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Navy jet crashes into apartments in Virginia
cnn.com ^ | April 6, 2012 | Mike Ahlers and Barbara Starr

Posted on 04/06/2012 10:28:44 AM PDT by Free ThinkerNY

(CNN) -- A Navy jet crashed Friday into some apartments near Virginia Beach, Virginia, sending flames and thick black smoke into the air, a military spokesman and a witness said.

Two apartment buildings were on fire, CNN affiliate WTKR reporting, citing witnesses.

The jet was from Naval Air Station Oceana in Virginia Beach, the Federal Aviation Administration said.

The crew of the two-seater F/A-18 safely ejected, but their condition wasn't known, a Navy spokesman said.

The plane is from a training squadron, the Navy said.

George Pilkington, an eye witness to the crash, said he was the plane flying low, with its nose up and tail down, ejecting fuel -- which struck him as unusual. The engine was straining, he said.

(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Front Page News; News/Current Events; US: Virginia
KEYWORDS: aviation; fa18; fa18d; nasoceana; navair; planecrash; vfa106; virginia; virginiabeach

1 posted on 04/06/2012 10:28:47 AM PDT by Free ThinkerNY
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To: Free ThinkerNY

It appears to have gone down aprox. 2 miles short of Rwy 23L, which at 12,000’ is Oceana’s longest.


2 posted on 04/06/2012 10:32:08 AM PDT by diogenes ghost
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To: Free ThinkerNY; Tax-chick; Constitution Day
George Pilkington, an eye witness to the crash, said he was the plane flying low, with its nose up and tail down, ejecting fuel -- which struck him as unusual.

What ever happened to editors?

3 posted on 04/06/2012 10:34:23 AM PDT by martin_fierro (< |:)~)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

I’m sitting here in the customer lounge having my car serviced, watching it. One pilot is hospitalized. Five apartment buildings on fire, injuries and fatalities on the ground are unclear, several dazed survivors came stumbling out of the smoke according to witnesses.


4 posted on 04/06/2012 10:35:36 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: Free ThinkerNY
I recall a tragedy here in Sacramento. A B-52 crashed near Mather AFB. An Internet source identified the plane as "B-52G [at] Mather, 23 Dec 1982." I recall that the B-52G and the B-52H were from Castle AFB doing what I've always heard described as "touch and go" but actually it was two B-52s doing MITO.

How it happened is described by a USAF member familiar with the training exercises taking place at the time. Also from the Internet.

"This was a MITO (Minimum Interval Take-Off) with a B-52H in front, and a B-52G in the rear.

"SAC TAC Doctrine required 9 second spacing between similar aircraft, but 30 second spacing between dissimilar aircraft.

"Unfortunately, the planners thought that B-52G's and H's were similar aircraft--They are not.

"For about 90 seconds during take-off, the B-52G's water injected engines are more powerful than the otherwise perkier B-52H engines.

"The pilot of the trailing B-52G pulled back power to avoid collision with the B-52H...Several engines flamed-out, and the G-model crashed in a field. Only the EW ejected, but the hapless fellow's chute took him through the fireball. Needless to say, nobody survived."

It was reported that the pilot avoided hitting any structures on the ground.

Yet more reminders that even without actual combat there are hourly heroics and sacrifices made by our military.

5 posted on 04/06/2012 10:37:21 AM PDT by WilliamofCarmichael (If modern America's Man on Horseback is out there, Get on the damn horse already!)
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To: martin_fierro
What ever happened to editors?

They got lazy and assume that if text passes MSWord's spelling and grammar check, the spelling and usage is correct.

(I note with amusement the irony of your replacing whatever with "what ever" in your complaint.)

6 posted on 04/06/2012 10:44:12 AM PDT by The_Reader_David (And when they behead your own people in the wars which are to come, then you will know. . .)
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To: martin_fierro

>>George Pilkington, an eye witness to the crash, said he was the plane flying low<<

Hey, it passed spell check!

Seriously, I hope no one on the ground was hurt. Those planes are bigger than people realize.


7 posted on 04/06/2012 10:48:25 AM PDT by freedumb2003 ('RETRO' Abortions = performed on 84th trimester individuals who think killing babies is a "right.")
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To: Free ThinkerNY

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2126223/Virginia-beach-plane-crash-F-18-hits-apartment-building.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Freep the comments at Daily Mail!

CNN sucks.


8 posted on 04/06/2012 10:51:17 AM PDT by wolficatZ ("We are no longer accepting comments on this article")
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To: Free ThinkerNY

A co-worker friend of mine just relayed a story to me....his step-father was a navy pilot that flew an A4. He told my friend (his step-son)about a time when he had a flame out and took his jet out over the Pacific and ejected. He was pissed that he had to swim:). But he said they were told specifically if over houses to either ride it into the ground or get it over the water and eject but under no circumstances were they to eject over houses where they would live and innocents would die.

I wonder if that’s still how they are supposed to think. I would hate to think i killed someone and walked away personally but at the same time riding a jet into the ground when there is no control left seems silly too. Does anybody know anything about this stuff?


9 posted on 04/06/2012 10:55:35 AM PDT by Shamrock498
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To: martin_fierro

Not to make like of the story at all. Prayers up.

I think I’ve been there and done this - “with its nose up and tail down, ejecting fuel”


10 posted on 04/06/2012 10:57:21 AM PDT by listenhillary (Courts, law enforcement, roads and national defense should be the extent of government)
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To: The_Reader_David
(I note with amusement the irony of your replacing whatever with "what ever" in your complaint.)

What's so funny/ironic?

11 posted on 04/06/2012 11:01:57 AM PDT by martin_fierro (< |:)~)
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To: Shamrock498

Although an extremely noble gesture, like a captain going down with his ship, it’s usually not the pilot’s fault. And for the crew to ride the aircraft into the ground is a needless and useless exercise.

I’m not saying one human life is worth more than other, but in an accident scenario, should we be advocating the “sacrifice” of highly trained combat pilots?


12 posted on 04/06/2012 11:03:00 AM PDT by SZonian (Throwing our allegiances to political party's in the long run gave away our liberty.)
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To: The_Reader_David

“What ever happened,” seems like perfectly fine grammar to me. Take out the ever, it would read “what happened.” Whatever is a slang word, what kids say when they don’t want to hear what adults are saying. Irony, indeed.


13 posted on 04/06/2012 11:08:55 AM PDT by webheart
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To: martin_fierro
>> George Pilkington, an eye witness to the crash, said he was the plane flying low, with its nose up and tail down, ejecting fuel -- which struck him as unusual.

What ever happened to editors?


Well it's an actual eyewitness account. The problem is that George Pilkington is a meth addict who really believed he was the plane, which, in his words, "struck him as unusual".
14 posted on 04/06/2012 11:13:34 AM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: SZonian

I think the idea was that maybe you could save someones life by steering it as best you could until it hit the ground and avoid taking others with you. My story was a second ahnd story so im just relaying as it was told to me.

I’m not advocating anything. I was just wondering if anybody knows what the policies or practices that pilots are taught nowadays are. It would probably depend on exactly what the mechanicle failure was too, loss of power equals no control so there would be no point in sticking around, i agree.


15 posted on 04/06/2012 11:13:51 AM PDT by Shamrock498
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To: martin_fierro
George Pilkington, an eye witness to the crash, said he was the plane flying low,[ . . . ]

What ever happened to editors?


Blame George H.W. Bush and the Americans with Disabilities Act. Dyslexics now get to be writers and editors.
16 posted on 04/06/2012 11:27:47 AM PDT by Dr. Sivana (May Mitt Romney be the Paul Tsongas of 2012.)
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To: Shamrock498

Understood,

Most, if not all pilots try desperately to steer away from populated areas, some try so hard they don’t make it out of their aircraft.

Sorry, didn’t mean to make it sound like you were “advocating”, re-reading my comment I can see where it might look like that.

From my time in the USAF, I’m not sure if there is a “policy”, probably some unwritten “rule” that you do your best, but that the aircraft can be replaced, people can’t.

Some failures are so catastrophic, that pilots aren’t given a choice to try and avoid populated areas and are forced to eject as soon as possible. Re: the F117A crash in Maryland about 10 years ago. The wing came apart and the aircraft instantly went out of control. The pilot had no choice but to eject and pray for those on the ground.


17 posted on 04/06/2012 11:38:14 AM PDT by SZonian (Throwing our allegiances to political party's in the long run gave away our liberty.)
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To: martin_fierro

He was the plane. Gotta love that ...


18 posted on 04/06/2012 11:42:20 AM PDT by Tax-chick ("Love means to give absolutely everything." ~ Dominik Cdl. Duka)
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To: WilliamofCarmichael

“...that even without actual combat there are hourly heroics and sacrifices made...”

A good friend of mine, a retired Fleet sailor on carriers for most of his career said it this way:

“We never came back with everyone we left with. Never.”


19 posted on 04/06/2012 11:42:36 AM PDT by NFHale (The Second Amendment - By Any Means Necessary.)
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To: SZonian

From what I understand, the plane crashed shortly after takeoff, which may mean that there was no time or power to steer the craft to a safer area.


20 posted on 04/06/2012 11:47:33 AM PDT by SlowBoat407 (Anyone can fib. It takes an intellectual to tell a really big lie.)
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To: SZonian

no problem. Thanks, I appreciate your response. I agree with you. Each situation is going to be different and the pilots just do their best.


21 posted on 04/06/2012 11:48:00 AM PDT by Shamrock498
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To: Shamrock498

Most pilots will stay with the plane long enough to insure it doesn’t land on people. However in many cases the pilots lose all ability to control the aircraft.

If they can’t control it why would they ride it in to their deaths?


22 posted on 04/06/2012 11:48:43 AM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: SlowBoat407

Which also means they probably had little altitude.

Leaves practically no margin for error or time for action.

Thanks,
SZ


23 posted on 04/06/2012 11:54:30 AM PDT by SZonian (Throwing our allegiances to political party's in the long run gave away our liberty.)
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To: martin_fierro
What ever happened to editors?

Just be thankful they didn't alter the quote to this:

George Pilkington, an eye witness to the crash, said the pilot was black -- which struck him as unusual.

24 posted on 04/06/2012 11:57:16 AM PDT by Erik Latranyi (When religions have to beg the gov't for a waiver, we are already under socialism.)
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To: magslinger

ping


25 posted on 04/06/2012 12:06:12 PM PDT by Vroomfondel
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Tail down nose up

Classic stall configuration


26 posted on 04/06/2012 12:11:34 PM PDT by GIANTSBEATPATS
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To: WilliamofCarmichael
Yet more reminders that even without actual combat there are hourly heroics and sacrifices made by our military.

Your last statement is SO correct! I live in Jacksonville,NC, which is home to CampLejeune MCB and New River Air Station. Our community knows all too well the sacrifices made every day by our military - whether they are at home or deployed. The liberals probably think that it is a waste of time and resources for them to "practice" so much, but that is the reason that they can perform so well in combat situations. They have trained so well that they do their jobs without even thinking. A case in point is the recent story or a soldier who was killed saving a young Afghan girl who was about to be run over by a large military vehicle. He acted instinctively without regard to his own personal safety.

27 posted on 04/06/2012 12:26:32 PM PDT by srmorton (Deut. 30 19: "..I have set before you life and death,....therefore, choose life..")
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Updraft from that hot air Dick Durbin’s spewing today.


28 posted on 04/06/2012 12:27:52 PM PDT by ArmstedFragg (hoaxy dopey changey)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

My son is stationed there. Had a few anxious moments till he texted me back.


29 posted on 04/06/2012 12:32:14 PM PDT by TangoLimaSierra (To the left the truth looks Right-Wing.)
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To: The_Reader_David

On of the TV reporters just said, “right now we’re trying to effort the VDOT”. Say what???


30 posted on 04/06/2012 12:33:18 PM PDT by ArmstedFragg (hoaxy dopey changey)
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To: All

What the F are all of you talking about editors? This is a tragegy and half of you morons are talking about editors. I don’t understand. Please explain.


31 posted on 04/06/2012 12:50:36 PM PDT by New Jersey Realist (America: home of the free because of the brave)
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To: ArmstedFragg

VDOT Virginia Department of Transportation

Incidently, my business is 3 blocks from the jet crash site.


32 posted on 04/06/2012 1:01:55 PM PDT by Don@VB (Power Corrupts)
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To: Free ThinkerNY
Fox News reporting the aircraft was an F-18 Delta Super Hornet.Well, if it was, it wasn't. Cannot be both.

F-18D's are Hornets. Super Hornets are E/F/G models, considerably newer and larger than Hornets.

Also, the location of both pilots indicates a very low ejection, probably stuck around until they ran out of altitude, control, or ideas...probably all three.

33 posted on 04/06/2012 1:03:10 PM PDT by diogenes ghost
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To: All

Not a whole lot of time to think.

(http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/12/2010/08/500x_canadian_air_show_ejection.jpg)

34 posted on 04/06/2012 1:04:39 PM PDT by WilliamofCarmichael (If modern America's Man on Horseback is out there, Get on the damn horse already!)
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To: Don@VB

used to live a block from the crash site. Steering it away from populated area would have been straight ahead into the ocean. Problem with that is that there would have been any number of hotels in the path along the beach.


35 posted on 04/06/2012 1:07:51 PM PDT by tenger (It's a good thing we don't get all the government we pay for. -Will Rogers)
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To: New Jersey Realist
What the F are all of you talking about editors? This is a tragegy and half of you morons are talking about editors. I don’t understand. Please explain.

Maybe editors screwed up the training manuals?

36 posted on 04/06/2012 1:08:40 PM PDT by Lazamataz (Shut up and drill.)
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To: Shamrock498

I had the same thought and question.


37 posted on 04/06/2012 1:08:57 PM PDT by eccentric (a.k.a. baldwidow)
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To: GIANTSBEATPATS
Tail down nose up

Classic stall configuration


F/A-18's are capable of about a 55 degree angle of attack in level flight at very low air speeds. It would not be unusual to see this occur if the pilot is trying to keep it in the air long enough to dump as much fuel as possible. I would assume that this was the pilot's intention.
38 posted on 04/06/2012 1:20:36 PM PDT by intheheartland
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To: Don@VB
The VDOT part I understood. It's the “trying to effort” I was commenting on.

I've had that “near miss” feeling a few times myself. I'd say a little discreet celebrating is in order tonight.

39 posted on 04/06/2012 1:24:54 PM PDT by ArmstedFragg (hoaxy dopey changey)
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To: intheheartland

A speaker, who is a pilot, said they were about a mile and half from where they took off to where they crashed......so just seconds to make decisions on what to do...wonder how fast this jet was going?....obvious the pilot had no where to go in such short time.

The pilot speaking said the pilot did the right thing.


40 posted on 04/06/2012 1:37:41 PM PDT by caww
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To: wolficatZ

seems like it could have been a lot worse.

...overwhelming smell of jet fuel....

Ogawd, here comes the EPA.

41 posted on 04/06/2012 4:09:25 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (I think in about 5 - no, 4 - years I'll have had enough.)
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To: Dr. Sivana

Blame George H.W. Bush and the Americans with Disabilities Act. Dyslexics now get to be writers and editors.


I think you mint to say, Lisdexics can bee righters and etidors sanks to gorge h.g. bus.


42 posted on 04/06/2012 4:17:14 PM PDT by Leep (Enemy of the Statist)
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To: the invisib1e hand

From the photo looks like the left nozzle closed means it was either at full military power or off. The right nozzle is open which means it was either at full Afterburner or Idle. Pretty indicative of an engine problem either way.


43 posted on 04/06/2012 5:53:20 PM PDT by ghannonf18
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To: ghannonf18

looks to me like the damn thing went down in a ball of fire.


44 posted on 04/06/2012 5:55:01 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (I think in about 5 - no, 4 - years I'll have had enough.)
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