Voting for Romney? Where is your line in the sand? (Vanity)

[Student0165]

I want to ask those who consider themselves conservatives, and are going to vote for Romney because he happens to have an (R) instead of a (D) behind his name on the ballot sheet, where do you draw your personal line in the sand and say "No more"? For stupid people reading this (liberals and DHS type workers), I don't mean violence - I mean not voting for "the lesser of two evils".

[ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas]

1) a 6+ Trillion dollar debt, 1.5T$ deficit

6 Trillion? Hasn't been that low since the days of GHWB. But your overall point is well taken.

I also wonder if we are due for another huge terror attack inside the USA. The jihadists have not given up, and look at who their opponents are (DHS and TSA).

[palmer]

Thanks for the link, a pretty thorough review. Since he won’t give any speeches on anything other than the economy he is basically trying to get elected by not speaking about any issues. That’s also his biggest weakness with independents and others, refusing to stand up for anything. We might not end up with much of a choice once Obama and the media get through with him.

[D-fendr]

I was very successful, again and again and again. But it didn't matter, because it was in the end a rigged game.

Then you weren't really successful, you just thought you were and you got out-played. Same thing can and will happen in third party if it gets big enough.

I hope you learn this before wasting too much of your life

I'm quite old; I learned a great deal along the way, in the trenches, in the middle and near the top; grass roots, local, state and national. It's a very rough and messy business and it doesn't matter what party structure you fight in, it's the same constituency, same tasks, skills and requirements.

But it becomes more difficult when you scale up. What seems easy when you're small becomes quite a challenge when you grow to the size needed to effect state and national politics.

If you're unsuccessful small, you'll never grow; if you are successful small, there's no guarantee you can be successful in growing. But if you can, you can do it within an existing structure much easier than starting from scratch. I believe this is an obvious fact of nature or physics. It's a no-brainer to me.

Thanks for your reply.

[stephenjohnbanker]

” My theory is that many Republicans didn’t want to run because as ugly as the races can get they like even less the thought of being a POTUS with :
1) a 6+ Trillion dollar debt, 1.5T$ deficit,
2) Democrats who have a sole mission to destroy them,
3) a base (us) that wants/needs them to get things done that a PoTUS cant do WITHOUT A FILIBUSTER PROOF Senate.
4) Independents that are so clueless they dont even know which party controls the congress half the time.

When asked if he would run by Cavuto, Jim DeMint replied :”Why the hell would I want THAT job?” “

Sickoflibs 2012 !! SOL “ I will take the job from HELL !! “

[D-fendr]

Of course I agree with much of your sentiments and positions.

However...

The media has always been against us. Actually, I think it's much better than in olden days. There used to be no alternative; for many years, Walter Cronkite determined political "truth." Nothing new here, we always have to fight the media.

There are a lot of reasons Romney got where he did and very little of it is to blame on the conservatives who didn’t want him.

We can blame them, both candidates and supporters, for not unifying against Romney. The results we have now were predictable when we began. Thomas Sowell outlined them very early on. Unify against Romney or Romney is the nominee. It wasn't rocket science then or now.

As far as RNC talking points, much, if not all, of the RNC media was purely anti-Obama and quite skillfully done.

If you're talking about the 'elites,' they are the ones who won before and therefore are the de-facto leaders. You control the party by winning. If you wish to change the party, you must defeat those currently controlling it, politically. If you win politically, you have the political power - no matter who you are. Nothing new here.

But you don't succeed in defeating those in control with a weak field and a disunited opposition. I can't remember that ever working. Organizing and unity wins.

The outcome of this primary was the least surprising part of it. Nothing changed, no one new entered, the candidates didn't unify, their supporters didn't unify.

Romney wins because nothing changed.

[Yaelle]

It takes time to make a grand political change. Now we know that grassroots only is not enough re the Tea Party. We need a formal party that is legitimately Constitutionally conservative. We need to sever all ties with the Republican party and start a new one for 2016. Now.

However, at this point we do need to protect this country from the racist communist enemy that is currently in the White House. Romney is a “normal” liberal Democrat. Far better to elect him than keep Obama. For now. That is what we have to do this year as we prepare to change the political landscape.

These two goals are not mutually exclusive. We are not losers if we know what we are doing. Never again will we be stuck letting statist republicans take advantage of us to stick another RINO into the White House. This will be the last time, because Obama is clearly the enemy. Never again. No more republican party for us.

[D-fendr]

the GOP does have an institutionalised establishment

Yeah, the institution of political power. How did they get it?

Same way you have to get it from them - the political process.

You'll have to beat them one way or another. If you have third party, you still have to beat them for political power. Except you have to do a ton more heavy lifting just to get up to an even level for a fair fight.

It's the same fight, the same folks, the same weapons. Only difference is whether you want to start off at a disadvantage or not.

But hey, if you really need the exercise, have at it.

Ditto.

Thanks for your reply.

[Manic_Episode]

"My hypocrisy goes only so far"

[EternalVigilance]

you weren't really successful, you just thought you were

The epitaph of the conservative movement within the Republican Party.

[RichardW]

Call me a one issue voter. I vote for the one who will appoint the Supreme Court justices most favorable to my interests. Otherwise I’d be cutting off my nose to spite my face. This is an easy call for me.

[D-fendr]

Conservatives are alive and well in the Republican Party where I live now. Wasn’t always that way; won’t continue to be that way without work. But a lot less work - and time - than if we had to do it from scratch.

thanks for your replies.

[EternalVigilance]

Great. I don't care one way or another whether the Republican Party survives or dies, frankly. All I care about is whether the republic lives or dies.

You may find this thread interesting:

Denial ain't just a river in Egypt - Republican conservatives can't handle the truth about Romney

[D-fendr]

I think we’re in complete agreement about the republic. I think we just disagree quite a bit on strategy and tactics.

thanks again..

[Reddy]

Maybe I am foolish or naive but I am just praying that it doesn’t come down to zero or Romney. After all, Romney is not the nominee. Yet.

[BlackElk]

TruthHound:

Thank you for outing yourself for who and what you are lest anyone place trust in your tagline as though you actually believed it. I always like to know who are the friends and who are the enemies of actual conservatism.

If you and your ilk manage to put your POS in the White House, thereby making effective resistance to the Romney/Obozo agenda impossible for eight years and rendering the GOP such a pariah as to become the useless modern equivalent of the Whigs and Know Nothings, both of which are its direct ancestors, or of the relentlessly elitist Federalist Party which, despite having the advantage of including both Washington and Adams as its elected candidates for POTUS, die a well-deserved death only a few years after Adams was defeated for re-election and lost its only other functioning brain when that was blown out by Aaron Burr's well-aimed ball at Weehawken.

Despite your tagline, you quite obviously want to reward Robamney for his despicable and totally negative campaign of zillions of ill-gotten money spent solely on the character assassination of the actual conservative, actual Republican and actual American seeking the GOP POTUS nomination. Now he, and his sycophants, must be punished and they will be. At least when this country faces destruction, that destruction will not be carried out by a phony posing as a "Republican."

Again, thank you for exposing yourself for what you are.

Romney = Obozo = Romney = Obozo = Romney = Obozo.....

[Windflier]

[Impy]

A learned freeper compared it to teaming up with Stalin to beat Hitler.

[Impy]

I don’t think they wanted to go up against the Romney war machine in the primaries. The entire establishment was for him from the jump cause it’s “his turn” since he ran and lost the nomination last time.

[stephenjohnbanker]

YEP