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Teacher Salaries: More Attention Needed to Specifics ( The Millionaire Next Door)
EducationNews.org ^ | June 16, 2006 | David W. Kirkpatrick

Posted on 06/17/2006 5:15:15 AM PDT by wintertime

One of the ongoing controversies in the public schools is the issue of teacher salaries. Teachers largely claim they are too low while taxpayers are equally vehement that they are more than adequate.

(snip)

Then there are the actual salary levels. Statistics in 2005 showed the average teacher salary in the nation was $46,762, ranging from a low of $33,236 in South Dakota to $57,337 in Connecticut. Even this ignores the additional compensation teachers receive as fringe benefits, which may add an additional 33% or more to the costs, primarily for very good retirement and health coverage plans. Further, averages include starting teacher salaries, which may begin at $30,000 or less, which teachers gladly mention, but ignore the high salaries of career teachers at or near the maximum on their salary schedule, important because retirement pensions are often based on the best three or so years.

(snip)

Last year, the New York State Department of Education issued a study that reported maximum teacher salaries in that state of $100,000 or more and median salaries as high as $98,000 per year. That is, there were districts, in Westchester County for example, where half of the teachers earned more than $98,000 a year.

A novel approach a few years ago by Michael Antonucci, director of the Education Intelligence Agency in California, compared teachers average salaries to average salaries all workers state by state. First prize went to Pennsylvania where the teachers received 62.5% more than the average employee. That difference is even greater when it is further considered that teachers average a 185 day work year while most workers put in 235.

(snip) Women who had been educators were 7.4% of the total deceased that year but 20.6% of them, nearly three times the statistical expectation were among the affluent few. Former male educators didn't do quite as well but even they were represented among the wealthy decedents by a ratio nearly 1.5 times the anticipated numerical ratio.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: education; educrats; govwatch; notbreakingnews; teacherpay; teachers
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To: wintertime
Wow! What an inflated opinion of yourself! Has it occurred to you that there are THOUSANDS of non-teachers who spend their days teaching? They are found in all areas of business and in the health professions. Their teaching is just as vital to the well=being of children and adults as yours. I did "go teach". I homeschooled 3 children until college. Do you know when they enrolled in college? At the ages of 13, 12, and 13. Two graduated at the ages of 18 with B.S. degrees in mathematics. The older of these earned a masters in math at the age of 20. All finished all general college requirements by the age of 15 and all levels of calculus to Calc III. The oldest is a national ranked athlete with a heavy travel and training schedule. He majored in business. He also spent 2 years in Eastern Europe on a church assignment and returned home completely FLUENT in Russian. Despite this eclectic experience he will finish his degree at the same age as his schooled contemporaries. Besides that, now that I am in the workforce, my entire day is spent teaching, both employees and patients.

Translation: "I raised 3 children who were precocious geniuses, so I must be a whole lot smarter than any of you people here. NYAH NYAH NYAH"

381 posted on 06/17/2006 7:26:56 PM PDT by Amelia (Education exists to overcome ignorance, not validate it.)
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To: Amelia

"I raised 3 children who were precocious geniuses,

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

My children are NORMALLY bright. It is institutionalized schooled children who are abnormally delayed in their social and academic development.


382 posted on 06/17/2006 7:31:43 PM PDT by wintertime (Good ideas win! Why? Because people are not stupid.)
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To: Palladin

Oh yeah, well one of my genius students (age 15) said to his 14-15 year old one night stand (while his girlfriend was in rehab for a brief spell) "What do you mean it's twins, we only did it once!!"

I swear to that comment and another teacher heard it in the hallway, as did all the other students around them.


383 posted on 06/17/2006 7:34:16 PM PDT by WV Mountain Mama (Sadly, doing the right thing means leaving one's comfort zone, which people all too often don't do.)
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To: wintertime

Do you have any achievements in your life, other than your children, who apparently made it through elementary & secondary school in record time but took 5 and 6 years to obtain 4-year college degrees, albeit at very young ages?


384 posted on 06/17/2006 7:35:12 PM PDT by Amelia (Education exists to overcome ignorance, not validate it.)
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To: moose2004
My sister in law teaches 10th grade English in southern California and makes $70,000 a year. Not bad.

70 grand per year for 183 days that average less than seven hours is roughly $55 bucks an hour. I love when teachers tell me how underpaid they are.....

385 posted on 06/17/2006 7:42:37 PM PDT by eeriegeno
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To: bwteim

I just checked you are not in California. My figures pertain to California only.


386 posted on 06/17/2006 7:46:06 PM PDT by Burlem
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To: LowOiL
LowOil said: "As far as I can tell, Alvindsv seems to be an outstanding asset to FR we may not see 100% eye to eye on every subject, but she is willing to debate subjects in a manner worthy of reading her posts."

Thank you very much for your kind words. I must point out though that I am male not female. Hopefull that does not change your opinion of me. :)

387 posted on 06/17/2006 8:08:05 PM PDT by alvindsv
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To: wintertime

Not in San Jose. The high schools are ugly. The only high in the area that is pretty is Los Gatos High School. It's older, probably built in the 30's and has beautiful Art Deco architecture with a beautiful front lawn.

In Dallas, they are acceptable, but nothing great.

In the newer communities outside of Dallas (Allen), they have beautiful high schools.


388 posted on 06/17/2006 8:30:43 PM PDT by luckystarmom
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To: MissEdie

I admire the stand you've taken on principle. I too was raised that unions were a bad thing, and in my workplace I see more bad in the unions than in management. Sometimes someone deserves to be fired!


389 posted on 06/17/2006 8:56:19 PM PDT by Kay Ludlow (Free market, but cautious about what I support with my dollars)
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To: rwfromkansas

ell, most CEOs take more out of their companies than they deserve. The same is true of most people when they are the ones who hired the people who keep the books.


390 posted on 06/17/2006 9:04:53 PM PDT by RobbyS ( CHIRHO)
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To: billbears
Matter of fact, I don't know one person outside of teaching that makes less than $40k.

Really? Even though I live in a high-income area, I know a lot of people who work for less than 40k. Many people who don't work for government make less than that. They're above minimum wage, but not up to 40. Don't you know anyone who works in retail, or in the service industry? How about the tourism industry? On a slightly related subject, that's one of the things I find frustrating in rural PA - the state keeps telling the rural areas that tourism will replace all the businesses that are closing or leaving the state, yet few in the tourist industry make a living. Most jobs are part-time with no benefits, yet they tell us not to worry about the business climate...

391 posted on 06/17/2006 9:07:00 PM PDT by Kay Ludlow (Free market, but cautious about what I support with my dollars)
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To: MissEdie

my son is a teacher as well...his insurance for dependents is impossible to afford...his rewards aren't in compensation

thanks for devoting your career to an honorable vocation and I hope that your co-workers don't drive you nuts


392 posted on 06/17/2006 9:12:12 PM PDT by KC Burke
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To: billbears
But less than $40,000 for 12 years of experience?

My husband sold auto parts for 15 years, and was required to maintain ASE certification. He made $23,000 full time after 15 years. Clearly North Carolina is on the low end of the salary scale for teachers. Pennsylvania is at the top (that's in the article). I'm from PA, and I don't see increased quality teachers from higher pay - I see more people attracted to the union environment for the high pay and easy working conditions. Higher pay doesn't not attract more dedicated people, it attracts more people interested in higher pay.

393 posted on 06/17/2006 9:14:19 PM PDT by Kay Ludlow (Free market, but cautious about what I support with my dollars)
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To: wintertime
One of the ongoing controversies in the public schools is the issue of teacher salaries. Teachers largely claim they are too low while taxpayers are equally vehement that they are more than adequate.

That is putting it mildly. Teachers are well paid by any standard.

394 posted on 06/17/2006 9:15:35 PM PDT by BJungNan
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To: moose2004
My sister in law teaches 10th grade English in southern California and makes $70,000 a year. Not bad.

Not bad at all. And when you consider that she does not work a full year to get that salary, it is even more on an actual days worked basis. Not to mention great benefits.

395 posted on 06/17/2006 9:17:30 PM PDT by BJungNan
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To: 9999lakes
Well 1 more word -- $400,000,000 -- The amount of money given to 1 EXXON employee as a parting gift, while the oil industry was accepting fed tax subsidies and pushing their "low profit margins".

Are you sure you are not on the wrong thread? Where they heck did that post come from?

396 posted on 06/17/2006 9:18:51 PM PDT by BJungNan
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To: billbears
And at the end of our careers, our salaries, compensation, and 401ks show it. And many teachers don't have that.

Well, we just come at this with different experiences from different states. I know many states don't have generous teacher retirement plans. On the other hand, I live in PA. With the latest boost in state retirements (thanks to our greedy state legislature who voted it in for their own benefit) teachers will make the same in retirement that they will working. That means the average citizen making $34,000 a year (and that's actually household income) in PA who retires at 2/3 of their working salary will still be paying property taxes to support the average teacher making $44,000 a year (I think that's the PA state average) at full salary for the rest of their life.

There must be a happy middle ground somewhere...

397 posted on 06/17/2006 9:29:59 PM PDT by Kay Ludlow (Free market, but cautious about what I support with my dollars)
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To: raybbr
Why do you not applaud a teacher that betters himself and his family for making as much money as he can?

For starters, because I pay the bill. Teacher salaries at $70,000 hit me much harder in the pocket book than does $400 million paid to one top exec at an oil company.

The oil companies salary, while excessive in my view, equals not 1/1000th of 1 cent of the price of a gallon of gasoline.

On the other hand, one of the largest budget items in my state is the cost of public education. The state tax on a gallon of gasoline amount to about 40 cents a gallon.

398 posted on 06/17/2006 9:32:40 PM PDT by BJungNan
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To: wintertime
Or lets look at a daycare. My local daycare charges me $20 a day. So, $20 times 25 students is $500 a day, at 185 days is $92,500. Please, pay me like a daycare...

If it is a teacher posting this nonsense, then it is no wonder our children are having such a hard time with math.

399 posted on 06/17/2006 9:34:17 PM PDT by BJungNan
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To: alvindsv
This past year as a teacher, I often found myself in my classroom at 5:30 am getting ready for the school day. (School started at 8:20) and often times not leaving until 4:30 or 5:00 pm. Then, go home eat dinner, and grade papers the rest of the night. So on an average day, I might put in anywhere from 15-18 hours. It's worse for coaches.

I see why you quit being a lawyer. You are not very convincing.

I see the teachers go to school every day. It is about 30 minutes ahead of the students, if that. And they are all headed out of the school very soon after the final bell. I'd love to go against you in a trial with your contention that teachers put in 15-18 hours a day.

400 posted on 06/17/2006 9:37:25 PM PDT by BJungNan
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