Are You Too Dumb to Understand Evolution?

CreationEvolutionHeadlines ^ | September 10, 2008

[GodGunsGuts]

Sept 10, 2008 — Astrobiologist David Deamer believes that life can spontaneously emerge without design, but he thinks lay people are too uneducated to understand how this is possible, so he gives them the watered-down version of Darwin’s natural selection instead, which he knows is inadequate to explain the complexity of life. That’s what he seemed to be telling reporter Susan Mazur in an interview for the Scoop (New Zealand). Is the lay public really too dense for the deeper knowledge of how evolution works?...

[tpanther]

There is honest debat over whether teachere should respond to students’ questions about objections to evolution. I personally think that most such discussions would go pretty much the same way these threads do. They would be interpreted as attacks on religion.

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When a rational person examines the evidence they come to no other conclusion. Specifically Christianity.

Looking outside of the evolution/creation debate one finds mountains more evidence.

I think the one example most striking is the Georgia ACLU demanding MY school board remove Christmas from the school calendar or face legal action.

Predictably the school board folded like a tent. This was because they didn’t understand their rights and didn’t involve parents.

Christmas as most know, is a Federal holiday.

Angry at god liberals have also sued to have ‘Under God’ removed from our pledge, crosses be removed from Federal cemeteries, and crosses be removed from town logos...in one case a town NAMED ‘the crosses’ (Las Cruces N.M.)

Another telling example is the sticker case in the state of Georgia. Reminding students evolution is not fact but theory (because the godless liberals were presenting it as fact while no other theory was presented as fact)

and those stickers were sued off the textbooks.

There’s an effort underway to force Christianity out of the public and turn this country into STRICTLY a secular nation.

Blaming this movement on Christians with statements like we’re trying to inject religion into science class merely confirms to outsiders the truth that indeed there’s a dangerous effort underway to destroy this country from within.

[Elsie]

...RMNS algorithms...

Methinks the horse is pushing the cart.

[Elsie]

If you look at the actual fossil record, which includes millions of classified specimens, you will see most lineages connected by transitions much finer than the differences between dog breeds.

No; you won't.

[js1138]

There’s an effort underway to force Christianity out of the public and turn this country into STRICTLY a secular nation.

Are you happy with the results in countries that have official religions?

[scarface367]

Keepin' 'em in skool helps the unemployment rate.

Ah, typical anti-intellectualist drivel.

[Elsie]

If you had any sense of shame you would be embarrassed by repeatedly showing your abject ignorance of the subject. But I guess being a Geocentricist means never admitting you are losing an argument.

Like Donkey facing Shrek, DG merely looks at him as he verbally blasts away.

[js1138]

No; you won't.

Take a look at the links I posted. The crucial lineages of fish and amphibians are well connected. More importantly, evolution predicts that connecting fossils will be found and it predicts where. The results of such predictions are confirmed.

No competing theory makes this kind of prediction.

[Elsie]

Or are you confident that truth wins out through free speech in the long run?

FREE speech?

Doesn't that imply "certain inalienable rights" being endowed by a CREATOR?

[js1138]

http://www.skullsunlimited.com/domestic-dog-breed-skulls.htm

There are many series of fossils in which the transitions between species and even between orders are finer than the differences between dog breeds.

[tpanther]

Are you happy with the results in countries that have official religions?

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Another strawman projection.

When prayer WAS in school in this country, what ensued was freedom for ALL including the God-haters to the point they’ve hijacked everything....law, education, science, journalism, politics...etc. etc. etc.

Preserving religious freedom doesn’t equate to Theocracy no matter how may times you run screaming
“INQUISITION INQUISITION INQUISITION” to the courthouse.

[Elsie]

Are you happy with the results in countries that have official religions?

Results??

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State religions

 

Roman Catholic
Argentina
Bolivia
Costa Rica
El Salvador
Liechtenstein
Malta
Monaco
Some cantons of Switzerland (state religion):
Appenzell Innerrhoden (declared "religion of the people of Appenzell Innerrhoden")
Aargau
Basel-Country
Berne
Glarus
Graubünden
Nidwalden
Schwyz
Thurgau
Uri
Vatican City (official religion)

Eastern Orthodox

Cyprus (Cypriot Orthodox Church)
Greece (Church of Greece)
This article has been nominated to be checked for its neutrality.
Discussion of this nomination can be found on the talk page. 

Finnish Orthodox Church has a special relationship with the Finnish state.

The internal structure of the church is described in the Orthodox Church Act.

The church has a power to tax her members and corporations, the majority of which is owned by them.

The church does not consider herself a state church, as the state does not have the authority to affect her internal workings or theology.

Lutheran

Denmark (Church of Denmark)
Iceland (Church of Iceland)
Norway (Church of Norway)
Finland: Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland has a special relationship with the Finnish state, its internal structure being described in a special law, the Church Act. The Church Act can be amended only by a decision of the Synod of the Evengelical Lutheran Church and subsequent ratification by the parliament. The church has a power to tax her members and all corporations, except those the majority of which is owned by members of the Finnish Orthodox Church. The state collects these taxes for the church, for a fee. On the other hand, the church is required to give a burial place for everyone in her graveyards. The church does not consider herself a state church, as the Finnish state does not have a possibility to affect her internal workings or her theology, although it has a veto in those changes of the internal structure which require changing the Church Act. Neither does the Finnish state accord any precendence to Lutherans or the Lutheran faith in its own acts.

Anglican
England (Church of England)

Reformed
Some cantons of Switzerland (Swiss Reformed Church):
Aargau
Basel-Country
Berne
Glarus
Graubünden
Schwyz
Thurgau
Uri
Zurich
Scotland – the Church of Scotland is the national church, but is not a "state church" and has complete independence from the state in spiritual matters, thus being both established and free.[3]p.161

Old Catholic

Some cantons of Switzerland (Christian Catholic Church):
Aargau
Basel-Country
Berne

Islam

Afghanistan (State religion)
Algeria
Bahrain
Bangladesh
Brunei
Egypt (State religion)
Iran (State religion)
Iraq
Jordan
Kuwait
Libya
Malaysia
Maldives
Mauritania
Morocco
Oman
Pakistan (State religion)
Palestinian National Authority[4]
Qatar
Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic (State religion)
Saudi Arabia (Religion of the Kingdom)
Somalia
Somaliland (Religion of the nation)
Tunisia
United Arab Emirates (Religion of the Kingdom)
Yemen

Sunni Islam
Algeria
Malaysia
Maldives
Pakistan (as National-sanctioned religion)
Saudi Arabia (as state-sanctioned religion)
Somalia

Shi'a Islam
Iran (as state-sanctioned religion)

Buddhism
Bhutan (Drukpa Kagyu school of Tibetan Buddhism)
Cambodia (Theravada Buddhism)
Kalmykia, a republic within the Russian Federation (Tibetan Buddhism - sole Buddhist entity in Europe)
Sri Lanka (Theravada Buddhism - The constitution accords Buddhism the "foremost place," but Buddhism is not recognized as the state religion. )
Tibet Government in Exile (Gelugpa school of Tibetan Buddhism)
Myanmar- written in the 1974 constitution

Hinduism
Nepal was the world's only Hindu state, but in order to negotiate with Maoist rebels they dropped the status as a Hindu state.

Others
Israel is defined in several of its laws as a democratic Jewish state.

However, the term "Jewish" is a polyseme that can relate equally to the Jewish people or religion.

The debate about the meaning of the term Jewish and its legal and social applications

(considering that it comes alongside the term "democratic") is one of the most profound issues with which Israeli society deals.

At present, Israel cannot be said to have an established religion.

However, the State of Israel supports religious institutions, particularly Orthodox Jewish ones, and recognizes

Orthodox Jewish, Muslim, Christian and Druze religious courts as official state courts for personal status matters (see millet system).

The structure and goals of the Chief Rabbinate of Israel are governed by Israeli law, but the law does not say explicitly that it is a state Rabbinate.

Non-recognition of other streams of Judaism is the cause of some controversy. As of 2007, there is no civil marriage in Israel.
The United States and other countries indirectly fund religions of different denominations by granting tax-exempt status to churches and religious institutions which qualify as charitable organizations."

[Elsie]

Ah, typical anti-intellectualist drivel.

Merely anti-Pseudo-Intellectual drivel.

[js1138]

And which of these would you prefer over the United States?

[Elsie]

The crucial lineages of fish and amphibians are well connected assumed.

[js1138]

When prayer WAS in school in this country, what ensued was freedom for ALL including the God-haters to the point they’ve hijacked everything....law, education, science, journalism, politics...etc. etc. etc.

Can you point to a school supported by vouchers that includes prayer in its daily activities?

[js1138]

Take a look at my links. Evolution predicts the finding of transitional fossils, tells us where to look, and when we look we find.

[metmom]

I personally think that most such discussions would go pretty much the same way these threads do. They would be interpreted as attacks on religion.

Only as long as the teacher doesn't call them a bunch of ignorant knuckle dragging cretards who believe the fairy tales of bronzed age goat herders.

If he doesn't allow ridicule or name calling, there's no reason it should get out of hand. Let the kids ask the questions, give a reasonable answer. Let the kids express their opinions and not judge them and then move on.

But the kind of name calling and telling people that they're stupid for not believing the current scientific interpretation and that they need to go and learn "real" science so they can come back and hold an "intelligent" conversation will certainly be interpreted as attacks on them or their religion.

It won't be interpreted as a personal attack or attack on their religion if the statements are along the lines of *Current evidence supports this ________.* Which if any scientist is really honest is all that he can say about any topic.

[metmom]

tpanther: When prayer WAS in school in this country, what ensued was freedom for ALL including the God-haters to the point they’ve hijacked everything....law, education, science, journalism, politics...etc. etc. etc.

js: Can you point to a school supported by vouchers that includes prayer in its daily activities?

Why'd you change the subject? What you addressed wasn't even the subject of his post.

You are aware, aren't you, that for most of the history of this country that Bible reading and prayer were part of the daily activities in schools across this country?

That's what tpanther is talking about.

[MrB]

for most of the history of this country that Bible reading and prayer were part of the daily activities in schools across this country

And yet, somehow, no one knows how, but,

this country has never been a dreaded "theocracy".

[WVKayaker]

Good morning, Elsie. JS is still trying to sell his snake oil, I see.

I have been out of the country for a while, but still find time to look in at FR.

JS, I can predict the future myself. I can tell you that all this will end some day. I can also tell you that all the suppositions in the world, and speculations in the universe will not confirm the theory of evolution.

I can say that because it ais all based on mans ideas, but it leaves out the central necessity, a beginning.

I have watched with great interest, all the spectulation and suppostions , being attached to the partical collider in Europe. Unfortunately, they speculate that they can reconstruct the universe just after the "big bang". It fails to acknowledge that according to your "science", nothing existed prior to the alleged "bang".

I realize you will immediately come back with your standard "evolution is not interested in the beginnings", yet your brother Darwin actually named his book "ON THE ORIGENS of the Species." Seems to my feeble mind that origen is synonomous with beginning.

JS, you should try and pedal your snake oil elsewhere, to someone who is willing to agree, or lacks intelligence. I doubt you will find many Christians among those on your list.

Only with an evolutionist, can you get an unresponsive response, Elsie! They prefer to attempt belittling your faith, and questioning your intelligence. They have a stake in the outcome, but don't realize they are risking eternity.

It isn't doing any good to answer his Bravo Sierra. He comes from the same place that anthropogenic global warming does. Start with a conclusion, and find a question! That's his "science"!

JS, I have a dalmation dog. He is not very much spotted, and has a solid tail. Is he still a dalmation, or is this another evolvement from necessity, according to your "theories"?