Posted on 07/11/2010 9:15:56 AM PDT by Kaslin
Driving is a privilege. Gun ownership is a right.
Two very different things.
Don’t mind the training, per se. I just hate being told what I have to do.
I agree.
The best way to do that would be to repeal universal suffrage and restrict it to property-owners.
That, and repeal the amendment that allows for direct-elections of Senators. Senators were supposed to be the state governments representatives in the national government... while the House of Representatives represented the national populace.
And anyone who says 'axe' instead of 'ask' immediately fails.
Right. Like Alexander Hamilton.
Like I said I have seen attributes from both sides.
Actually poke holes in my logic or if it is easier find me an American who doesn’t know how to operate a TV.
It’s not unreasonable to think that the founders views towards the militia would have included equipment. But it is unreasonable to think their views toward the militia would not have included training and discipline. In fact, they heavily engaged in that very thing whenever the threat of war loomed.
Training, you say? Great, says the VPC! If some is good, more has to be better, right? So why not a four-year long set of classes available only in Nome, Alaska, for the privilege of checking out a .22 from the nearby police station once every leap year? For a graduate degree you get to check out the ammo too. One cartridge at a time.
Sorry, folks, but the well is poisoned and this camper isn't drinking from it. While I encourage firearms training and have taught classes myself, this is an open invitation to abuse, handed to people who have a long history of abusing.
“For example, if someone started selling a megawatt gamma ray laser pistol that you could carry in your pocket, cost $10, and when fired would blow holes through buildings for several miles ? well, that sounds pretty scary.”
A .50 cal Desert Eagle costs more, but comes close. And I did legally carry one concealed once. (Long story, nothing resulted.)
PS I know someone working on a man-portable hard gamma ray laser cannon. Amazing physics involved. Funny you should cite that as an example. And yes, if he can get funded and the physics pans out, it will blow holes through ANYTHING at miles away. Or worse (eg, convert some of the target into antimatter, which will promptly annihilate). Cost will be considerably more than $10, though.
All politicians should be limited to TWO terms.
The first one in office, the second one in JAIL.
And I’m deadly serious.
My point is that in that era most every man had extensive firearm training. Of course they would prefer military training but would take what they could get as long as they had a gun.
A Navy SEAL with a rock at 200 yards is less effective than the average deer hunter with a 30.06. Even Hamilton knew this.
The point is that “well regulated” meant well equipped not militarily trained with a stick.
Don’t get me wrong, Eaker. I totally understand the modern fear of governmental control over the militia. The Founders were operating from assumptions about how a self-governing society has to operate. They assumed that we would not be foolish enough to give power to domestic enemies of the people and of liberty, as, unfortunately, we have now done. They assumed a high degree of trust between the people and those who represented them.
Once a people ceases being self-governing and wise, and that symbiotic relationship between the people and those who represent them breaks down, the important things that are premised upon all of that begin to fall down.
But, still, the Constitution says what it says.
The one bright spot is that if anyone now in government actually tried to exercise the power implicit in the Second Amendment and in the Constitutional powers granted to the Commander-in Chief, especially in the face of insufficient threats, the people almost certainly would wake up. There would be an uprising. That, I believe, is why those in power have opted instead to build a professional military. They’re too cowardly to actually deal with the people.
The one massive bulwark we still have against the tyrants is the habit of liberty of the people.
I agree 100%.
This is why they want to take our equipment.
Notice that Veterans go back into the general population with their training but without their weapons. They cannot even affordably own the weapons they were train on.
Almost all Americans at that time knew how to shoot. Militia training was about learning to march, maintain ranks and other martial arts.
Yep. Training. And learning to maintain discipline.
I support folks getting training, but don’t want it to be a requirement.
A woman finds out her violent ex-boyfriend just followed her to a new town. Should she have to wait to enroll in a class and get a license to carry a gun that might save her life?
I just took a CCW class in Arizona. The shooting part consisted of hitting a target the size of a man’s chest at 5 & 10 yards. No one failed, or came close to failing, and some of the guys had never fired a gun before.
What is really needed is the sense God gave a goose - to know not to shoot unless someone’s life is in danger. I’m not sure that can be taught. Told, but maybe not taught. And I wouldn’t want to tell someone in fear of their life not to carry because a class wasn’t available until next month...
If it is required for this Right, it should be required for the privilage of VOTING. More harm can be done by millions of untrained VOTERS than all of the negligent discharges in human history.
shall not be infringed... means just that...
who’s to say what a passng grade is in your licensing of gun owners...
you say live free or die in your tag line but your posts say differently.
teeman
Eaker said No, they meant well equipped.
EternalVigilance said The quoted passages support the idea that a well-regulated militia was synonymous with one that was thoroughly trained and disciplined, and as a result, well-functioning.
Eaker said Lots of stuff written by other people with their own agenda....my interpretation is the only one that makes any logical sense.
Eaker then said Actually poke holes in my logic...
EternalVigilance said It’s not unreasonable to think that the founders views towards the militia would have included equipment. But it is unreasonable to think their views toward the militia would not have included training and discipline.
I say that I agree that it is unreasonable to think that the views of the founders concerning the militia would not have included training and discipline. Therefore, I believe that the hole has been satisfactorily poked! (I am not a Vulcan, but I do believe that EternalVigilance has expounded logically).
Finally, I hope we all can agree that then and now, it is important that we the people, to be well-prepared for the unknown, should be both well equipped and well trained. If I am wrong, feel free to discipline me. ☺
Eaker, I meant to send 78 to you as well as EternalVigilance. Sorry.
Are you out of your mind? Don’t give them any more idea to tax us
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