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To: cva66snipe

Wow! First, go skim the foam from your mouth. Second, I don’t agree with with much of your perspective as there are NO perfect human beings, thus there are no perfect candidates. Third, as much as I love Reagan, he was indeed fallible and made mistakes. Finally, I think GWB was an honorable man. He made mistakes, and yes, we are still living with many of them. I blame the congress for most of it and GWB for not standing up to his own party. AND...there isnt a president who has EVER served that didn’t say things in a campaign and then found it extremely difficult to do in the real time execution of his duties. I forgive him and understand many of his motives. BTW, he and Rummy both were for the most part respected and held in very high esteem by those men serving in the Armed Forces.


54 posted on 05/16/2012 4:06:24 PM PDT by TheGunny
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To: TheGunny
I was active duty for Rummy's first tenure as Sec of Defense. Maybe that is why I see him quite different than you. When W brought his name up as Sec of Def I knew we'd been had.

Rummy was first Sec of Defense under Gerald Ford. During that time the decline which would also later become and be known as The Hollow Carter Military started. Things did not magically fall apart as soon as Carter took office that does not happen that fast. Things were in shambles morale and discipline wise before Carter ever raised his right hand. It's a part of the military you likely never saw because when you joined in what 1987 {looking at your FR page} it was a complete turnaround from early 1977.

The daily muster reports which were then placed into a combined list going to each department showing AWOLs for the day were high. These typically weren't guys who simply had went on a bender & shacked up somewhere coming back in the next day or so. These were ones who were not coming back.

In 1976 -early 1978 if you wanted out of the military all you had to do was a 31 day AWOL and report to another command for processing out. You might see a court martial, most likely no brig time, were given a General Discharge, and free to go no more obligation. I am not making this up. Many took that out. If you run across lets say a coworker now in his mid to late 50's who says he did a couple years in the service in that era and is very vague about when, where, and how long, you can almost bet he doesn't have an Honorable DC and had deserted. The standard enlistment obligation was 3/3 or 4/2.

It wasn't till somewhere in the early 1978 time frame that things started slowly swinging back toward the military which you served in. First thing ended was the AWOL to civilian policy which had began under Rummy a policy that under Bush tenure he tried again to start up. The second change came in addressing discipline and morale.

You're a Marine so you might possibly understand this. Several things are a must for morale. Topping the list is discipline and honoring tradition. Our dress blues in 1976 looked like bargain basement Navy Officers Dress Blues. On a ship they were highly dysfunctional and a PITA to stow properly and care for. In late 1979 the traditional blues and whites {crackerjack} were restored as dress uniform of the day for enlisted. In 1976 you did not hear traditional Pipes being done on ships. In 1978 every Bosun had a pipe and had again mastered the calls. The notion you could just walk off the ship was also ended with re-instituting the Liberty Pass Card. You either had to have a Liberty Pass or pier Pass to leave the ship. Only your E-5 or above had possession of them. He could use it to reward and punish. Retention had became a serious issue but was being addressed seriously and aggressively. The going bonus for a Snipe in 1980 was $15K, next rank, and possibly shore duty for a couple years. My Chief followed me around my last 6 months LOL.

There was also a little heard about program which brought back into active duty on a volunteer basis some Old Salts {E-7-E-9} to help reestablish some order. We had one of them in my division before I got out. There's an old saying if you want a man to act like a sailor then treat him like one.

I'm not saying it was fun or there weren't serious issues because there was plenty of both. But I am saying there was a huge difference in what I saw in change by the time my EAOS was up in Oct 80. Most of it was for the good. Despite all the issues we faced several things did not happen. We never failed INSURV, PEB, ORE, or failed to do Lite Offs on demand. We stayed mission ready. Our C.O's were not hung out too dry as scapegoats for congressional de-funding of shipboard maintenance.

The difference between Reagan and GW Bush? In 1982 a hard recession hit. Reagan ceased the opportunity and from that most empty Billets had became filled. How do I know? Because I tried to go back in in late 1982 because there were no jobs. I was offered $15K in late 1980 and was considered in a critical rating. I was told in 1982 that positions were filled and a long waiting list. Lucky for me I had full G.I. Bill {not the same one of today} to fall back so I went back to school and also enlisted in the Army National Guards for a year. V.A. had me on contract digging graves while going to school so I got by between the three.

On September 11 2001 our nation was attacked and our defenses were in an unprecedented since Pearl Harbor stand down posture. To understand why I say that you would have had to know the posture earlier. We were and still are today at 1996 End Troop Strength Levels. That was the Golden Opportunity to actually help our military recover from damages Poppy, Clinton, and Congress had inflicted in manpower and program cuts. That Golden chance was not used. The results are troops deployed for one year deployments four four times. We can't blame that on the DEMs because the Moderate GOP leaders in control did this too them.

Let me ask you something. If Bush picked such brilliant ones for Sec of Defense then why did Obama keep Gates? I bet he would have kept Rummy also. You forget it was GW Bush whom in his 2000 campaign said he and Mr Gore were not that far apart on most issues.

55 posted on 05/16/2012 6:00:36 PM PDT by cva66snipe (Two Choices left for U.S. One Nation Under GOD or One Nation Under Judgment? Which one say ye?)
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