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Over There - New show on FX and my rant on those who reviewed the show prior to airing
7/28/2005 | Former Military Chick - Chele

Posted on 07/28/2005 12:23:29 PM PDT by Former Military Chick

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My main point of the above observations came from the fact that several of my friends, good hard working conservatives who support Bush and the war read negative reviews of the show prior to it's airing last night. They sent out emails stating not to watch it.

I found that odd, it is most difficult to discuss, complain about something if you have not watched it.

I certainly am not advocating watching the show but should you decide to do so, you might be surprised.

Another friend sent me the following:

OK, here is my take,

1) Started a bit antiwar mode, moved to smooth that out.

2) Pushed a racial divide a bit. But, having been in similar situations, I can buy that part.

3) The chat, though rough in content, was I remembered in war but using today's lingo.

4) Pushed the hardliner Sgt. too much and the do whatever it takes officer image just a bit over the edge. But, I served with both types in Nam.

5) War footage was graphic, cheating wifes back home common, the pain of leaving family at home realistic, the pain of watching your brothers get blown up or away realistic enough.

My Bottom Line on the whole is:

WAR IS HELL and by God we should be everything we can do for troops over there.

So with that in mind I look forward to my fellow Freeper's observations on this show.

1 posted on 07/28/2005 12:23:32 PM PDT by Former Military Chick
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To: Former Military Chick

Thanks for the contrarian view, I have not watched the show yet, but I have it programmed to record in my TiVo, and will find time to watch it, especially now having read your review.


2 posted on 07/28/2005 12:28:37 PM PDT by Paradox (I just neutered my cat, now he's a Liberal.)
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To: Former Military Chick
shows that portray the military, from way back

Someone is showing their youth.

Rat Patrol, Combat will take you back a few more years.

I'm sure that folks with more experience that I can go back a decade or so before that.

3 posted on 07/28/2005 12:30:39 PM PDT by PAR35
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Comment #5 Removed by Moderator

To: Former Military Chick
I missed the show, but want to watch it. I have seen many negative opinions (prior to airing), but have also seen reviews that said it was apolitical and accurate.

If it is anything like Band of Brothers, I will love it.

Thanks for your input.

6 posted on 07/28/2005 12:33:42 PM PDT by teenyelliott (Soylent green should be made outta liberals...)
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To: Former Military Chick

I am a Marine Desert Storm and Somalia vet.

I did not like the dope smoking scene in the beginning, it seemed to me like they were portraying the 60's stereotypes of the military. Societies rejects, (College and high school dropouts, dope smokers, hotheads etc.)

Hollywood has no idea about what it is really like "Over*There"

I am watching with an open mind and to know what the average sheeple might "learn" from this show. I will re-evaluate each week.

Semper Fi


7 posted on 07/28/2005 12:33:58 PM PDT by marine86297 (I'll never forgive Clinton for Somalia, my blood is on his hands)
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To: hugoball

I thought it was joke... had to turn it off after about 10 minutes.

came back to it later - had the same opinion - I gave it a chance - but won't waste my time again.

course that's just me.


8 posted on 07/28/2005 12:34:15 PM PDT by phasma proeliator (It's not always being fast or even accurate that counts... it's being willing.)
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To: Former Military Chick

We have family visiting and I doubt we'll get to watch tonight, but the review I read on FR by some soldiers was NOT good.


9 posted on 07/28/2005 12:37:39 PM PDT by Peach
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To: hugoball

That wasn't an RPG, it was a 40mm grenade fired from an M203 grenade launcher. And it was a great shot. :)


10 posted on 07/28/2005 12:39:02 PM PDT by Future Snake Eater (The plan was simple, like my brother-in-law Phil. But unlike Phil, this plan just might work.)
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To: Former Military Chick
I only saw parts of it from 11:15 on and I thought the "cheating wifes back home" was kind of tasteless. It's one of those things that may happen, but why bother..

I'll watch future episodes and put my 2 cents in down the road.

11 posted on 07/28/2005 12:39:12 PM PDT by b4its2late (Suicidal Blond Twin Kills Sister By Mistake!)
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To: teenyelliott

I just watched it on my DVR this morning. It is NOTHING like "Band of Brothers." Nothing would've made me happier had that been the case, but instead it was a Vietnam cartoon thrown into the present day. It's obvious these guys didn't even try to get it right.


12 posted on 07/28/2005 12:41:09 PM PDT by Future Snake Eater (The plan was simple, like my brother-in-law Phil. But unlike Phil, this plan just might work.)
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To: Future Snake Eater

Hey LT

I thought it was a 40mm, shot from a MK-19 mounted on a HUMMER.


14 posted on 07/28/2005 12:43:03 PM PDT by marine86297 (I'll never forgive Clinton for Somalia, my blood is on his hands)
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To: Former Military Chick

I thought the show to be balanced, the men were new to the theater and this explains a lot of their errors. The women should not have been there, and clearly the men would have moved them out if it were at all possible.

The beer run which ran into a IED is probably true as far as it goes. But one could hope that essentials (like beer) were handled by logistics and did not need a special "run".

Clearly showed the duplicity on the part of the enemy, made some political statements like "generals calling the shots based on how it will look", and questions over orders like "hold you fire" when the men were fired upon. Close up aspect of kill or be killed was probably correct for new recruits.


16 posted on 07/28/2005 12:43:25 PM PDT by KC_for_Freedom (Sailing the highways of America, and loving it.)
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To: Former Military Chick
War footage was graphic, cheating wifes back home common
Common? Certainly it occurs, but common?
18 posted on 07/28/2005 12:45:21 PM PDT by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: marine86297

No, the Humvee had a .50-cal mounted on it, and the Soldier who had just dismounted put a 40mm into the haji-in-question. The walking legs thing was pretty cool, too.


19 posted on 07/28/2005 12:46:03 PM PDT by Future Snake Eater (The plan was simple, like my brother-in-law Phil. But unlike Phil, this plan just might work.)
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To: hugoball

Whatever it was supposed to be it was a heck of a shot. Don't know how realistic the walking legs were, but for entertainment purposes, it was pretty good.


20 posted on 07/28/2005 12:46:06 PM PDT by marine86297 (I'll never forgive Clinton for Somalia, my blood is on his hands)
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To: Paradox
I appreciate your kind words. Having given my thoughts I did worry of the comments that might be shot at me, as it may not agree with the "military folks at large" but I did feel strongly that I share my thoughts if only to have folks see the program so that we can have an honest and frank discussion.

I look forward to your thoughts, I have also DVRed it for my beloved and as I said will share his thoughts after his return.

The remarks in blue come from a Vietnam Vet, who decided to watch the program after reading the various "previews" prior to airing and I found his thoughts refreshing. Especially his final statement WAR IS HELL and by God we should be everything we can do for troops over there.

21 posted on 07/28/2005 12:48:04 PM PDT by Former Military Chick (I salute all our Vets, those who walked before me and all those who walk after me.)
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To: Former Military Chick
That we have the same core beliefs but that we do not follow other's blindly, but more often I notice that not to happen.

I agree with you completely. ;)

22 posted on 07/28/2005 12:49:19 PM PDT by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: Former Military Chick
I watched the show and it depicted what happens in war. War, especially when you are a participant in it, is terrible.

I read the posts prior to airing and thought to myself there sure are many alpha dogs out today giving advice. LOL!

Let everyone think for themselves if "Over There" deserves an audience. I think it does.

23 posted on 07/28/2005 12:51:37 PM PDT by afnamvet (Jet noise...The Sound of Freedom™)
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To: Former Military Chick

I always thought JAG was a half way decent show...even with all the technical mistakes. I believe it was on the right side.

That said, on another thread, I said I would like to see a critique of the show by Iraq war veterans. I had one response, but I couldn't tell if it was from a combat vet.


24 posted on 07/28/2005 12:52:05 PM PDT by stylin19a (In golf, some are long, I'm "Lama Long")
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To: Future Snake Eater

Too bad.


25 posted on 07/28/2005 12:53:30 PM PDT by teenyelliott (Soylent green should be made outta liberals...)
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To: hugoball

OK, I know this is tacky..but after I almost tossed my cookies over that scene, I wondered if it were possible for the legs to keep going. Somebody please tell me that was Hollywood!


26 posted on 07/28/2005 12:54:19 PM PDT by blu (And the sound that you're hearing is only the sound of the low spark of high heeled boys....)
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To: Former Military Chick

"So with that in mind I look forward to my fellow Freeper's observations on this show"

I admire your fair-mindedness. This kind of show is not my cup of tea and I won't watch it because I don't watch TV in general. However, I also noted with interest that thre was a lot of hostility to the show even though it hadn't aired. I think a lot of that was not so much because of the show content, which was an unknown, but because of the show's producer, which IS known.


27 posted on 07/28/2005 12:54:58 PM PDT by Owl558 (Please excuse my spelling)
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Comment #28 Removed by Moderator

To: oh8eleven

Those remarks came from a friend, a Vietnam Vet. Those are his recollections. Perhaps I can get a clarification from him or ask that he respond to that observation.

I would have to say from my point of view as a former head of the Family Support Group (has been renamed many times) that the younger gals, those without kids perhaps fell to temptation. The other pitfall, the finances. The troops bring in a bit more money, sep pay, hazardous duty pay and it goes into the accounts. Many needed a great deal of assistance of using a checking account. It always amazed me of how many young couples to the military had the military member taking care of everything. In the end, it is the rear detachment and folks like myself that had to step in and help. I could share some frightening stories but they are not the norm but tragic nevertheless.

Thank you for your comments.


29 posted on 07/28/2005 12:58:21 PM PDT by Former Military Chick (I salute all our Vets, those who walked before me and all those who walk after me.)
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To: afnamvet
I still can't watch that kind of stuff. The Doc says it 're-traumatizes' me.

From the collection of comments, I do have to say that everyone in Nam did not smoke pot and do other drugs. As I recall, most of us did drink. I recall the one guy who did neither.

Drugs/pot were very readily available and very cheap. Also, a case of beer was about the same cost as a case of soda. We did have ration cards for cigarettes and booze.

Anyway, anything that protrays the ugliness of war and the human costs, as well as the human triumphs in awful circumstances, gets my vote.
30 posted on 07/28/2005 1:00:24 PM PDT by Stashiu (RVN, 1969-70)
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To: marine86297

Thank you for your service and thank you for your comment.

Seems like every military show has a bit of pot use. Frankly it is not as common now just because of the consequences and I am not sure how available it is in Iraq. Had not thought much about that and will ask beloved if he knows when he calls.

I appreciate your open mind. It also makes such difference to openly discuss this program and if there is something that should be addressed we can certainly make a grass roots effort to get our point across.

There are many that will watch this show, think it all truth and frankly there are artistic liberties taken in almost every program. But we can keep them on the right path should we choose to want to take on that task.


31 posted on 07/28/2005 1:01:54 PM PDT by Former Military Chick (I salute all our Vets, those who walked before me and all those who walk after me.)
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To: teenyelliott

I have always enjoyed your comments and this is no different, thank you.

I appreciate that you will keep an open mind, and I hope will return with your thoughts on the show after you view it.

I am with you, Band of Brothers is an excellent series. I actually bought the whole series for beloved along with a DVD player because I knew he would love it. Now I have picked up personal DVD player and he will take this along on his next trip and share with the troops while there. He could use his military laptop but frankly it should not be used for anything other than military stuff so the personal player seemed a small cost to bring enjoyment to my beloved and his fellow troops.


32 posted on 07/28/2005 1:04:59 PM PDT by Former Military Chick (I salute all our Vets, those who walked before me and all those who walk after me.)
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To: Peach

Peach, I know you to be a woman of character and if given the opportunity with time avaiable you might watch it and I know will do so with an open mind. You are one fair chick.

Thanks for the comment and of course enjoy your visiting family, friend.


33 posted on 07/28/2005 1:06:14 PM PDT by Former Military Chick (I salute all our Vets, those who walked before me and all those who walk after me.)
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To: KC_for_Freedom



As I read your comments, and they are indeed excellent remarks it gave me pause.

I am not sure, if given the chance I would try and produce a show such as this. I say that because, WAR IS HELL. There are SOP (standard operating procedures) but sometimes SNAFUS (will not translate that one) and it would be hard to really convey that in a drama series.

Having said that, I agree I thought it to be balanced. Of course I wonder, how will next weeks offering be? While I am a tough critic will the audience return for the story or the character's or both.

I have to say about the beer, I do not recall Dave having beer while he was there, did not ask him. But, boy did he look svelte after he returned not having the enjoyable beer as he watches his beloved Orioles.


34 posted on 07/28/2005 1:11:06 PM PDT by Former Military Chick (I salute all our Vets, those who walked before me and all those who walk after me.)
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To: Former Military Chick

The only consideration should be whether it's positive or negative toward President Bush's effort in Iraq. If it's positive, it should be applauded. If not, it should be condemned.


35 posted on 07/28/2005 1:11:07 PM PDT by balch3
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To: stylin19a

I will provide you with one once my beloved returns from his current TDY.

As for JAG, I concur with your thoughts. It was a long running show, frankly one of the longest running shows depicting the military. When the show was getting it's footing Ollie North through his expertise to the show behind the scenes and sometimes in front of the camera.

Might be interesting to read his comments if he watched the program.


36 posted on 07/28/2005 1:14:18 PM PDT by Former Military Chick (I salute all our Vets, those who walked before me and all those who walk after me.)
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To: Owl558
I admire your fair-mindedness. This kind of show is not my cup of tea and I won't watch it because I don't watch TV in general. However, I also noted with interest that thre was a lot of hostility to the show even though it hadn't aired. I think a lot of that was not so much because of the show content, which was an unknown, but because of the show's producer, which IS known.

Such a classy comment, thank you. I agree, I think many of ill will towards Bochco, my beloved being one of them. But, he too, was willing to watch and offer his thoughts of course it will be a few weeks he is away with his Army job.

The content is rough. FX frankly has really gone to the edge of graphic in all their shows. The Shield is not my cop of tea. I enjoy Leary and have high regard for firefighters but Rescue Me is equally a tough watch. So, I had no doubt the one thing this show would do, show the graphic side of war, to the edge.

37 posted on 07/28/2005 1:20:39 PM PDT by Former Military Chick (I salute all our Vets, those who walked before me and all those who walk after me.)
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To: Former Military Chick
I watched only 10 minutes and then turned it off:

dope-smoking trooper (dumb),

Sgt. constantly berating his squad for no reason (dumb),

single infantry squad left alone with no armor/APC support against a building full of Islamos (dumb),

officer ordering troopers to advance 25m for no apparent reason (other than it being an order) even if it exposes them (dumb),

weak female trooper too tired to dig her own fox hole despite being exposed near the "mosque" where Islamos were shooting at them earlier (dumb),

female and male trooper start loudly arguing about digging a foxhole thereby exposing their position to the nearby Islamos (dumb).

DUMB

38 posted on 07/28/2005 1:24:24 PM PDT by DTogo (U.S. out of the U.N. & U.N out of the U.S.)
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To: phasma proeliator

Agree.
Would appreciate hearing from, and believe we would all defer to, any 3rd Infantry Iraq vets, but my Hollyweird BS needle was in the red.
At least there were no singing nurses or smart-a** surgeons.


39 posted on 07/28/2005 1:27:48 PM PDT by tumblindice
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To: All
Reference the "beer run" and being handled normally. It is a general order (applying to all US military deployed under US chain of command) in Iraq - no alcohol. This includes beer.

As to the rest of the show. Not bad. Worth watching so far.

40 posted on 07/28/2005 1:29:09 PM PDT by DK Zimmerman
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To: Former Military Chick
Hello there,
I'll probably not watch it as I've no interest, but I feel no show will ever depict the fact of what it's like, in a real War. And I must say, gladly so.

If a person was able through film, TV or even a book, to have another person really feel what experiencing a war is like, without really being in one. Why would anyone wish that upon another person.

The saying, " War is Hell". came about for a reason.
Those who "know", know what is depicted is not representative of the facts. Those who don't, enjoy the show if you do and be glad you don't know the deference.
41 posted on 07/28/2005 1:30:13 PM PDT by OldSgt. (USMC, Nam Vet, HMM-165)
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To: Former Military Chick
I watched it, I didn't have a problem with what was shown, only that what was shown was totally empty. There was no part of that show that indicated that anyone knew what we were doing there or why. The violence as a bit graphic (the AIF who had the top of his body blown off but the legs kept going) but I can handle that part.

What I didn't like was the guy who called himself and his fellow soldiers monsters, to me that was a little over the top, but it would have been acceptable if he would have figured out before the end of the show that the only monsters around are the terrorists.

42 posted on 07/28/2005 1:30:25 PM PDT by McGavin999
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To: tumblindice

I watched it. This show has one purpose. It’s to lower the morale of the American people. Especially the American soldier.


43 posted on 07/28/2005 1:35:50 PM PDT by Skinn_dogg
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To: Former Military Chick
As far as JAG goes, it was also one of my favorite shows during the Clinton Error. It was produced by Donald P. Bellasario (Magnum P.I., Quantum Leap) so it was definitely not the kind of PC, left-wing series that we saw so much of during the Clintoon Error.

I managed to catch the ending of Wednesday's episode. It looked like the "Vietnam in the Desert" mentality to me.

44 posted on 07/28/2005 1:36:37 PM PDT by WestVirginiaRebel (Carnac: A siren, a baby and a liberal. Answer: Name three things that whine.)
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To: Former Military Chick

The beer may just be a symbol for something they want but can't get. (I realize that alcohol is taboo in Islamic countries but I thought I read that our troops create a warmer image within the confines of our bases. So,yes, I don't know about beer. But the risk and exposure of our convoys is well known.

I agree with you about the difficulty of producing a war series, (and producers could bias it both ways). I will watch some more episodes, but I will not watch any show that demeans our guys over there or our political motivation over here. Shows like the "highly fictional" JAG were good because they dramatized events that we were reading about. If this show wants to take on that task, knowing that their audience have friends, relatives, and countrymen over there, they had better bend over backwards to be fair. If they also want to show the risks, environment, and political conditions that lead to the decisions that are being made, maybe this will turn up the heat on our leaders to wage this war in the only way wars should be waged... to win and win with the least injury to our side as possible.


45 posted on 07/28/2005 1:38:00 PM PDT by KC_for_Freedom (Sailing the highways of America, and loving it.)
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To: Stashiu

I have a serious question for you.

I try to make it a point to thank Vietnam vets when I can. I've had 2 or 3 recent incidents, including one yesterday.

I was on a service call and the guy I met with mentioned that he was a vet. I thanked him and shook his hand. He lost his composure for a short while with the thousand yard stare. I've seen this happen before.

Does offering thanks to guys like yourself bring up too many bad memories or is it worth it for you guys?

BTW, thanks.


46 posted on 07/28/2005 1:38:41 PM PDT by cyclotic (Cub Scouts-Teach 'em young to be men, and politically incorrect in the process)
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To: afnamvet
I read the posts prior to airing and thought to myself there sure are many alpha dogs out today giving advice. LOL!

I admit I was one of those preaching against it before actually seeing it. But in my defense, I was responding to the reviews of it by U.S. soldiers who actually served in Iraq.

I said yesterday that "I refuse to watch this crap" but I ended up watching it after all. I watched it with a queasy feeling in my stomach, encouraged and entertained by some scenes, and disappointed and disgusted by others.

Before I watched it, I said I thought it was "propaganda aimed at breaking the hearts, eroding the spirits, and deluding the minds of the people back home about what is really going on 'over there'." After watching it, I think it is an over-dramatized but somewhat formulaic TV show that still might break the hearts, erode the spirits, and delude the minds of the people back home about what it is really like to be a soldier in Iraq.

My final pre-viewing comment was "The truth is, it's probably both much worse and much better over there, and no crappy TV show can capture an ounce of what it is really like."

That is the one statement I can still stand behind, except I might wait a few more episodes before confirming the "crappy" part. I may have been wrong about some things, and parts of it were definitely entertaining and seemed realistic, but it is still just a TV show...

And if I watch it again, I know it will be that with that same queasy feeling in my stomach, just waiting for Bochco to take one of those cheap shots -- at the men and women protecting his freedom to create such a show -- for which Hollywood has become so infamous.
47 posted on 07/28/2005 1:41:12 PM PDT by Thrusher (Remember the Mog.)
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To: balch3
The only consideration should be whether it's positive or negative toward President Bush's effort in Iraq.

The only consideration should be whether it is a good show with well-written characters.

My first impression watching it last night is that this show has a lot of potential.

48 posted on 07/28/2005 1:44:55 PM PDT by Modernman ("A conservative government is an organized hypocrisy." -Disraeli)
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To: Skinn_dogg

Have you seen `Baghdad Palace'? Same-same.
http://education.yahoo.com/reference/encyclopedia/entry?id=38675


49 posted on 07/28/2005 1:47:06 PM PDT by tumblindice
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To: Former Military Chick

I watched it....I don't know if I'll continue to watch...I had a few problems with it, but it might just be my nit picking.... all of the nicknames drove me crazy, very unreal... ROE was wrong, the gratuitous don't call me sir, I work for a living..the Abu Garib reference. etc...small things really but they got on my nerves...they no doubt wouldn't bother anyone who is not in the military...Hubby is now a Ft Campbell training, before he left I asked him if I should tape it for him and he said, no, why would I watch, I lived it....


50 posted on 07/28/2005 1:47:52 PM PDT by mystery-ak (Home of the free, because of the Brave)
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