardly comparable to the cowardly, murderous rampage of their relatives.

[ClancyJ]

I agree.

Society has to make a stand and fight the tactics these terrorists are using.

As long as terrorists can kill, maim, and torture without receiving any harm themselves, why should they quit? This is a war and we intend to win it.

What is the lure to being a terrorist - hate, revenge, a pompous belief that every complaint they have is worthy of any horrendous terrorist stunt, and a total disregard of others. Love, honor, humanity is not even a consideration in this lure.

Society has to find a way to stop the terrorist assault on the populace - whatever it takes. If it is a nuclear bomb, total destruction of terrorist breeding grounds and framework, torture - whatever - it must be done.

[ClancyJ]

..So, on the demented planet where liberals live, putting panties on someone's head is the equivalent of murdering defenseless children? These people vote?


..

Times like these are when we need the likes of a Lincoln, a Roosevelt, a Truman, a Bush - men that have the guts to make the hard decisions and carry through.