[LS]

Easy, easy, easy to refute. BLS measures "employed" based on businesses that officially employ people. What they do NOT count is self-employed and family employed.

Beginning in the 1990s, there was a huge shift to mini-companies of 5 employees or fewer (often just one or two, often married or a father/son, etc.). These DO NOT show up on THIS labor measure, but they do show up on the other survey (I forget its name now) that asks, "Do you work full time?"

That's why there is a big, big gap between the "jobs" survey and the employment/unemployment numbers. People are working---it's just that a lot are not working for someone else. We used to call that self-sufficiency, and it was considered a good thing.

[N. Beaujon]

Thank you for helping me try to refute this bozo. Calling him names does nothing for our cause.

[generally]

Thank you!

It would be nice if more people could just politely answer rather than just typing IBTZ when the question asked is legitimate. It helps us all when we get into these arguments with liberals.

I would guess another reason for fewer jobs created is that fewer were needed. For example, if there were 10,000,000 unemployed at the beginning of the recovery, then you can only create a maximum of 10,000,000 jobs. If at the beginning of previous recoveries there were 20,000,000 unemployed, then it is possible to create more than 10M. I would think that a FAR better measure is the unemployment level. That isn't mentioned.

I don't know about the dates chosen. Are they legitimate? It is possible to cherrypick dates to show just about anything.

[kenavi]

That's why there is a big, big gap between the "jobs" survey and the employment/unemployment numbers. People are working---it's just that a lot are not working for someone else.

Right-o. There is a "Household Survey" by the gov't that captures the self-employed data, and which shows a historically strong surge in gainful employment. Here is one reference to it:

http://www.nationalreview.com/nrof_buzzcharts/buzzcharts200408240832.asp

Kery-ites have a blind spot to the self-employed. They confuse an entrepreneur whose business earns more than $200,000 a year with the "idle rich" (which is what HE is). They must think the chap has all his income lying about as cash in the vault and not re-invested in his business.