Posted on 10/04/2007 5:25:13 AM PDT by Neville72
I don’t understand the outrage about Dobson’s statements. He wasn’t judging Thompson, he was just saying that Thompson didn’t appear to be a Christian and thus might have trouble getting the support of Evangelicals. Someone’s lack of involvement in any church might not matter to you but to many Evangelicals this is worth considering in deciding whether Thompson is the man that we want to support for President. Dobson’s other criticisms of Thompson have simply pointed out that Thompson puts a greater priority on his ultra-federalist positions than on protecting marriage or human life. Anyway, Dobson has a right to express his views and many social conservatives will agree with him. I am shocked and saddened that many here on FR are willing to compare a decent man like Dobson who has spent his life fighting to protect the family with a political hack like Jesse Jackson. It is this knee jerk hate of social conservatives which is slowly driving us out of the party. We frankly don’t feel very welcome and if we leave the party will lose.
Well said.
“I certainly will vote for Thompson should he be the nominee. I will vote for whomever the Party chooses to run because to not vote and hand the WH to the liberals is unthinkable.”
Even Rudy says he’ll build the fence and “identify every illegal alien.” I will vote for him before Hillary. He’s less likely than Hillary to grab my guns or raise taxes and will kick terrorist ass. Not my choice, but better than the alternative.
Thanks :-)
“Why is Thompson going out of his way to disenfranchise/or disconnect from Christians, especially knowing Dobson reaches millions of listeners daily.”
IMO, people like Dobson and conservative Christians are not FDT’s audience, they never have been and I suspect, never were meant to be. The moderate Republicans who recruited him are. It’s just now becoming more and more apparent. With each new Fred controversy (they seem to be never-ending), more of the truth about moderate Fred, his supporters, and their agenda, is revealed.
No, IMO, it was not the conservative Christians who were dissatisfied with promoting conservative Duncan Hunter, it was the moderate Republicans who were... who went in search of a moderate to recruit, a moderate who could attract and appeal to moderates from both parties. A moderate to compete against the other top tier moderates/RHINOs. A moderate with enough star power and name recognition to beat Hillary.
Unfortunately for Fred, his attempts at riding the fence, while keeping one foot in each camp, is evidently becoming his undoing, much to the ire of his fans. Apparently the moderates thought that if he prolonged announcing and avoided debates, conservatives would be fooled.
Dobson has an ego problem....too big! He is a name dropper. He speaks publicly too often. He has become an embarassment to believers just as Pat Robertson has. His organization represents many righteous causes......he just needs to button his lip when reporters are around!
I’m just looking at things realistically. And I’m not demonizing any Republican candidate at this point. I don’t like many of Rudy’s and McCain’s positions, but if someone chooses to support them in the primary, so be it.
And while I agree with many of Hunter’s and Tancredo’s positions too, I prefer Fred. But again, vote for whomever you feel is the best candidate in the primary. At the very least, it may help determine the VP pick.
But when it comes to the general, reality will most likely dictate that one of two people will be the next President. If there is a strong lefty third party candidate, then you might just convince me that a strong conservative third party could have a chance.
But absent that strong lefty third party candidate, the next President will be either the Dem or the GOP candidate. Period! Thats reality!
Bush certainly has not turned out to be the conservative we all hoped, but I’m much happier today with Bush’s Supreme Court picks than I would be with Gore’s or Kerry’s picks. I am much happier today with the Bush tax cuts than I would be with the Gore or Kerry tax increases. And ditto for several other issues.
So we can fracture and suffer 3+ Hillary Supreme Court picks, tax increases, socialized health care, retreat from the war on terror, more gun control, etc. Or we can grudgingly support our 80% friend over the 80% enemy, and maybe move a few issues in a conservative direction.
Its a sh*tty position to be in, but IMHO, its the realistic position. And if you’re feeling guilty about it, maybe deep down you know I’m right.
Exactly! Or as dschapin said just above you, if we leave the party, we lose!
"If he wants to call up and apologize again, that's ok with me. But I'm not going to dance to anybody's tune." That's my guy.
This...he did say.
I think you are contradicting yourself here!
If his "born again" is the reason of his belief concerning illegal aliens (there is NOTHING such thing as illegal immigrants,) then all the democRATS would be born again!!
In John 3:3 Jesus said to Nicodemus: "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God"!!!
If we leave the GOP will lose. And yes, in the short run, social conservatives will lose as well. However, if we elect someone like Rudy we will lose both the party and the country. If Rudy is nominated, the social conservative movement will face its moment of truth. I hope and pray that we will have the courage to do what is right regardless of the enormous pressure that will be placed on us to compromise and go along with the party.
Some people learned absolutely nothing from the Ross Perot debacle. Too bad. Hillary is exponentially worse than any Republican. Leaving the party and voting for a nut case isn’t the answer.
No, what’s hurting the party is the ignoring of all other things conservative and ONLY focusing on social issues. ALL are important.
Truth be told, a lot of issues near and dear to evangelicals just aren’t the Federal Government’s business.
See post 345.
“When Fred hooks up with the Hildabeast in the general, which candidate, pray tell, will Dobson support?”
Maybe the same candidate I’ll support, nobody. I’m tellin ya’ll, a vote for Thompson is a vote for Hitlery.
The problem is, Jimmy Carter isn’t a Christian and everyone should have known better. A non-Christian president who will uphold the constitution is and oxymoron. The founders believed that, so do I.
“The Bible says to judge not - lest ye be judged yourself.”
That doesn’t mean don’t judge, it means when you judge, you will also be judged. Thompson’s fruits are that of a Lost person and Dobson is right to say that. I’m really surprised because Dobson is as ecumenical/wishy washy as they come.
Voting for a “Christian” candidate is iffy but voting for a Christian candidate will work every time.
I would agree that we can’t focus on just social conservative issues. I think we need to dramatically cut the federal government. I would support all of the following changes: repealing No Child Left Behind, eliminating the Department of Education, eliminating the National Endowment for the Arts, phasing out Social Security, eliminating most federal subsidies, eliminating federal legislation which is based on an expansive view of the Commerce Clause, Repealing the Endangered Species Act, Eliminating OSHA, abolishing the IRS, and replacing the Income Tax with the Fair Tax.
However, I do think that we need to protect both life and marriage in the U.S. Constitution. Marriage is the bedrock of society and we can’t afford to have it defined 50 different ways. Nor can we afford to innocent babies to be slaughtered in any of our states. To do this would be to callously turn our backs on their God given Right to Life which was recognized in the Declaration and enshrined for all people in the 14th Amendment. To pass a Human Life Amendment would not be expanding the role of the Federal Government it would simply be making plain to everyone what should have been obvious from reading the 14th Amendment. That is that “No Person” (unborn children included) may be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law.
“So you think the GOP is going to be relevant without the Christian vote?”
Seriously, the Thompson nomination will be a slap in the face. I’ll see clearly that I’m not wanted and it’s not the party God would have me devote any time to. The Bible says be not unequally yoked with unbelievers, that means Thompson, Bush, Romney, and every other republican the majority of the party supports.
If Hunter gets the nomination, I’ll see that the party is worth staying in.
“Not a particularly diplomatic response for one wishing the votes of as many as possible and certainly not one to use on a fellow conservative Republican.
One wonders if Fred might have treated a member of the Log Cabin Republicans thus.
A more polite answer might have been phrased as, “I’m sure if Dr.Dobson and I were to have a personal conversation, we would agree on far more than we disagree.”
That’s a great post.
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