Posted on 09/03/2007 3:19:20 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
Today was an eventful day. I drove to Cleveland, reunited with my father’s side of the family and got arrested. More on that arrested part to come.
For the labor day weekend my father decided to host a small family reunion. My sister flew in from California and I drove in from Pittsburgh to visit my father, his wife and my little brother and sister. Shortly after arriving we packed the whole family into my father’s Buick and headed off to the grocery store to buy some ingredients to make monkeybread. (It’s my little sister’s birthday today and that was her cute/bizare birthday request.)
Next to the grocery store was a Circuit City. (The Brooklyn, Ohio Circuit City to be exact.) Having forgotten that it was my sister’s birthday I decided to run in and buy her a last minute gift. I settled on Disney’s “Cars” game for the Nintendo Wii. I also needed to purchase a Power Squid surge protector which I paid for separately with my business credit card. As I headed towards the exit doors I passed a gentleman whose name I would later learn is Santura. As I began to walk towards the doors Santura said, “Sir, I need to examine your receipt.” I responded by continuing to walk past him while saying, “No thank you.”
As I walked through the double doors I heard Santura yelling for his manager behind me. My father and the family had the Buick pulled up waiting for me outside the doors to Circuit City. I opened the door and got into the back seat while Santura and his manager, whose name I have since learned is Joe Atha, came running up to the vehicle.
(Excerpt) Read more at newsite.michaelrighi.com ...
“””You cannot leave Fry’s without a bag check either.”””
“””You can’t with Walmart either.”””
My policy is, when they ask to see my receipt, I tell them to walk with me. Usually, they just reply they can't leave their spot, so I keep on walking. Works most times.
Oh, and whenever they look at my receipt, I ask them not to put any marks on it. If they use their highlighter, and assuming that I have the time, I just ask for an unmarked receipt (while standing in the door). After all, the receipt is my property too.
“You cannot leave Fry’s without a bag check either.”
Last year I was at the local Walmart and they tried that check the bag s**t on me on the way out. I let the person check, then I turned around, went straight to the customer service counter which was a few feet away, plopped the bags on the counter and said “Take this stuff and give me a refund.” When they asked why, and the door person was right there, having followed me, I told them “Any business that automatically assumes thier customers are thieves is not getting my business. There are plenty of other stores.” Took my refund and left.
Since when is Circuit City part of the GOVERNMENT, which is what the Constitution keeps in check.
Since this thread is back....I’ll repost here; as I already sent this to you privately, no response is necessary, lh.
It’s possible it’s a fund raising ploy for the ACLU; for that reason alone I would never contribute to this guy.
But I think he raises a valid point concerning police authority to arrest when ID is not produced when no crime has even been committed. There doesn’t appear to be an Ohio law that forces consumers to allow their property, once purchased, to be subject to inspection, or consumers to be illegally detained, otherwise I’m sure the cop would have made sure to include that on the charges pressed against him.
This guy did not commit a theft, and the store had no suspicions or evidence of such. He merely did not allow his bag to be inspected or produce a receipt.
That, in itself, is not grounds for suspicion of theft to warrant detaining. Stores have to have actual suspicion of a theft HAVING already occurred...meaning, the person must be outside the property, and this same person must have been observed to take property for which they did not pay.
I dislike the idea of being forced to produce identification to police for no reason. IMO, there was no legal reason that the cop arrested this guy. Unless there is an Ohio law that we do not yet know about....but then, again, the cop would have charged him for more than a failure to produce ID.
I’ve found that at Walmart and other stores including Circuit City, CompUSA, etc., if I walk out holding the receipt in my hand or “reading” it, I never get stopped. I’ve pretty much removed their cause for concern, and in fact turned the tables by seeming to check my receipt to see that *I* didn’t get ripped off.
The only place you can’t do that is BJ’s (and perhaps other shopper’s clubs) that have a policy of checking your cart and marking your receipt when you leave.
Ohio Shoplifter Detention Law
http://downloads.ohiobar.org/pub/busres/fineprint/osba_fine_print_issue005.pdf
I agree with those who support the receipt/bag checks. I get receipts checked at Sams, Costco, Walmart and Best Buy, among others, all the time. Assuming it is a search under the Constitution, it isn’t unreasonable, to my mind. There’s no expectation of privacy in goods just purchased from a store.
But the the main thing I see here is someone just looking to be upset, and to have family members upset. This guy seems to have WANTED to be harmed. He wasn’t.
Well obviously it is illegal to be an ass if you are refusing to show your ID to an officer. So yes because he feels that Best Buy’s policy of checking bag contents is wrong he gives a guy trying to make an earning a hard time, wastes the time of the police officers, hence forth costing me and you money and taking them away from places and people who may be in real need or committing a real crime all too serve the self-serving ass’s ego. Sorry real or fake but if somebody is actually doing this karma is going after them, not me.
Except for the following false arrest lawsuit. This guy was told he was being arrested for something that the law says he can't be arrested for. Then the cop, whose official business was to protect this guy from the people unlawfully detaining him, arrested him for interfering with that business, when the cop himself took no action in furtherance of that business.
When the state has the power to arrest you simply because you fail to provide your DL, even when not operating a vehicle, I will fight to have that law put aside.
Currently, the state does NOT have that power. Nor do businesses have the right to search you at random. If they suspect you of a crime, they can detain you, and then call the police.
This is a case that could easily have gone away, if the victim here had just bent over and followed the demands of those who were trying to unlawfully detain him, or to the demands of the policeman who was unlawfully demanding to see a DL of someone not in control of a vehicle.
It’s an individual’s right to choose which path to take, in the face of such wrongful detention, and maybe most of us would have chosen a different path.
I will not criticize a man who decides to take a stand on principle, when defending his rights.
I will question his judgement in contacting the ACLU, however, since they only defend the rights of those who wish to perpetuate evil.
“When exactly did it become illegal to be “an ass”?”
Well said, conservativeharleyguy.
Yep, they tried to charge him for something the law says they can't. Hopefully he wins his false arrest lawsuit and has this cop's job -- and a bunch of cash from CC and the employees' job for their criminal action (yes, this one is actually subject to criminal prosecution).
So who changed the title of the thread, you in search of donations for the ACLU, or the moderator to show how ridiculous you look?
I didn't. I don't like the donation angle either, as this guy is apparently fully capable of defending himself and pursuing the violations of his rights. You shouldn't be asking for money unless you really need it. Maybe we'll get lucky and the money will be used in the rare occasion where the ACLU actually defends real constitutional rights.
“...quit paying shyster lawyers to defend your “right” to not be offended.”
How about your right not to be detained?
Mostly, not only. They have their rare moments when they do good.
“...just buy it on the internet.”
That is doing nothing more than ignoring the problem. If you don’t want to give stores the right to detain you at random, or police to arrest you for failing to produce your papers, then you should protest this.
If these things don’t bother you, then you can shop in public places without fear of being offended.
But simply hiding from this is hardly a solution. Sooner or later, you may want to buy groceries, hardware, whatever, without waiting for the item to come in the mail.
LOL!!
>>The main purpose of checking the receipt is to stop employee theft. Cashiers fail to actually scan items and just bag them. Rather than assume the responsibility of monitoring the cashiers they place the burden on their customer.
The more common issue is having a customer colluding with a cashier. More stuff goes into the bad, than gets scanned.
I’m not saying I agree with the checking, but that’s another reason stores play that game.
I’d also say it’s a different deal when there’s a membership involved, like Costco or Sam’s. While I don’t think in most states, they have the right to stop you, they do have the right to revoke your membership.
I figured it was the mods who changed the title, since your style is always to try to hide your ACLU ties. Obviously it’s not working LOL.
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