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To: NewinTexsas

“Everyone in State College knew about the 1998 investigation...”

DID they? No charges were filed. That would be private information in Iowa. I’m sure there were rumors, but then again maybe there weren’t.

Now IF the details of that, i.e. the on tape confession, came to Joe’s ears, now that’s a different story. But we have no proof that it did, other than second hand I doubt he was privy to the actual police report. Even so Joe suspected something because Sandusky was booted out. But that was suspicion only as far as we know.

‘Suspicion’ is not ‘knowing’. Moving heaven and earth on suspicion is at best risky. I’ve done that myself only to be dead wrong and caused more damage than I sought to fix. You are a bit more limited when confined to suspicion.

Even the second incident in 2002 - again the authorities found nothing. There was still no proof other than the word of McQueary, so even if Joe believed McQueary he still had no real proof but just suspicion.

Should he have followed up? Yes. Should he have moved heaven and earth? You say he should have give a word to the proper people. Well guess what, that was done in 1998 and they ignored a TAPED CONFESSION. What would have going to the cops done on the word of a grad student done in 2002?


267 posted on 11/11/2011 10:34:09 AM PST by Free Vulcan (Vote Republican! You can vote Democrat when you're dead.)
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To: Free Vulcan
Now IF the details of that, i.e. the on tape confession, came to Joe’s ears, now that’s a different story. But we have no proof that it did, other than second hand I doubt he was privy to the actual police report. Even so Joe suspected something because Sandusky was booted out. But that was suspicion only as far as we know.

Child services and two police departments made investigations. Are you saying no one interviewed the dude's boss and the person responsible for the facilities where the dude was raping little boys? It does not wash.

270 posted on 11/11/2011 10:53:48 AM PST by NewinTexsas
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To: Free Vulcan
Should he have followed up? Yes. Should he have moved heaven and earth? You say he should have give a word to the proper people. Well guess what, that was done in 1998 and they ignored a TAPED CONFESSION. What would have going to the cops done on the word of a grad student done in 2002?

One call to Tom Ridge would have stopped it cold. Give me a break.

271 posted on 11/11/2011 10:55:54 AM PST by NewinTexsas
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To: Free Vulcan
they ignored a TAPED CONFESSION

First, we don't know what Sandusky said on the tape. It was a conversation with the mother in which Jerry Sandusky 'confessed' to something that would have been molestation. Apparently whatever Sandusky said that someone listening would say "oh, jeez, he did it," but not enough that a DA felt he could bring a case against, and convict, one of the most powerful men in Pennsylvania. A man known throughout the state.

A man who had started a charity to help troubled youth. A man who had adopted kids and served as a foster parent to others. A man whose best friend was probably Joe Paterno and whose character witnesses may have included Joe Paterno and over twenty years' worth of Penn State football players.

And we don't know that the tape was admissible as evidence.

And, if I'm not mistaken, the DA didn't have the file from the University Police investigation of at least two additional incidents; the file that VP Schultz was surprised in 2002 to find was 'so big."

And Sandusky wasn't booted out, at least according to the Official Penn State Story. Sandusky was told he would not replace Joe Paterno as head coach, although he was the heir apparent. Sandusky had just been named NCAA Assistant Coach of the Year. As a football coach? Sandusky is considered one of the greatest college coaches never to be a head coach. Probably THE greatest. So Sandusky 'took an early retirement' and was given emeritus status by the University.

In retrospect, he may have been told "you will not replace Joe Paterno . . . because you shower with little boys and were investigated for molesting one." Because it may be private information in Iowa or Pennsylvania, but there's not much involving the Penn State football program that would have been private from Joe Paterno according to any reliable source.

You have a 'suspicion' that Sandusky 'confessed' on tape. More likely, he said something that indicated, yep, he did it. But it wasn't a confession. And more likely, not enough to go after the defensive coordinator at Linebacker U.

275 posted on 11/11/2011 12:26:44 PM PST by Scoutmaster (I stand for something; therefore, I can't stand Romney)
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To: Free Vulcan; Colofornian
Well guess what, that was done in 1998 and they ignored a TAPED CONFESSION.

Sorry, I was out late and up early. I took advantage by phone of a Pennsylvania Bar Association friend who had an extra glass or two of wine last night.

He said something like "Awww. The mom just talked a lot. Read Victim #6. Those were the taped calls. Jerry admitted showering with the kid and hugging him but not admitted molesting the kid. Jerry apologized and said he wanted to kill himself."

Well, he was close, despite the wine. The tape relates to "Victim #6" in the Grand Jury Presentment.

According to Page 19, as State College Police Department Detective Ralph Ralston (the real police; not the University police) listened in on the phone:

'the mother confronted Sandusky about showering with her son; the effect it had on her son; whether Sandusky had sexual feelings when he hugged her naked son in the shower and where Victim 6's buttocks where when Sandusky hugged him.

Sandusky said he showered with other boys and Victim 6's mother tried to make Sandusky promise never to shower with a boy again, but he would not.

She asked him if his 'private parts' touched Victim 6 when he bear-hugged him. Sandusky replied "I don't think so . . . maybe."

At the conclusion of the second call, the mother told Sandusky he could not see Victim 6 again. Sandusky said:

"I understand. I was wrong. I wish I could get forgiveness. I know I won't get it from you. I wish I were dead."

The GJ presentment says that Sandusky was interviewed by a public welfare agent and a detective; admitted he showered with Victim 6 and hugging him in the shower, and admitted it was wrong. He was told not to do it again.

Victim 6 didn't allege any sexual acts with Sandusky, just the showering. Multiple showers, back rubs, or saunas appear to have led to increasing invasive sexual contact by Sandusky with a victim. Victim 6 reported the incident to his mother after the first shower in the locker room by Holuba Hall at Penn State. So that's it. No wonder Gricar didn't indict him.

Sandusky was taped admitting that he showered with boys and that he hugged one. That's wrong but doesn't meet the legal standard for molestation. And his contribution and request for forgiveness represented evidence of guilt . . . but guilt for what? Molesting or doing something wrong such as the admitted nude showering and hugging?

At the time, Sandusky was the defensive coordinator at Penn State, the most famous assistant coach in football, the founder of a well-known youth charity with Trustees from every famous corner of sports, a father and foster parent, the creator of Linebacker U's name, a man 35 years' of connection to Penn State.

Gricar couldn't convicted him for molestation based on two tapes in which Sandusky admitted to showering with a boy and hugging him, and then apologizing for it and saying he was wrong.

And at this point, I am putting on the attorney hat that I hate to ever wear.

289 posted on 11/12/2011 2:51:12 AM PST by Scoutmaster (I stand for something; therefore, I can't stand Romney)
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