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A Return to Triangulation (libertarion vs social right)
National Review Online ^ | 10/25/06 | David Boaz & David Kirby

Posted on 10/25/2006 11:10:46 AM PDT by Blackirish

As the Republican base fragments and Christian conservatives consider a “fast” from politics, the polling data point to a mid-term Republican thumping. Less than two weeks from now, Republicans will begin their post-mortem soul searching. And as the corpses of their House and Senate majorities grow cold, so should Karl Rove’s 2006 campaign strategy.

(Excerpt) Read more at article.nationalreview.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: badbadbad; besthijack; bestthread; blackirish; bloggers; braad; creation; darwin; darwincentral; darwinhomebase; doublehijacked; evolution; frhero; frlegend; hero; hijack; hijacked; hijackedthread; legend; libertian; minifreepathon; monthlydonorthon; nationalrepuke; rehijacked; religion; science; socialright; threadjacked; threadjacking
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To: onyx
This is my favorite....lol

ROTFL!!!!

I kinda like this one too.......




This account has been banned or suspended.
Okay
You Got Banned!
Aww Gee....
Poor Widdle Twoll
Him Got Banned

141 posted on 10/25/2006 2:56:02 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: Fiddlstix

LOL!!!!! First time I have seen that!


142 posted on 10/25/2006 2:58:56 PM PDT by onyx (We have two political parties: the American Party and the Anti-American Party.)
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To: Dominic Harr

All social issues are "political". You're just playing word games. This is a Conservative forum.....and not the place to push your homosexual agenda.


143 posted on 10/25/2006 2:59:42 PM PDT by Godebert
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To: muir_redwoods; Beagle8U
... on the Religious Christians that make up 85% of the entire American population.

Is that why Gore came within an inch of winning and Congress is nearly evenly divided?

144 posted on 10/25/2006 3:01:38 PM PDT by Virginia-American (Don't bring a comic book to an encyclopedia fight)
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To: muir_redwoods
"Can you back up that stat? 85%? Really? I don't think so."

I think I've seen articles that say that percentage of Americans consider themselves Christian.

I could be wrong, but I don't think so.

If America wasn't a religious (Christian/Jewish) nation, queer marriage wouldn't have been crushed in every vote when it was on the ballot.

I'm not going to turn this into a religion/evo thread.

People can argue to make a monkey of themselves on the threads designed for that.
145 posted on 10/25/2006 3:06:35 PM PDT by Beagle8U (Demonrats want the Gays out of Congress.....stand back and let them purge their base.)
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To: Jim Robinson

I cherish a day when our children once again will restore as heroes the sort of men and women who - unafraid and undaunted - pursue the truth, strive to cure disease, subdue and make fruitful our natural environment and produce the inventive engines of production, science, and technology.

-- Barry Goldwater

The party of Lincoln must be the party of science and reason. To be otherwise is to cede these positions to the Democrats. Already the Democrats are painting the conservative movement as hostile to science, and they will do so every chance they get. It is crucial not to give them the opportunity.

However, there are many people on your website who are playing right into their hands. Everday on your site, pro-science people are savaged as idolators, Nazis, communists, or worse. There are people on your site stumping for the Moonies. People who claim doctors are unable to cure disease and that surgery is sinful. There are people who argue that the Apollo missions were a fraud, that the bible condones slavery, that oil comes from rocks, that the HIV virus doesn't cause AIDS, that crop circles and alien abduction are real, that astrology is science, that the earth is the center of the universe.

Jim, your site is in danger of becoming a crank site. Bad posters drive away good posters. Bad moderation exacerbates the problem. What do you think people are going to notice when they log on to your site? They are going to remember some nut who says dinosaurs walked with humans. They're not going to remember the poster who quietly states science are religion aren't in conflict, because that is human nature. The trolls are going to stick out like a sore thumb. They will take home the lesson that your site is chocked full of anti-science nutcases, and they will extrapolate that to conservative movement as a whole.

If you truly believe "evolution is socialist dogma" you have bought into a bill of goods. The vast majority of people working in science and engineering disciplines have religious faith. They understand what Darwin's theory says. They don't worship Darwin, as is often posted on your site. That notion is not going to win any votes. To the contrary, it is going to lose votes. It's bad for this website, and it's bad for the conservative movement. I urge you to reconsider your position, and clean up some of the trolls on your site.

The only conflict between science and religion is that which people manufacture.

146 posted on 10/25/2006 3:07:27 PM PDT by Liberal Classic (No better friend, no worse enemy. Semper Fi.)
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To: Godebert
All social issues are "political". You're just playing word games.

That's where I'd disagree with you.

To me, it's a matter of the proper role of govt. There are things the govt should not be empowered to regulate. Small govt, and all that. Marriage, to me, is one of those. I don't care if you "marry" your goat. As long as I'm free to avoid associating with you.

Y'see, I could now retort by calling you a political 'liberal', cuz you support govt intrusion into private matters.

But I would be wrong in doing so.

I believe in the contract with America. We have a common goal (assuming you, too, believe in the contract). We can agree on many 'conservative' political policies. Like the war on terror, opposing gun control, freedom of religion, etc.

I think we should get together on the things we agree on, while earnestly debating the things we disagree on. Name-calling just isn't productive.

147 posted on 10/25/2006 3:13:54 PM PDT by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Liberal Classic

I bought into the "bill of goods" a long time ago. If the site goes down because I don't believe the Marxist lies, so be it.


148 posted on 10/25/2006 3:14:02 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
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To: Dominic Harr
"To me, it's a matter of the proper role of govt. There are things the govt should not be empowered to regulate. Small govt, and all that. Marriage, to me, is one of those. I don't care if you "marry" your goat. As long as I'm free to avoid associating with you."

That is back to the Libertarian/conservative/Republican meat of the thread.

I care about someone marrying a goat( or all the other perverted ideas) because of the government funded costs that every tax payer will share in that.

I don't want to see it, I don't want to be taxed for promoting it in the socialist/communist controlled public schools.

Until you can totally remove any and all tax payer funding (tax breaks etc) from these warped ideas, you will never sell the "live and let live" concept of Libertarianism.
149 posted on 10/25/2006 3:33:42 PM PDT by Beagle8U (Demonrats want the Gays out of Congress.....stand back and let them purge their base.)
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To: Beagle8U

That is the rub with libertarianism. Yes, you shouldn't be forced to wear a helmet while you are on your "donorcycle" as the ER doctors call them, but if you are making me help foot the bills, you sure are going to wear one if I have something to say about it.

Libertarian freedoms can only be advanced with responsibilities, there can't really be halfsies on this.

I am pro legalization for pot, but I also think every employer can make you pee in a cup if you want the job.


150 posted on 10/25/2006 3:37:36 PM PDT by dogbyte12
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To: Jim Robinson

Please understand what I am not saying. I am not saying Christianity or Judaism is a bill of goods. I am addressing only this notion that a particular branch of science is a socialist lie.

Frankly, you are wrong. Evolutionary theory is enormously useful. It has practical applications beyond well biology, extending into such diverse fields computer science and oil exploration.

I am willing to agree to disagree. Furthermore, the site is not going to go down because you don't believe in marxism. I am solidly anti-marxist, myself, but that's beside the point. The point is if you don't rope in the cranks, it's going to give your site a black eye. Being a relatively prominent site, it's going to give the conservative movement a black eye by proxy.

If you are going to run a broad-based conservative site, you need to have a big tent. The problem is the bigger the tent, the more clowns you get. Even if you, or the moderators, such as the Religion Moderator (Hi A-G! *hugs*) are creationist, you need to lay the smack down on some of these anti-science posters. They are turning some threads into cesspools, just like they did a few years ago. I even suspect it may be some of the same people, posting under new names. In short, they are taking advantage of your sympathy to wage their own personal war against science using your resources.

They hurt your site. Even if pro-science people like me are a minority on your site, we're a substantial minority. Judging by that poll a few weeks back, fully one out of every three of us is in the pro-science camp. While it may be safe to purge libertarians, I don't believe it is wise to chase pro-science posters away from your site by allowing them to crap all over science theads.

Now, I'm not blaming you personally. This same argument is going on at large. The debate here is just a reflection of the debate in the conservative movement at large. As the owner of a relatively prominent conservative site, you have the ability to affect a large number of people by setting the tone of your site. If you don't discourage anti-science cranks, it is going to harm the conservative movement. Maybe not in the election coming up soon, or even in '08, but if the Republican party becomes known as the anti-science party it's going to hurt.


151 posted on 10/25/2006 3:43:14 PM PDT by Liberal Classic (No better friend, no worse enemy. Semper Fi.)
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To: Liberal Classic

Don't forget homosexuality and global warming. I'm sure the theory of evolution is a great boon to those Marxist theories as well.


152 posted on 10/25/2006 3:51:26 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
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To: dogbyte12
"I am pro legalization for pot, but I also think every employer can make you pee in a cup if you want the job."

I have been the boss at more than one job, and the pee in a cup deal don't work very well if it costs the company $300-$500 every time for the tests.

With alcohol its easy and cheap to smell and test for, no so for pot etc.

Do you charge the employee $500 to be tested if everyone agrees they are acting goofy?

Its a more complex issue than some think it would be.
153 posted on 10/25/2006 3:52:17 PM PDT by Beagle8U (Demonrats want the Gays out of Congress.....stand back and let them purge their base.)
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To: Blackirish
Leave nanny statism to the dims.

Agreed.
154 posted on 10/25/2006 3:54:57 PM PDT by mysterio
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To: Jim Robinson
......If the site goes down because I don't believe the Marxist lies, so be it.

The saddest thing of all is that Marxism is still alive and well. God help us.

155 posted on 10/25/2006 4:01:26 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: Jim Robinson

Can you please tell me how the Marxists theorized about global warming and homosexuality? Marxist Leninist countries rounded up gays, and have filthier environments than we do. I am curious as to where Karl Marx came out in favor of gay marriage and earth day.


156 posted on 10/25/2006 4:03:42 PM PDT by dogbyte12
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To: Jim Robinson
Don't forget homosexuality and global warming. I'm sure the theory of evolution is a great boon to those Marxist theories as well.

Bodily fluids, Jim. Don't forget those!

157 posted on 10/25/2006 4:04:22 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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To: Blackirish
Still looking for the fantasy land of Libertania?

Some children never grow up.

158 posted on 10/25/2006 4:06:32 PM PDT by JCEccles
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To: VadeRetro

What does it matter, VR? You'll be worm food, cold and forgotten, in a few more decades as the cosmos plummets toward entropy death and utter Darwinian meaninglessness.


159 posted on 10/25/2006 4:08:20 PM PDT by JCEccles
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To: VadeRetro
Now you're stealing my lines. Write your own material.
160 posted on 10/25/2006 4:12:37 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
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