Ron Paul and the Lodestar of Liberty

American Thinker ^ | January 14, 2008 | Bruce Walker

[steve-b]

the ugly subculture of the ultra far right

That's the common description of this very site in the mainstream media. If you parrot it against some other target, nobody here is going to pay the least bit of attention to you.

[ksen]

War is with us, always has been, always will be and no matter how many pretzels you contort yourself into, that simply won’t ever EVER change!

If that's the case then you should be pushing to reinstitute the draft so we can get our military adequately staffed and put bases in every country in the world.

Believe it or not it is ok to allow other countries to fight their own battles once in awhile. It is ok to allow other countries to make decisions you might not like.

Your worldview as expressed above leads to empire and America was not founded to become an empire.

Are you shooting for a Pax Americana?

[ksen]

If they relied on their own defense they’d be totalitarian. Forget socialist, they’d be something much much worse!

History has proven this over and over and over...

How did the world ever get along without America on the world stage for all those centuries?

Ooops there I go being a war monger again...

Not so much war-mongering but you are advocating empire building. Empire building abroad leads to totalitarianism at home. It's not worth it in my view.

[fortheDeclaration]

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it’s natural manure”.-——————Thomas Jefferson “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing”.-—————Edmund Burke

Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism. George Washington

[fortheDeclaration]

It is our true policy to steer clear of permanent alliances with any portion of the foreign world.
George Washington

[fortheDeclaration]

[Defense is one of the legimate roles of government-our Defense, not the Defense of the world. ]

>>>And our defense entails more than our borders. Even my 5th grader understands by now after studying history, (during WW2), that once you have enemies literally at your doorstep on every side, eventually you’ll fold. Again, it would be really nice if the Euroweenies could figure it out. Some have: GB, Poland...but too many haven’t.

Yea, so we have to have our troops scattered in over 100 nations so another Hitler doesn't rise up and conquer us!

[fortheDeclaration]

Your worldview as expressed above leads to empire and America was not founded to become an empire.

Amen.

[fortheDeclaration]

[You guys would try to find a enemy to fight a war against even in the Millennium.]

>>>>>No, enemies hate freedom. Enemies find us, not the other way around.

Really?

Well, you don't have to go around the world making more!

[ Yea, in another 50 years, if the US survives that long. ]

>>>>If YOU were a South Korean you’d be happy if we waited out ill leader 500 years.

First, it is the South Koreans themselves who want to reunited with the North.

Even if the S.Korean was happy to wait 500 years, I am an American who is paying for it!

The best chance we have to NOT survive the next 50 years is plugging our head in the sand and pretending we’re the problem.

No, we will not survive the next 50 years is to think that we can solve every problem in the world and spend our way into being a 3rd rate nation.

[fortheDeclaration]

The “War” in Iraq was done in 2-3 weeks. It’s been the mess afterwards that’s been a problem.

Gee, after 5 years you would think that we would be finished!

For that matter, the war in Korea hasn’t been finished, the war in Europe hasn’t really been finished, which is the ENTIRE point!

Well, I guess to you neocons, no war is ever finished!

War is with us, always has been, always will be and no matter how many pretzels you contort yourself into, that simply won’t ever EVER change!

Yes, there will always be war, but the US doesn't have to be involved in them all.

We are not advocating pacifism, so stop setting up straw man arguments.

We are advocating minding our own business and let the various regions of the world handle their own problems.

[fortheDeclaration]

[We are fighting an enemy with no organized Army, no Navy and no Air Force, but the Defense budget is too small! ]

>>>>You have no ability to learn from the past AND look to the future.

Which has nothing to do with our need to increase our defense budget.

[fortheDeclaration]

[The Soviets had no fear of us in conventional land warfare. Yes, I am amazed how one can be so obtuse in understanding recent history. ]

>>>>>Projecting to cover your own shortcomings just doesn’t work. If the Soviets had no fear of us in conventional land warfare, why did they build all those tanks?

To conquer Western Europe and keep Eastern Europe under its rule.

They didn't build them because they were afraid of our conventional military which couldn't match theirs.

That is why if the Soviets did invade we would have had to use tactical nuclear weapons.

Now, go learn some history and stop bothering me with your silly posts.

[fortheDeclaration]

[What is depleting our military is being stretched all over the globe, defending areas that can be defended by the nations in that region.]

>>>>”Can be defended” and “will be defended” is as absurd as buying debt and funding the WOT example. History shows time and time again allowing terrorists to build armies, take land, and terrorize populations leads to greater catastrophe. It would be really peachy if the U.N. did it’s job but it clearly doesn’t.

History also shows that nations most often collapse from overspending and overextending then from external enemies.

[fortheDeclaration]

The only enemy that S.Korea has is the North. Stop inventing stuff >

>>>>Hardly. Anyone with even a cursory sense of history knows that not only is China a threat being communist and is building a large military while the world sleeps, but they ALSO were actively involved in the Korean war! Again, what passes for history class in failed public schools these days is just sad.

now, China is not a threat to S.Korea!

You mean that same China that is funding the US by buying our debt is really our enemy!

Yes, China was involved in the Korean War, because we went up to the Yalu and the US was warned about getting too close to the Chinese border.

But McAruther underestimated the Chinese and overextended the U.S. forces so we got hammered by about 1 million Chinese which military intelligence didn't locate until too late.

So, the Chinese did not enter the Korean War to conquer S.Korea, they entered it to save N.Korea.

Your grasp of history is clearly very limited.

[BlackElk]

Actually, I generally post only to respond to others and most often to those whose posts are more reflective of the values of DU, Huffington Post, Fudgepacker Enabler News, Daily KOS, Planned Barrenhood, Gun Grabber Times or Daily Jihadist.

Will you still be impersonating a conservative and/or a Republican and/or an American patriot after we finish destroying the paleotreasonweasel and his little band of suckups???

[BlackElk]

You may have a point that none of the following is reflective of the "right" and I would make that argument.

Racism is not on the "right" nor is paleopeacecreepism, nor anti-Semitism, nor knee-jerk opposition to military efforts, nor a libertarian view that allows for baby-killing or rump-ranging at will or resists any effort to resist and defeat our Jihadist enemies. Don't you agree??? No peg is necessary when the indefensible is properly understood as totally alien to citizenship much less to the "right."

[BlackElk]

You are doing a terrific job here. God bless you and yours.

[BlackElk]

FTD: Well, if only we had realized that, like Hapless Harry Truman, you were a sharper military mind than Douglas MacArthur, how COULD we have disagreed with paleosurrenderism? Is it the paleosurrendermonkey position that the Korean War was OUR fault as AlQaeda's man from Galveston claims that the Iraq War is OUR fault??? If we had just allowed Kim Il Sung (or whatever his name was) to continue overrunning South Korea as a client of the soviets slaughtering and subjugating our allies in their invasion of Seoul, is it your position that that would be more desirable than stopping the bastards at the DMZ. We did not get the whole loaf (which would have included taking out Mao whose forces had one rifle for every ten men) but settled unfortunately for some South Korean slices. We made the mistake of having anyone else in charge but MacArthur and most particularly by pretense of fighting under the UN, but a lot of people lived and lived in relative freedom instead of being consumed by the communist monstrosity of the North. Does their living in freedom due to our efforts bother you? Why?

My grasp of history as a major in that subject got me a magna cum laude added to my BA. If you can say the same, you must have graduated from Patrice Lumumba University or some such place or, like TPanther noted, yours would also be reflective of the gummint edjumakashun ignorance factories known as gummint skewels.

[BlackElk]

FTD: If the soviets TRIED to invade, the soviets would have been a bad memory a lot sooner. I don't remember the soviet military being a particularly effective force in WWII nor in any engagement thereafter. The soviets made progress by folding sissified US politicians (Truman and Ike particularly) like cheap suits or like paleoPaulies or like paleosurrendermonkeys generally.

Patton was right at the end of WWII. It should have continued by turning on the soviets when we had the blooded military available in Europe and MacArthur available with his forces in Asia to finish them off. Incidentally, the cold war and its expenditures would then not have been necessary. And we would probably had an easier time eliminating soviet stooge Mossagh Dagh (or however it is spelled) from controlling Iran since there would have been no soviets to prop him up.

[BlackElk]

Actually, MacArthur overestimated Hapless Harry Truman’s manhood.

[BlackElk]

George Washington's policies were for a feeble infant nation not yet able to defend itself from superior foreign powers. His party was permanently ejected from the presidency a mere four years after Washington retired, was a relatively weak and evaporating Congressional party thereafter but managed to imbed John Marshall in the job of Chief Justice for decades as the dead hand of the past until he finally died and was finally replaced (hallelujah!) by Andrew Jackson's appointment. Long before that Monroe warned the Old World to keep out of the entire Western Hemisphere (but not before the old Federalist survivors tried to have New England secede from the nation for the illegitimate purpose of freer trade almighty with and sucking up to their British soulmates DURING the War of 1812.

Once again, paleoPaulie and his supporters are pantloads in the way of liberty.