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Trade in mammoth ivory, helped by global thaw, flourishes in Russia
IHT ^ | 25 Mar 2008 | Andrew E. Kramer

Posted on 03/26/2008 5:00:22 PM PDT by BGHater

NOVY URENGOI, Russia: As Viktor Seliverstov works in his makeshift studio in this hardscrabble Siberian town he is enveloped in a cloud of ivory dust. His electric carving tool whirrs over the milky surface of teeth and tusks, as he whittles them into key fobs, knife handles and scrimshaw figurines.

But these are not whale bones or walrus tusks he is working on. The ivory in this part of the world comes from the remains of extinct woolly mammoths, as they emerge from the tundra where they have been frozen for thousands of years. It is a traditional Russian business that had all but gone extinct itself during the Soviet period but is flourishing now.

"A lot of people find ivory and don't know what to do with it," Seliverstov said of the residents of this town, where more than a few closets and old barns have a tusk or two in them.

Seliverstov recently paid $500 for about seven kilograms, or 16 pounds, of mammoth ivory from a family that had stashed it in a barn for years before realizing its value.

The trade, bolstered recently by global warming, which has melted the tundra and exposed more frozen remains, is not only legal but actually endorsed by conservationists. They note somewhat grudgingly that while the survival of elephants may be in question, it is already too late for mammoths. Mammoth ivory from Siberia, they say, meets some of the Asian demand for illegal elephant ivory and its trade should be encouraged.

(Excerpt) Read more at iht.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; Russia
KEYWORDS: entrepreneur; godsgravesglyphs; ivory; mammoth; russia
'Seliverstov, the ivory carver, said he had no compunctions about working with a prehistoric resource. "People will treasure my art for generations," he said. "I give the mammoths a second life."'

Thats the spirit! It's better than killing other animals and eating Dinosaur bones like they do in China.

Viktor Seliverstov, working on a carving from a piece of mammoth tusk at his makeshift workshop in the city of Novy Urengoi, Russia. Ivory carving is a traditional Russian business that had all but gone extinct itself during the Soviet period but is flourishing now.

Seliverstov outside his studio. His trade has been bolstered recently by global warming, which has melted the tundra and exposed more frozen remains. The tusks emerge with the spring thaw or after heavy rains, or along the eroding banks of rivers.

While prices vary, leading dealers in Moscow usually ask $300 to $400 a kilogram for average grade ivory. By the time it reaches Western markets, the same ivory can sell for as much as $1,600 a kilogram, dealers say.

A schoolgirl looking at exhibits about mammoths, many of which were found in the frozen tundra nearby, at the Novy Urengoi museum. Some mammoths are frozen whole, as if in suspended animation, others in bits and pieces of bone, tusk, tissue and wool.

Gary Haynes, a paleoanthropologist at the University of Nevada at Reno, said he could not help but cringe at seeing the tusks destroyed. The growth rings and possible prehistoric human butcher marks contain a wealth of data on the ancient climate and peoples of Siberia that could shed light on whether climate change and over-hunting felled the mammoths.

1 posted on 03/26/2008 5:00:23 PM PDT by BGHater
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Comment #2 Removed by Moderator

To: puffer

Does it come in green?


3 posted on 03/26/2008 5:02:21 PM PDT by BGHater ($2300 is the limit of your Free Speech.)
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To: BGHater

Alot of it makes it to Alaska and is used for carving, but nowheres near for 1600/kg. They use to find it here in the interior along rivers where banks continue to erode with warming but I don’t think as much as say 20 years ago.


4 posted on 03/26/2008 5:07:16 PM PDT by Eska
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To: BGHater; SunkenCiv; blam

Man, I gotta get me some of that before the price skyrockets.

That’s what has been driving all these mammoth stories in the last year.

The smart money guys are going to promote an international bourse, trading in mammoth tusk ivory (with some crooks selling their teeth as the real thing, no doubt)


5 posted on 03/26/2008 5:17:24 PM PDT by wildbill
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To: BGHater

What do you reackon a mammoth wool coat would sell for?


6 posted on 03/26/2008 5:21:25 PM PDT by patton (cuiquam in sua arte credendum)
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To: BGHater
I couldn't help but laugh out loud when I read the line about “whether climate change and over-hunting felled the mammoths.”

D@mm it's funny. I think these liberals are really out to basically eliminate the human race. Or at least pare it down to some tiny number of 1 million or so. They just hate mankind with a passion.

That's it... over hunting killed the mammoths.

Too funny.

7 posted on 03/26/2008 5:21:44 PM PDT by GulfBreeze (McCain is our nominee. Yeah... I guess.)
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To: BGHater

I wonder what a pair of grips for my Colt 1911 would cost?


8 posted on 03/26/2008 5:24:04 PM PDT by Charles Martel (The Tree of Liberty thirsts.)
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To: BGHater

A lot of people DO know what to do with it: ebay!


9 posted on 03/26/2008 5:29:12 PM PDT by 668 - Neighbor of the Beast (VA is for lovers, but PA is the Saudi Arabia of coal.)
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To: BGHater

The dismayed Mr. Haynes who cringes over the carving should send Al Gore a one-way ticket to the region. Something about that man’s presence makes snow fall and accumulate in record measures.


10 posted on 03/26/2008 5:56:32 PM PDT by Titan Magroyne ("Shorn, dumb and bleating is no way to go through life, son." Yeah, close enough.)
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To: GulfBreeze

Don’t laugh too soon. The mammoth disappeared from North America only a few centuries after men appeared here.

At least that’s one of the main theories.

Mammoth skeletons have been found with flint spear points embedded in the vertebrae


11 posted on 03/26/2008 5:57:37 PM PDT by Sherman Logan (Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves. - A. Lincoln)
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To: Charles Martel

I’ve been shopping ivory grips for my 1911, the nicer sets are in the $250-400 range.


12 posted on 03/26/2008 6:00:35 PM PDT by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: Sherman Logan

I’ve no doubt that they hunted them. But the idea that they were hunted out of existence is ludicrous.

Don’t be an enviropatsy. :)


13 posted on 03/26/2008 6:20:26 PM PDT by GulfBreeze (McCain is our nominee. Yeah... I guess.)
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To: Sherman Logan

Man coexisted with bison in North America foe thousands of years.

But man himself could not have barely made a dent into the bison population with two things:
Horses and firearms

Man might have contributed, but I am certain he is not the primary cause of mammoth extinction.

There are simply way too many different species spread out over way too large a geographic area that went extinct at almost exactly the same time - about 11,500 years ago.


14 posted on 03/26/2008 6:27:18 PM PDT by djf
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To: djf

“with two things” SB “without two things”


15 posted on 03/26/2008 6:28:40 PM PDT by djf
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To: Sherman Logan
Mammoth skeletons have been found with flint spear points embedded in the vertebrae

I tip my hat to those prehistoric hunters. Those boys had some 'nads!

16 posted on 03/26/2008 6:30:29 PM PDT by Max in Utah (A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within.)
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To: BGHater

Mammoth Ivory has been harvested from Siberia for centuries.


17 posted on 03/26/2008 6:32:26 PM PDT by Rebelbase
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To: Rebelbase

There are many islands right off the north shore of Siberia and the estimates are there is still hundreds if not thousands of tons of the stuff there.


18 posted on 03/26/2008 6:35:00 PM PDT by djf
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To: BGHater
Mastodon Ivory 12th fret marker on a Spector Bass made from 32,000 year old cypress from the state of Georgia, USA.

" Stuart Spector Designs has just completed a bass, the NS-30K BC that will utilize what is believed to be the oldest wood ever used in the construction of a musical instrument. Obtained by Spector from logs discovered buried 40 feet deep in a sand quarry in Georgia, USA, the wood is perfectly preserved, due to the sterile nature of the sand and the natural decay resistance of the cypress wood itself. Using carbon 14 testing techniques, samples of the wood were examined by Beta Analytics, in Miami, to check for radioactive decay in the small amount of carbon that is present in all living organisms."

19 posted on 03/26/2008 6:39:02 PM PDT by Rebelbase
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To: BGHater

Could I get him to carve a woolly mammoth for me?


20 posted on 03/26/2008 6:47:21 PM PDT by do not press 2 for spanish
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To: Rebelbase; SunkenCiv
That's really something with the guitar.

I've been bragging for years over the 7,000 year old cypress wood I have. (I'll shut up now, lol)

Also, I saw the movie 10,000 BC last night...I guess it was reasonable, barely.

21 posted on 03/26/2008 6:53:01 PM PDT by blam (Secure the border and enforce the law)
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To: Max in Utah

Cain’t argue with that.

OTOH, during the last century in Sudan there were tribes that hunted elephants on horseback. They used broadswords to hamstring the elephants. This sounds to me like perhaps the most extreme sport ever invented.


22 posted on 03/26/2008 6:53:03 PM PDT by Sherman Logan (Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves. - A. Lincoln)
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To: wildbill; blam

Not sure (W.B.) how to detect fake mammoth ivory. Blam, it’s neat of course, but it depends on how the instrument plays and sounds. :’)


23 posted on 03/26/2008 10:59:11 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/______________________Profile updated Saturday, March 1, 2008)
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To: blam; StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; 1ofmanyfree; 24Karet; 3AngelaD; 49th; ...

· join list or digest · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post a topic ·

 
Gods
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Thanks Wildbill and Blam. And thanks Blam for the one-sentence review of the movie 10,000 B.C.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.
GGG managers are Blam, StayAt HomeMother, and Ernest_at_the_Beach
 

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24 posted on 03/26/2008 11:00:10 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/______________________Profile updated Saturday, March 1, 2008)
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The Cycle of Cosmic Catastrophes: Flood, Fire, and Famine in the History of Civilization The Cycle of Cosmic Catastrophes:
Flood, Fire, and Famine
in the History of Civilization

by Richard Firestone,
Allen West, and
Simon Warwick-Smith


25 posted on 03/26/2008 11:02:48 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/______________________Profile updated Saturday, March 1, 2008)
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To: BGHater; SunkenCiv; blam
Fossil tusks of the mammoth -an extinct elephant- were found in northern Siberia and brought southward to markets at a very early time, possibly in the days of Pliny in the first century of the present era. The Chinese excelled in working delicate designs in the ivory, much of which they obtained from the north...

Earth In Upheaval. Immanuel Velikovsky.

26 posted on 03/26/2008 11:13:47 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (a fair dinkum aussie)
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To: Rebelbase

> Stuart Spector Designs has just completed a bass, the NS-30K BC that will utilize what is believed to be the oldest wood ever used in the construction of a musical instrument...

It would be interesting to see what this artisan could do with Swamp Kauri, a beautiful wood that is extracted from New Zealand swamps. It is often 100,000 year or more old, and when dried can be worked exactly like modern Kauri.

Because it is full of a very fine resin — it is like amber — kauri wood does not rot.


27 posted on 03/26/2008 11:18:43 PM PDT by DieHard the Hunter (Is mise an ceann-cinnidh. Cha ghéill mi do dhuine. Fàg am bealach.)
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To: Fred Nerks

Lots of 19th c billiard balls as well.


28 posted on 03/26/2008 11:30:12 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/______________________Profile updated Saturday, March 1, 2008)
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To: BGHater
"His trade has been bolstered recently by global warming,

BS. These mammoth tusks have been "emerging" for the last 200 years, long before 'global warming' and the blamed "industrial era" ever became popular terms.

The fact is, these 'woolly mammoths, rhino's and other animals which were flash frozen about 4000 years ago once lived in a tropical paradise which is proven by the lush tropical vegetation that is emerging along with these frozen mammoths and found in their stomachs.

The simple facts one can conclude from these specimens is that not only is "global warming" a farce, the frozen north isn't supposed to be frozen, it's supposed to be lush and green. These weren't arctic animals which survived in the cold, (elephants cannot survive in an arctic climate) woolly mammoths are not not fur bearing, they are simply hairy elephants whose hair has no insulating value whatsoever. The amount of vegitation and fresh water needed for survival is simply not available in an arctic climate, and their trunks, like regular hairless elephants, are very sensitive to sub zero temps. exposure to those temps would kill them.

The discovery of these frozen in time mammoths, which is nothing new, many complete specimens were discovered in the early 19th century. They show that these animals were suddenly and rapidly buried inder snow and ice, so rapid that many are discovered with lush tropical vegitation still in they mouths. The ice age was very sudden.

What is happening now is this last ice age is still receeding, a perfectly natural and unstoppable event. That is, unless the same thing which triggered that ice age occurs again, in which case all of North America will once again be covered with a giant ice sheet.

29 posted on 03/26/2008 11:37:32 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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To: BGHater
"The growth rings and possible prehistoric human butcher marks contain a wealth of data on the ancient climate and peoples of Siberia that could shed light on whether climate change and over-hunting felled the mammoths."

What 'felled" the mammoths, Rhinos, fox, tigers etc. was rapid freezing and burial under hundreds of feet of ice and snow. As some samples show (complete bodies with still edible meat in some cases) they were crushed by this ice while they were grazing on tropical vegetation. They were killed by a catastrophic event. Since no human bodies have ever been found in the regions these animals are found, it's not very likely that there were any human settlements in the area at the time.

It's likely that human settlement came much later as the ice receded.

30 posted on 03/26/2008 11:44:58 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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frozen mammoths
31 posted on 03/26/2008 11:51:04 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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To: Nathan Zachary

I agree.

It’s like saying that the rocks I keep turning up year after year after year in my garden are emerging due to global warming.


32 posted on 03/27/2008 12:58:44 AM PDT by AFPhys ((.Praying for President Bush, our troops, their families, and all my American neighbors..))
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To: BGHater
Gary Haynes, a paleoanthropologist at the University of Nevada at Reno, said he could not help but cringe at seeing the tusks destroyed. The growth rings and possible prehistoric human butcher marks contain a wealth of data on the ancient climate and peoples of Siberia that could shed light on whether climate change and over-hunting felled the mammoths.

The start offering better $$$$ for the data. Socialist scientists make me sick.

33 posted on 03/27/2008 2:44:44 PM PDT by Centurion2000 (su - | echo "All your " | chown -740 us ./base | kill -9 | cd / | rm -r | echo "belong to us")
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To: BGHater

I have mammoth or mastedon ivory.
want some?

It is good for jewelry or knife handles


34 posted on 03/27/2008 2:47:34 PM PDT by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 . Never say never (there'll be a VP you'll like))
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To: BGHater
If all theses mammoths are being found why was such a big deal made about some scientist trying to uncover one on a documentary on Discovery or History Channel or some such channel not long ago? Because of bad weather they failed. They came across like it was really a rare find they were trying to uncover in the ice. It might of been a fossil if I remember right. Why didn't they just get one of the many that were being exposed because of melt?
35 posted on 03/27/2008 7:55:52 PM PDT by Bellflower (A Brand New Day Is Coming!)
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To: Bellflower

Sorting mammoth tusks at an ivory auction yard in Siberia about 1920. Ivory mining has been continuous since Roman days and surely represents many thousands of buried mammoths.

36 posted on 03/27/2008 8:30:12 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (a fair dinkum aussie)
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To: Fred Nerks

MOSCOW — The frozen carcass of a baby woolly mammoth has been unearthed in a remote northern Siberian region, a discovery scientists said Wednesday could help in climate change studies.

The 4-foot gray-and-brown carcass, believed to be between 40,000 and 10,000 years old, was discovered in May by a reindeer herder in the subarctic Yamal-Nenets region.

It has its trunk and eyes virtually intact and even some fur remaining, said Alexei Tikhonov, deputy director of the Russian Academy of Sciences' Zoological Institute.

37 posted on 03/27/2008 8:35:24 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (a fair dinkum aussie)
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To: Bellflower

Mammoth fossils.

38 posted on 03/27/2008 9:02:31 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (a fair dinkum aussie)
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