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Abstinence is unrealistic, says the daughter of Sarah Palin
News.Com.Au ^

Posted on 02/17/2009 6:27:05 PM PST by Sub-Driver

Abstinence is unrealistic, says the daughter of Sarah Palin

From correspondents in Los Angeles

Agence France-Presse

February 18, 2009 11:09am

THE daughter of Alaska Governor Sarah Palin has spoken out against teenage pregnancy, but says her famous mother's advocacy of abstinence is unrealistic.

Unmarried Bristol Palin's pregnancy became a US presidential election campaign talking point last year after her mother was announced as John McCain's running mate.

Bristol, 18, later gave birth to a baby boy in December.

Speaking about the birth of Tripp to Fox News, Bristol Palin said she now hoped to become an advocate against teen pregnancy.

"Everyone should wait 10 years," Bristol said.

"I hope people learn from my story - It's so much easier if you're married, have a house and career. It's not a situation you want to strive for."

"I'd love to be an advocate to prevent teen pregnancy. Kids should just wait. It's not glamorous at all," she added.

(Excerpt) Read more at news.com.au ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: bristolpalin; palinfamily
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To: Sub-Driver

If you listen to Greta’s interview, Sarah herself says abstinence is naive.

Everybody is bashing Bristol but nobody is commenting on Sarah’s views.


51 posted on 02/17/2009 8:17:19 PM PST by Canticle_of_Deborah
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To: TAdams8591

“But it is not my duty or my business or my responsibility or that of any taxpayer, to be forced into paying to raise, and feed and clothe these children, many of whom are brought into the world for that very purpose (to get mommy some free cash), also sickening, and in some cases, obscene.”

I agree.

“Furthermore, today’s situation is so bizarre, that young single motherhood, is becoming both equal in number and stature to married couple parenthood. As if one of those choices is as good as the other...it isn’t.”

Again, I agree. Single motherhood is becoming equal or held up as some standard that’s ok. It’s not ok. And fathers have no say whatsoever.

I disagree about the adoption part. The best scenario is of course two married parents. If that isn’t happening, and that’s something that happens, the bio family should raise the kid.

Adoption is good option, in some cases. It’s certainly not the best option or only option. And, just because there are many couples unable to have their own kids, it doesn’t entitle them to other people’s kids.


52 posted on 02/17/2009 8:24:06 PM PST by Twink
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To: naturalman1975
That is the way ALL schools who teach what the left calls “abstinence only” sex ed. The only place “Only” comes into play is that it's the ONLY way to avoid STD’s and pregnancy 100%. Kids today ALL know and are told nonstop about contraception but where the left doesn't get it, is they need to be told there is only one 100% safe way, and abstinence is it. All the others are no guarantee. And the left hates when that is pointed out.
53 posted on 02/17/2009 8:26:13 PM PST by gidget7 (Duncan Hunter-Valley Forge Republican!)
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To: ga medic

Thank you for your post. Well said. I would have no problem adopting a mixed race child or an older child. The 2 boys I raised were 7 & 13 when I got them & abused. I can’t imagine life without them. There are many older children that are waiting for parents & it is shame only babies seem to be wanted.


54 posted on 02/17/2009 8:26:37 PM PST by pandoraou812 (Don't play leapfrog with a unicorn! ...........^............)
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To: Twink
If that isn’t happening, and that’s something that happens, the bio family should raise the kid.

I'm not sure I agree. If the young people involved are basically responsible kids who screwed up but are willing to try to be good parents with the help of their parents, I do agree.

But if it's slacker mom and loser dad wandering their way through life...as good a grandma as I may be, I'm not going to make up for them. To decide that a child is going to have to deal with having two idiots for parents because the child is MY blood and I insist on keeping him/her, well, I think sometimes the kid is well rid of his/her parents.

55 posted on 02/17/2009 8:57:24 PM PST by Dianna (Obama Barbie: Governing is hard.)
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To: Twink

The concept behind abstinence is pretty serious - and even if someone doesn’t see the point (which tells me a lot about their heart), it is the only foolproof method of preventing pregnancy. Also a pretty darned good way to prevent sexually transmitted diseases.

But considering that keeping oneself sexually “pure” until marriage is more than just a nice or fanciful thought. It really is a gift to your future spouse and “help-mate”.

And just because someone does not wait until marriage does not make them a “bad person”, nor does it necessarily reflect bad parenting. But parenting can impact a young person’s decisions - including their decision regarding pre-marital sex.

I have a great deal of respect for anyone - male or female - who has the intestinal fortitude and willpower (and usually the spiritual strength) to abstain until married. And the concept is not unreasonable.

And I probably have a lot more in common with your husband than I would like to admit...


56 posted on 02/17/2009 9:05:25 PM PST by TheBattman (Pray for our country....)
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To: Dianna

But who is to decide that? Who should decide if they are responsible? Or good parents?

If everyone lived according to my rules, we’d all be better off. I’m just not willing to let the government or anyone else decide what’s the best way.

I’d like to tell my niece’s parents that their kid is a train wreck and needs major help. For family harmony, I keep my mouth shut and just deal with it when they drop her off on some weekends. Would she have been better off being adopted years ago? Not in my opinion. For the record, her mother wasn’t married and isn’t married to her father. Her mother isn’t a blood relative. This kid has major problems but she has our family and her mother’s family. Our family is the step family. If nothing else, the kid knows she’s loved and has family who loves her.


57 posted on 02/17/2009 9:13:09 PM PST by Twink
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To: TheBattman

“And I probably have a lot more in common with your husband than I would like to admit...” And yet, my husband is the best person I know.

I was a virgin when I got married. I dated tons, social butterfly, etc. As a teen, what was the point? Didnt’ want to get pregnant, didn’t want to disappoint my mother. One just didn’t have sex before marriage.

My husband now has 4 daughters. Poetic justice maybe ;) His take is always “teen boys are bad, they want sex all the time no matter what they say, don’t have sex” Then they get the other side from me, boys aren’t bad, no one is going to convince you to do anything you don’t want to do, etc.

The concept isn’t unreasonable per se. But for me, way back, I abstained because it was huge. I wasn’t ready for all it entailed. Then when I met my husband in college, it was more difficult. And very difficult to abstain.


58 posted on 02/17/2009 9:27:03 PM PST by Twink
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To: pandoraou812
"in most cases"

The operative words in my statement. : )

59 posted on 02/17/2009 9:46:04 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: Twink
But who is to decide that? Who should decide if they are responsible? Or good parents?

Of course, it should be the people involved who decide that. No one here has mentioned any government involvement.

Would she have been better off being adopted years ago? Not in my opinion.

All you say about the mother is that she didn't marry the father. Is she a mature, loving and caring parent? You say the kid has problems. Are they because of her family?

I just have a really hard time saddling innocent babies with parents who are selfish morons. Even if I am caring for them full-time, the people who are supposed to love them the most are still idiots. Adoption is a risk because you don't know what you're going to get, but I think a lot of times it can be a risk worth taking.

60 posted on 02/17/2009 9:59:26 PM PST by Dianna (Obama Barbie: Governing is hard.)
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To: Twink
"And, just because there are many couples unable to have their own kids, it doesn’t entitle them to other people’s kids."

I don't think anyone on this thread made that point. I can assure you, from what I've witnessed, many single mothers with no support from a good family, and unable to properly provide for themselves, let alone their children, keep them, instead of giving them up for adoption. This helps to maintain a dependent class in society, with children who aren't adequately provided and cared for and means there are fewer children for adoption. Many of these children (though certainly not all) grow up to wreak havoc on society. The statistics in Coulter's book in this regard, though not surprising to me personally, are stunning.

61 posted on 02/17/2009 10:00:01 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: TAdams8591

True. I am just so tired of hearing this child should be put up for adoption. This baby has a family that is more then able to care & love it unlike many other babies.


62 posted on 02/17/2009 10:00:59 PM PST by pandoraou812 (Don't play leapfrog with a unicorn! ...........^............)
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah

Respectfully, my friend, birth control as a means to prevent teenage and young adult out of wedlock pregnancies, is naieve and not only ineffective but since it’s legalization, the rate of out of wedlock pregnancies has drastically increased.


63 posted on 02/17/2009 10:06:09 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: pandoraou812
Much agreed.

We can't be certain of the circunstances, but the Palin family can't force the father of the baby to marry Bristol. However, at one time that was the custom, and as imperfect as it may have been, it was better than single motherhood.

64 posted on 02/17/2009 10:10:56 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: Dianna

I agree that sometimes adoption is a risk worth taking.

I don’t know if she was a mature, loving parent for the first 10 ten yrs of the kid’s life. The kid has major problems now as a 16 yr old. But I look at my oldest brother and his two sons, major issues there too, but in the end it all worked out.

The mother’s family is freaky, imo. But they helped raise their granddaughter. My nephew married into the family so she’s our family now too.

I roll my eyes at much that goes on.


65 posted on 02/17/2009 10:11:34 PM PST by Twink
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To: TAdams8591

I will agree to that too. However sadly life is changing so fast (IMHO) that the things once held to be right & normal aren’t anymore. I liked it much better when I was younger!


66 posted on 02/17/2009 10:13:36 PM PST by pandoraou812 (Don't play leapfrog with a unicorn! ...........^............)
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To: TheBattman

The state of abstinence until marriage (and I agree that it’s best), was much easier to maintain many years ago, when most of society supported it and did it. Very tough today, and for many years now when the circumstance is the complete opposite. Anyone who does abstain until marriage in the current sexualized climate should be greatly respected, agreed.


67 posted on 02/17/2009 10:20:19 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: pandoraou812

We agree again! : )


68 posted on 02/17/2009 10:21:54 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: TAdams8591

I’m not stating my position per se. I’m just saying it seems like a big point is being ignored.

Was Sarah promoting abstinence until Bristol got pregnant? If she was, her views have now changed. If she wasn’t, then a lot of people projected values onto her that were not there.

Everybody is bashing Bristol. What’s done is done and she’s a private citizen. Her mother’s position on the issue is relevant to values voters.


69 posted on 02/17/2009 10:22:52 PM PST by Canticle_of_Deborah
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To: TAdams8591

Well thats a good thing!


70 posted on 02/17/2009 10:24:18 PM PST by pandoraou812 (Don't play leapfrog with a unicorn! ...........^............)
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To: Twink
Just one addition to reply #61 Twink.

It was very rare to encounter a person on my Probation/Parole caseload that came from a two parent family. Most came from single parent families headed by their mothers.

Sadly, the probationers/parolee's who were parents, were also not married and frequently had fathered multiple children by different women, and the women multiple children by different men. Unfortunately, that is what single parenthood leads to in many cases, and it becomes the norm and as generational as married parenthood.

As a country and a civil society, this does not bode well for our future.

71 posted on 02/17/2009 10:33:26 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: TheBattman

Yes it is. One problem is that such behavior is usually derided in the media, etc. But one example where that didn’t happen was a great character on the ‘90’s Sci-Fi show Babylon 5, “Marcus” — and I wish we had a few more such public heroes, even if they are fictional.


72 posted on 02/17/2009 10:36:35 PM PST by Paul R. (We are in a break in an Ice Age. A brief break at that...)
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To: Twink
I roll my eyes at much that goes on.

We just found out today that friends of ours are having real trouble. Their daughter has been a problem for the last year (drugs, running away, not going to school). She left home for good in Dec, the day after her 18th birthday. Even though she was 6 months away from graduating, she didn't enroll in school and now she is pregnant.

The parents were united when she left. Unless she truly wanted to turn things around and had proof of that, she wasn't coming back. Period.

But with the baby, now mom wants to give in and help her and raise the baby. Dad is firm that she needs to experience reality before she'll be ready to change. He knows that she'll use that baby to manipulate them forever if they let her.

Logically, I see his point. But the reality would have to be, no more daughter, ever. No grandkid, ever. Because once that baby is in your life, how do you not move heaven and earth to do what you can? The mother is now in an impossible spot because dad says no help to daughter or the younger girls and I are out of here.

In this environment, God help that baby if she decides to keep it. Even watching from the sidelines breaks my heart.

73 posted on 02/17/2009 10:36:51 PM PST by Dianna (Obama Barbie: Governing is hard.)
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To: Candor7

“Well, when I am around Sarah Palin I somehow begin to think abstinence is unrealistic too, but then the further away I get from Sarah Palin, the more abstinence seems quite workable.
I an having a difficult time figuring how this works!”

No you’re not! :-)

Do you mind if I post that on another forum? I’d be happy to give credit, if you wish!


74 posted on 02/17/2009 10:40:41 PM PST by Paul R. (We are in a break in an Ice Age. A brief break at that...)
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah
Gotcha! : )

The media has no business starting all this does it? If it was hands off Chelsea, the president's daughter, than most certainly it should be hands off Bristol, a candidate for VP's daughter, right?

We know that's not the way the media operates. But WE don't have to fall for it. It is Sarah's position on this issue and not Bristol's that should interest us, you are right! : )

75 posted on 02/17/2009 10:42:34 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: Dianna

Prayers for your friend and her family, Dianna!


76 posted on 02/17/2009 10:46:03 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: TAdams8591
Hi, The idea of the author is good. He used the new technique in solving problems. joe mls listings
77 posted on 02/17/2009 11:01:14 PM PST by joe88
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To: joe88
Huh?

Odd for your first comment on FR, newbie! Perhaps we should sound a troll alert?

78 posted on 02/17/2009 11:07:07 PM PST by TAdams8591 (When Obama FAILS, America SUCCEEDS.)
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To: TAdams8591
Prayers for your friend and her family, Dianna!

Thank you. They are much needed and very appreciated.

79 posted on 02/17/2009 11:09:21 PM PST by Dianna (Obama Barbie: Governing is hard.)
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To: LearsFool

Yes, and I am all for early marriages and early responsibility. Young people are ready for it way before they are expected to be, these days.

Abstinence was not all that hard pre-pill. There were a few girls who went to live with their aunts while they had their babies and then returned. They were not highly respected.

And of course for thousands of years abstinence has been expected. Lower your expectations, what do you get? duh.

I am a genealogy nut. The older sister of my g’gmother — they were all orphaned in Brazil (by cholera) shortly after immigrating there from Russia (Volga Germans) — the OLDEST sister was 13, took ALL the younger sibs and left for Kansas, with the hired hand, who was 14. When they got there, they got married. She was FOURTEEN then.

They were plenty mature to be married and start a family at that point.

I tutor Middle School kids. I alwayss teach up to them, expecting and demanding that they think clearly. And I always find, really, that they are capable of so much more than they are being taught.

Homeschooling gives you that clarity, too.


80 posted on 02/18/2009 7:55:55 AM PST by bboop (obama, little o, not a Real God)
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To: Paul R.
Go for it and credit to this writer is fine, since I am a professional BTW.
81 posted on 02/18/2009 1:11:45 PM PST by Candor7 (Fascism? All it takes is for good men to say nothing, ( member NRA)
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To: Twink
Some of these posts act like it’s the duty of unwed mothers to provide babies for those who can’t have their own. How sick is that?

How sick is it for unwed mothers to expect the taxpayers to support their bastards ? Especially serial bastards.

Forced adoption would of course be wrong, as would forced sterilization.

But there has to be some middle ground here. If you cannot support your children you do not deserve to have them. Parenthood is about you doing things for your children, not your children being your emotional props or merit badges.

82 posted on 02/18/2009 1:27:24 PM PST by jimt
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To: Twink

I clearly should have read your further comments before posting...


83 posted on 02/18/2009 1:31:37 PM PST by jimt
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah
If you listen to Greta’s interview, Sarah herself says abstinence is naive.

Everybody is bashing Bristol but nobody is commenting on Sarah’s views.


I think abstinence can still be taught, but in this day and age, it's getting harder and harder. Sarah herself was probably pregnant with her oldest before she was married and she understands that, just as her daughter now does. The Christian in me shudders at this, but the realist in me accepts that it's just the way things are in this day and age.

Making a general comment (not specific towards Sarah), but the problem today is, way too many parents don't pay attention to their kids. They let the TV or the computer babysit them and then wonder how their kid ended up in whatever situation they ended up in. This extends to other areas, including public education. My wife has taught and tutored on and off over the past 30 years, and she has seen a very distinct change over that time, from people who were concerned about their kids education, friends, etc., to people who communicate more with their kids by text messages than in person.
84 posted on 02/18/2009 2:18:23 PM PST by af_vet_rr
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To: Twink

Amen.


85 posted on 02/18/2009 2:25:02 PM PST by blueminnesota
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To: TAdams8591

I agree to much of what you’ve said.

I still think it all comes down to responsibility and accountability. We don’t seem to teach that much anymore.

Two parent families are best in most cases. Two parents who love each other, respect each other, are best. Two people who take their committment seriously, best.

Even the best parents, still have kids who screw up. As a parent, I would never shun my kid for a mistake, or the mistake of having pre marital sex, getting pregnant. It’s been happening forever. Families have dealt with it. My family has dealt with it by encouraging marriage but doesn’t always happen. The baby is always embraced. Families take care of their own. Some cultures, or some segments of our society have lost that.

Absinence isn’t unrealistic in all cases but it is in some. As it’s been since forever. Before, we used to deal with it within the family. Some people sent their kids away, gave up the baby for adoption, etc., pretended like it never happened. Or some got married right away. I don’t know what the answer is other than families should take care of their own. It’s not the government’s job to support anyone.

Rather than just teaching abstinence, we should be teaching everything and especially personal responsibility and accountablity. We’re focusing on the lowest segment of our society and trying to teach them common sense. IMO. Once the government pays (rewards) bad choices, there’s gonna be people (and in some cases a whole race of people) who find it easier to rely on the government/taxpayers to pay their way. We can’t, or shouldn’t, broad brush those who have always taken care of their own business without government/taxpayers.

We can’t hold parents responsible for their children/teens behavior in the broad brush way.


86 posted on 02/22/2009 3:36:11 PM PST by Twink
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To: Dianna

That’s a difficult situation for sure. She may use the baby to manipulate the parents (grandparents). I’ve seen it done.

It is heartbreaking.

I can see this scenario with that niece I mentioned. It wouldn’t surprise me.

Again if there wasn’t welfare/government help, there may not be this problem. Other problems for sure, but not to the extent there appears to be now.

I don’t know what the answer is. I figure I have no control over anything or anyone but my own kids and then only to the extent that I teach them right.


87 posted on 02/22/2009 3:47:31 PM PST by Twink
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To: jimt

I do that too at times :)


88 posted on 02/22/2009 3:50:31 PM PST by Twink
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To: LearsFool

My feelings exactly!


89 posted on 02/22/2009 4:04:57 PM PST by wintertime
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To: LearsFool
My daughters were homeschooled and both earned B.S. degrees in mathematics by the age of 18.

A **lot** of children could be graduating from college or trade school at 16, 17, or 18. Our government schools (deliberately and maliciously) artificially retard children in their social and educational development!

90 posted on 02/22/2009 4:09:18 PM PST by wintertime
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To: wintertime
Our government schools (deliberately and maliciously) artificially retard children in their social and educational development!

The problem is we promote students (grade to grade) at the same time. Smarter people should advance faster.

91 posted on 02/22/2009 4:13:48 PM PST by Doe Eyes
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah
Everybody is bashing Bristol but nobody is commenting on Sarah’s views.

If you want to last very long in this forum, I suggest you let that one go.

92 posted on 02/22/2009 4:41:20 PM PST by Doe Eyes
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