Posted on 05/24/2011 7:19:58 PM PDT by Perdogg
If the GOP uses Clinton videos saying “I think the Democrats are going to have to be willing to give up, maybe, some short-term political gain by whipping up fears on some of these things.” while the Dems use videos of Newt’s “right-wing social engineering” that could be interesting.
Unfortunately, the media will allow Clinton to “clarify” his statements but will allow no such liberties to Newt.
And Clinton’s idea of “doing something” could be making Obamacare stronger. If the GOP wins in 2012 there is some hope, but they have let us down before.
This happened a lot in the 2010 election. For some reason, conservatives think the Tea Party candidates (no matter lack of credentials or how poorly they present themselves) are preferable to GOPers with solid track records. Think O'Donnell, Angle, Joe Miller and numerous House races where "Tea Party" (sometimes ron paul's Campaign for Liberty disguised as Republican) and Club for Growth pushed their own candidate when there was already a credible conservative/Republican running.
It's the new democrat tactic and working like a charm. Talk radio has been on board for over a year.... conservatives guaranteeing that democrats will be elected.
It's too bad how stupid people can be....
By getting rid of it by forcing everyone under 55 out of it and handing them a voucher? What good will that do to someone in a nursing home? Someone 96 tears old and senile?No-one buys such Koolaid.
RE :”With “conservatives” like you, who needs liberals?’
I dont drink Koolaid, I gave that up in 2008. If you are successful here pushing this putting Pelosi back as Speaker before the Republicans get anything reformed or cut passed into law, you might just as well be working for her. Pushing something even you knew was unpopular without getting the voters prepared for it first will go down as the biggest blunder of all times, just last year your buddies were going to 'protect' benefits.
RE :”No, they needed to strike while the iron was hot. They had a political moment, which is not yet lost.”
What iron? These ideas were unpopular before they were even made public, plus the house cant get anything into law by themselves anyway, and this was not even a real bill. Are you joking? . Even Pelosi knew not to force suicide votes on her members 2007-2008 until she had the WH and super majority to get her liberal stuff passed into law. Why hand over power to democrats without getting any reforms into law first? That saves nothing.
RE :The alternative -- that we do NOTHING -
Obama used that same line to get Obama-care passed. It is a lie, there are many less toxic variations they could have put up for a vote. Plus, do NOTHING? At the end of the day your unpopular plan here will do nothing, because you were never serious about getting any reforms into law, just symbolic suicide votes without the hard political prep-work., THAT IS DOING NOTHING.
Only about a third of upstate New Yorkers are conservative or informed enough to cast a conservative vote. Most are instead waiting for a check in the mail from somebody who “cares.”
Here's my reaction in 2009 when Republicans made their platform guaranteeing medicare benefits by protecting them from cuts, I posted this comment on it:
To: nmh; truthandlife
Holy crap! This ‘plan’ is a political document that guarantees seniors tax payer funded entitlements. If you ever needed a call to dump the dollar this is it. A long term disaster.
#5 posted on Tuesday, August 25, 2009 12:53:10 PM by sickoflibs (Socialist Conservatives: “’Big government is free because tax cuts pay for it’”)
Posted on this thread:
Republicans have lately intensified their health-care message toward the elderly. The Republican National Committee's “bill of rights” includes calls to “protect Medicare,” “prohibit efforts to ration health care based on age” and “ensure seniors can keep their current coverage. ”
GOP Pushes Health ‘Bill of Rights’(FR post of Washington Post ^ | 8/25/09 | Ben Pershing )
I didnt drink Republican Koolaid then and I wont now.
“This happened a lot in the 2010 election. For some reason, conservatives think the Tea Party candidates (no matter lack of credentials or how poorly they present themselves) are preferable to GOPers with solid track records. Think O’Donnell, Angle, Joe Miller and numerous House races where “Tea Party” (sometimes ron paul’s Campaign for Liberty disguised as Republican) and Club for Growth pushed their own candidate when there was already a credible conservative/Republican running.”
I think you forgot your sarcasm tag...
By returning them some actual part of what they've paid in, as opposed to NOTHING. That is YOUR alternative: to bankrupt the country. The healthcare system for all Americans is in trouble because of Medicare and Medicaid. Those programs distort the market and make cost containment impossible. The government should NOT be involved in healthcare and if we can't summon the will to force that issue, we can at least get people to save their money into the fund and perhaps get at least some of it back someday.
What good will that do to someone in a nursing home? Someone 96 tears old and senile?
What utter crap. The person you're talking about will experience this issue in no less than 42 years! If you can't save enough money to take care of yourself in 42 years, please don't come whining to me about bailing you out.
No-one buys such Koolaid [sic].
YOU are the one drinking Kool-Aid. Under even the most unrealistic assumptions Medicare will be completely exhausted in 15 years. It is ALREADY -- as of right now -- impossible for the program to meet its future obligations.
You aren't a conservative or a libertarian. Please stop pretending to be one. Please go drink your Kool-Aid over at DU, or some other forum where they swallow the crap that the money is going to hold out forever if we just garnishee peoples' pensions and kill all the "rich" people. Even that won't save the Entitlements for very long.
Lie, you are bankrupting the country by passing nothing and electing Democrats.
RE :” If you can't save enough money to take care of yourself in 42 years, please don't come whining to me about bailing you out ”
Again you show yourself to be dishonest or just ignorant. Nursing homes on the east cost ~ 6K per month, = 72K per year. So lets see, the fellow retiring at a salary of 50K could live 15 years in a nursing home and you scoff because he doesnt save 1.08 million dollars for his retirement with a boom bust economy, You are very dishonest about the issue by lying and saying you are protecting this person. At least go out and tell the truth what you will do with the millions in nursing care homes.
Republican + DemoRat masquerading as “Tea Party” = 51%
Like all liberals, you believe this money comes from a magic machine. Please do tell me, where do you think "the country" is going to come up with this money if individual taxpayers themselves can't? "0bama's stash?"
Thanks. You have made my point. Keep posting so you can refute all of your other nonsense, by all means.
Oy vey.
We got to see what kind of person Mike Castle was. He lost the Republican primary, fair and square. Now, instead of being a "good Republican" he stood by and let the I-495 crowd trash the Republican winner, while he did nothing. Nothing! This to you is a good Republican -- someone who loses and then doesn't have the grace to even endorse his own Party's nominee?
It's hilarious. Conservatives are expected to fall in line without fail for the "moderates," but given EXACTLY the same choice, these "moderates" go out and trash the people who pay and volunteer for this Party as "extremists." BS. The moderates don't man the phone banks and they don't make the donations, but they sure as hell feel entitled to a conservative loyalty they've never returned.
You were the one who arrogantly asked (demanded) why all seniors couldnt just save that $1M money themselves for retirement, when it was an idiotic question. If you are seriously proposing closing down thousands of nursing homes and rolling the patients out to the alleys to die, I am not objecting, just stop lying and admit what you are proposing. We can talk about that. Are you saying I have to be dishonest like you to be a conservative in your eyes?
Speaking of dishonest: the 96 year old senile retiree in your example is a 44 year old right now. Nobody's shutting down any nursing homes any time soon. But again, don't let facts get in the way of your liberal fantasy that there's an unlimited supply of government money for everybody. And don't let facts keep you from scaremongering that conservatives are out to shutdown all the nursing homes in the country.
Step away from the bong and go post where you belong.
So we can just act like these people never existed that get a stroke at 75 and dont have a million dollars for nursing care? Your plan is they just lie where they are until they die from lack of water? And we just tell voters who pay taxes that they better not live too long if they dont have money? Just be honest and spell it out. The nursing homes are full of these people now. Just tell the truth. No one believes your lies so you might as well just be honest about it. Your being honest about your position doesnt cost taxpayers a dime so stop saying it does.
AND that’s why i intend to vote with my feet in a few short years!
Keep digging.
believe it or not I really wanted to learn your view on this, not even saying you are wrong to support Ryan. I learned from you.
I learned from you.
Riiiiiiggggggghhhhhhtttttt. Civil discourse: the mark of a person interested in enlightenment.
Well I didnt learn anything useful from the above comment, but I did from our Ryan debate last night, it just may not be what you intended.
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