Posted on 07/07/2008 8:16:52 PM PDT by markomalley
Congress should repeal the "don't ask, don't tell" law because the presence of gays in the military is unlikely to undermine the ability to fight and win, according to a new study released by a California-based research center.
The study was conducted by four retired military officers, including the three-star Air Force lieutenant general who in early 1993 was tasked with implementing President Clinton's policy that the military stop questioning recruits on their sexual orientation.
"Evidence shows that allowing gays and lesbians to serve openly is unlikely to pose any significant risk to morale, good order, discipline or cohesion," the officers states.
To support its contention, the panel points to the British and Israeli militaries, where it says gay people serve openly without hurting the effectiveness of combat operations.
Undermining unit cohesion was a determining factor when Congress passed the 1993 law, intended to keep the military from asking recruits their sexual orientation. In turn, service members can't say they are gay or bisexual, engage in homosexual activity or marry a member of the same sex.
Supporters of the ban contend there is still no empirical evidence that allowing gays to serve openly won't hurt combat effectiveness.
"The issue is trust and confidence" among members of a unit, said Lt. Col. Robert Maginnis, who retired in 1993 after working on the issue for the Army. When some people with a different sexual orientation are "in a close combat environment, it results in a lack of trust," he said.
The study was sponsored by the Michael D. Palm Center at the University of California at Santa Barbara, which said it picked the panel members to portray a bipartisan representation of the different service branches.
According to its Web site, the Palm Center "is committed to keeping researchers, journalists and the general public informed of the latest developments in the 'don't ask, don't tell' policy debate." Palm himself was "a staunch supporter of civil rights in the gay community," the site says.
Two of the officers on the panel have endorsed Democratic candidates since leaving the military - Army Lt. Gen. Robert Gard, who supports Barack Obama, and Marine Corps Gen. Hugh Aitken, who backed Clinton in 1996.
Air Force Lt. Gen. Robert Minter Alexander, a Republican, was assigned in 1993 to a high-level panel established by the Defense Department to examine the issue of gays in the military. At one point, he signed an order that prohibited the military from asking a recruit's sexual orientation.
Alexander said at the time he was simply trying to carry out the president's orders and not take a position. But he now believes the law should be repealed because it assumes the existence of gays in the military is disruptive to units even though cultural attitudes are changing.
Further, the Defense Department and not Congress should be in charge of regulating sexual misconduct within the military, he said.
"Who else can better judge whether it's a threat to good order and discipline?" Alexander asked.
Navy Vice Adm. Jack Shanahan said he had no opinion on the issue when he joined the panel, having never confronted it in his 35-year military career. A self-described Republican who opposes the Bush administration's handling of the Iraq war, Shanahan said he was struck by the loss of personal integrity required by individuals to carry out "don't ask, don't tell."
"Everyone was living a big lie - the homosexuals were trying to hide their sexual orientation and the commanders were looking the other way because they didn't want to disrupt operations by trying to enforce the law," he said.
And I know others who survive here only because they can call for help. How many more times will you keep up the name-calling and blatant attempts? Don’t you see some of us are having a serious discussion. How about using Freepmail to get me banned instead of repeating the distractions on the thread directly.
LOL! Did I leave out code pink, Obama mole?
My point was that the extremists are all there is. Sure you know a guy who dresses up for work every day and he and his partner park their nice Volvo's in the driveway of their nicely landscaped house. But trust me, those guys also go to the parades and do all that sick stuff. There are very few "normal" ones. I used to work with several of them, and thought of one of them as a good friend for five years until it all went sour. Without exception these are a group of emotionally troubled people.
Re: Elk Grove. I know that neighborhood well. I am a parishioner at St. Joseph's. Traffic is still only 35 minutes in to the Capitol, so that beats anything from where I grew up in LA. Though we just moved from our home over near Waterman and Sheldon to a nice larger new place in Sloughhouse. Pondering asking JR to change me to SloughHouseDan - haven't decided yet.
That's odd, there are plenty of people here who don't seem to hate me at all.
All wars have a winner and a loser, so this is a moot point.
We? Oh you mean the two or three others who followed you over? LOL!
I take it you cannot prove your ascertion, therefore I see no reason to give any credit to your argument. Since we won all those wars, I draw the opposite conclusion.
I tried to engage you in a serious discussion and your argument flamed out early with no explanation or evidence.
I guess I didn't learn my lesson from previous attempts to engage you in adult conversation. Good-bye.
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I have no idea to what you are referring, but I suppose that should come as no surprise.
I do find your apparent giddiness a bit odd, however.
My assertion has been discussed several times on this thread. I see no need to go through it again.
You state that homosexuals have been in ALL armies; well, some of those armies lost.
Do I think the United States will lose wars because of homosexuals? No, I don't. However, the fact that something might not destroy us does not mean that it's a good idea. Homosexuals make up less than 4% of the population, we simply don't need them in the military.
Best wishes in EG! The dems proposed $9 billion in CAL tax increases yesterday. See you on another thread.
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No, it's your pro-homosexual philosophy we have difficulty grasping.
Yes, comprehending what you write is difficult. Your posts are riddled with grammatical errors and misspelled words.
“Don’t people have the right to make that choice?”
Yes, people have the right to chose to participate in homosexual behaviour. One consequence of making that choice is to be excluded from serving in the military.
“I don’t think the military should take a stance on anything that’s a choice,....”
Anything? How about drug usage? DUI’s? You really have no concept or understanding of anything regarding the military.
“I just can’t see why somebody’s sexual preference choice would exclude them from fulfilling their responsibility top their country. “
And since it is beyond your understanding, you think that a major policy change is warranted for all branches of the armed forces. You really should just sit back and enjoy the freedom that others are protecting for you and let those of us that did the work worry about how to treat homosexuals in the military.
“In fact, I think it discriminates against heterosexuals to say that only they can die for their country.”
If I chose to risk my life to protect my fellow American’s freedoms, then when the military accepts my voluntary choice they are not discriminating against me. I voluntarily put myself in that situation.
“It just seems like the current policy is idiotic. See a guy with a guy off-base and discharge the guy. That’s wasteful and unnecessary for my money.”
Again, you have no understanding about unit cohesion or esprit de corpse. I think you should concentrate on other wasteful government programs for your money. There are plenty in your own state that you can worry about.
Leave the heavy lifting to those that are out there carrying the weight of your freedom.
Best wishes!
I don’t hate you Wagglebee.
:-)
Incoming.
because trolls are called out publicly
it’s a long and honorable tradition
waiting for the zot
That would be me, and I've been asserting that for nigh onto 10 years on Free Republic.
Thank you for an excellent post, CSM.
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