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To: Mojave
Pretending that the 2nd Amendment was a restriction on the states

It was. Note the 1st says "Congress shall make no law", but the 2nd says "the right of the people shall not be infringed". It doesn't say just by Congress, but by anybody. That's because the Federal government needed to ensure that the people would be armed for the defense of the country. By ratifying it, the states agreed not to disarm the people.

16 posted on 06/04/2009 6:19:05 AM PDT by Hugin (GSA! (Goodbye sweet America))
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To: Hugin
Note the 1st says "Congress shall make no law", but the 2nd says "the right of the people shall not be infringed". It doesn't say just by Congress

The Bill of Rights is a set of declaratory restrictions on the powers granted to the federal government by the states.

21 posted on 06/04/2009 6:23:00 AM PDT by Mojave (Don't blame me. I voted for McClintock.)
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To: Hugin

Right on !


36 posted on 06/04/2009 6:33:29 AM PDT by devistate one four (Back by popular demand: America love or leave it (GTFOOMC) TET68)
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To: Hugin

Disarming the Law-abiding only empowers the criminals and the government.

There is NO other reason to Disarm the Law-abiding than to empower the government, It has been shown time after time that it does not reduce crime.

There is only one reason the Statists want Disarm the Law-abiding either through Registration and then Confiscation, Taxation, restricting ammo sales, treaties or Judicial fiat.


96 posted on 06/04/2009 8:26:07 AM PDT by HammerT (Buy them so they CAN'T Ban them!)
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To: Hugin
I take a slightly different view. The Federalist argued against including a bill of rights in the Constitution precisely because it would lead to the erroneous conclusion that the feds, through the doctrine of constructive powers, could exercise legitimate authority over the subject of the enumerated right. The Federalists were prescient. From Federalist No. 84:

“It has been several times truly remarked that bills of rights are, in their origin, stipulations between kings and their subjects, abridgements of prerogative in favor of privilege, reservations of rights not surrendered to the prince. Such was MAGNA CHARTA, obtained by the barons, sword in hand, from King John. Such were the subsequent confirmations of that charter by succeeding princes. Such was the PETITION OF RIGHT assented to by Charles I., in the beginning of his reign. Such, also, was the Declaration of Right presented by the Lords and Commons to the Prince of Orange in 1688, and afterwards thrown into the form of an act of parliament called the Bill of Rights. It is evident, therefore, that, according to their primitive signification, they have no application to constitutions professedly founded upon the power of the people, and executed by their immediate representatives and servants. Here, in strictness, the people surrender nothing; and as they retain every thing they have no need of particular reservations. ``WE, THE PEOPLE of the United States, to secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ORDAIN and ESTABLISH this Constitution for the United States of America.’’ Here is a better recognition of popular rights, than volumes of those aphorisms which make the principal figure in several of our State bills of rights, and which would sound much better in a treatise of ethics than in a constitution of government.

But a minute detail of particular rights is certainly far less applicable to a Constitution like that under consideration, which is merely intended to regulate the general political interests of the nation, than to a constitution which has the regulation of every species of personal and private concerns. If, therefore, the loud clamors against the plan of the convention, on this score, are well founded, no epithets of reprobation will be too strong for the constitution of this State. But the truth is, that both of them contain all which, in relation to their objects, is reasonably to be desired.

I go further, and affirm that bills of rights, in the sense and to the extent in which they are contended for, are not only unnecessary in the proposed Constitution, but would even be dangerous. They would contain various exceptions to powers not granted; and, on this very account, would afford a colorable pretext to claim more than were granted. For why declare that things shall not be done which there is no power to do? Why, for instance, should it be said that the liberty of the press shall not be restrained, when no power is given by which restrictions may be imposed? I will not contend that such a provision would confer a regulating power; but it is evident that it would furnish, to men disposed to usurp, a plausible pretense for claiming that power. They might urge with a semblance of reason, that the Constitution ought not to be charged with the absurdity of providing against the abuse of an authority which was not given, and that the provision against restraining the liberty of the press afforded a clear implication, that a power to prescribe proper regulations concerning it was intended to be vested in the national government. This may serve as a specimen of the numerous handles which would be given to the doctrine of constructive powers, by the indulgence of an injudicious zeal for bills of rights.”

374 posted on 06/04/2009 2:33:28 PM PDT by DivaDelMar (CRAm member-- (Conservative Republicans Against mcCain) Think you're entitled to my vote? CRAm It!!!)
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