Posted on 04/18/2007 2:02:53 AM PDT by Cincinatus' Wife
The deadly shooting rampage at Virginia Tech on Monday has reignited an emotional debate about whether students should be allowed to carry concealed weapons on campus.
Virginia Tech, like most universities around the country, forbids students from having guns on campus. But as an increasing number of states have passed laws that allow people to carry concealed weapons, gun advocates from Virginia to Utah have also challenged the academic policies that prohibit weapons at colleges and universities.
[Big Snip]
"Almost every college that has looked at this issue feels they can do a better job of protecting their students by banning guns on campus and taking responsibility to provide good security," says Paul Helmke, president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence in Washington. "I'm not sure any campus would like to advertise, 'Come to our campus. We have more guns per capita than any other campus.' "
When the issue is debated again as expected this year in Virginia, gun-control advocates will be lining up with members of the academic community in opposing an expanded presence of guns on campus. They believe the problem is that the country already has too many guns.
"We have access to these weapons, and there are people who get angry, and with that access they will use them," says Jim Sollo, vice president of Virginians Against Handgun Violence, a group with 800 members that advocates gun-control measures. "I fear that we will continue to have mass shootings here in the United States."
But gun advocate Mr. Van Cleave contends that control is not the solution. "Gun control only works with the good guys," he says. "Good people obey the laws. The people you're worried about don't. I don't think [the campus shooting] is going to bode well for gun control."
(Excerpt) Read more at csmonitor.com ...
Did you read my entire post?
Courtrooms are places where, many times, threats have been issued against the defendant, or the judge, or the jury. The entire court house I don't agree with.
Centers of state or federal government are places where assassination attempts are the most likely to happen. Key governmental persons are there on a regular basis and their schedules and routes are, many times, known before hand.
Buut the state, as an entity, should not base the right to carry a weapon on the basis of, "It COULD happen anywhere."
Monday, the Gun Control groups clearly had the upper hand.
Little derringers are cute and may be better than nothing at all, but my actual carry gun of choice, considering all the choices and implications, is a little bigger and better for actually shooting with.
No you clearly haven’t. I said NON-STUDENT ADULTS ON CAMPUS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO CARRY.
I’d consider students who were over 21, but would need more time to think on it.
Well... thanks for at least acknowledging what I was saying. Dorms are a little different in that they're a lot more casual and social than any off-campus apartment I've ever lived in. My only point is that they do have some issues to consider if I was a kid living in one and wanting to keep a gun there. THAT'S ALL I WAS SAYING.
We may argue back and forth about whether students - or anyone else for that matter - should be allowed to carry concealed weapons. Certainly, there are solid, practical arguments being made by brilliant scholars against this that may even carry the day.
That does not change the fact that 32 innocent people were killed by a single man with a Glock because they did not have the means to adequately defend themselves.
It does not change the fact that over 3000 people were killed by people with nothing more than boxcutters, because the passengers and crews did not have the means to adequately defend themselves.
Even though it is a fundamental precept of our Constitution that all human beings have the God-given right to do so.
My points are valid too. IMO. As yours are IYO. And some of yours are valid even IMO.
My overall view remains the same when taking all points into consideration. For now. I could be convinced but you aren’t doing it for me (I’m blunt, but I try not to be rude until I’ve been attacked needlessly too many times).
"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus
Well, I’ve said students and non-students over 21 from the beginning. Don’t get angry, we almost agree.
Just gotta get you over being against over 21 year old students.
That may be a point (but how do you judge responsibility - having a gun license doesn’t mean you’re not a “partying” idiot otherwise). But I’m afraid as Hair points out, the conditions of dorm life (and maybe daily campus between-class activities) may make them too easily fall into the hands of the other half. Even if done in innocence. (Most of what I would fear would be accidents, not intentionals - although that would happen with a@$holes who don’t like how you look at them.)
The ‘other half’ almost certainly has access to crack, guns, heroin, whatever, whenever.
Legally or not.
To me, it’s still best to be able to protect yourself and train people to be responsible.
Haven’t noticed all the riots over the last 5 years when their team even WINS much less LOSES?
Yup, because I’ve had it.
I'm still waiting for you to retract this and admit you have misread and misstated my opinion. I have never 'called for' any extra legal requirements for anyone. I have merely discussed the practical considerations and responsibilities we all have if we choose to exercise that right.
Apology?
Sorry I don’t have a litany of lawsuits on my desk to read off, nor am I versed in them. Doesn’t mean they don’t exist. At least coming to trial.
If it can happen over hot coffee, it can happen over someone getting shot. It should be obvious how people are so sue-happy these days - and juries (the same “peers”) are so much more worried about “safety” and emotions than laws.
Very good points. If nuts are allowed to roam like this, is it safe to have unguarded target zones anywhere?
And this is even considering the jihadists who are obviously watching and thinking “think of another Beslan situation there”
The facts just don’t agree. You need to understand concealed carry laws are written, and they provide places without bans protection against lawsuit at the top.
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