Posted on 10/25/2012 11:13:13 PM PDT by Ripliancum
I’m very familiar with Mormon teachings - having a very good friend who is a Mormon. We’ve discussed and argued religion many, many times. I’m also aware that they aren’t Christian, according to my Biblical viewpoint. However, they do live clean, moral lives - more than I can say about the current occupier in the WH. Romney does believe in God, and we need to keep him in our prayers.
Your Mormon friend seems to have won the arguments, on this thread, your posts to me have been about defending Mormonism.
Show him your post 34 and your responding to it, he will be pleased.
By the way, what we think of as moral are different, I don’t think that it is moral to try to use deceit and lies to trick a person into leaving Christ and joining an anti-Christian cult, even when the cult member is a polite, calm, nonsmoker that doesn’t raise his voice, and does what the cult tells him to do.
It takes more than having a pleasing appearance, and living a calm life for me to think of a warrior against Christ, as “moral”.
According to the BYU article:
"In addition to its scriptural use, the word "doctrine" has a broad meaning in Mormon vernacular, where it is used to mean virtually everything that is, or has been, taught or believed by the Latter-day Saints. In this sense, doctrinal teachings answer a host of questions. Some relate closely to the core message of the gospel of Jesus Christ; others are farther removed and unsystematically lap over into such disciplines as history, psychology, philosophy, science, politics, business, and economics. Some of these beliefs qualify as official doctrine and are given to the Saints as counsel, exhortation, reproof, and instruction (2 Tim. 3:16). Continual effort is made to harmonize and implement these principles and doctrine into a righteous life. Other teachings, ones that lack official or authoritative standing, may also be widespread among Church members at any given time."
Later the same article states: "Many individuals write or preach their views. Some, by study and obedience, may learn truths that go beyond the stated position of the Church, but this does not authorize them to speak officially for the Church or to present their views as binding on the Church. There are many subjects about which the scriptures are not clear and about which the Church has made no official pronouncements. In such matters, one can find differences of opinion among Church members and leaders. Until the truth of these matters is made known by revelation, there is room for different levels of understanding and interpretation of unsettled issues."
It is these ideas I was trying to make known. I don't believe one does good service by not checking a source to its beginning. Who says something, when it was said, why and how are all important considerations.
I am a teacher. I get frustrated when others don't do what I taught my students to do - write clearly, know your audience and support your opinions with verifiable, acceptable sources. This isn't easy, but written communication lasts. It should be correct.
Name calling is particularly odious. I was referring to you as the poster that was purporting to speak for the Church. It isn't that I don't "like" the site you first gave. It's that the site itself hides its author and has no authority as spokesperson for the Roman Catholic Church. Feel free to respect whomever you want to. I want more from my sources.
Catholic Answers is often a credible source. However, the three paragraphs you cited hardly give a fair, detailed and thoughtful explanation of many Mormon thoughts, who promulgated them or how authoritative they are.
Nowhere did I claim anyone, especially not a respected Catholic source, was lying. I have no hostility to any church. I have a special regard for the Roman Catholic Church because she has been my source for happiness and peace for more than 68 years. The Church teaches and doesn't change her mind on doctrines. This is one of the pluses about her. I can count on her. I have learned how to discover TRUE CATHOLIC TEACHING. One of the major points of my reply to Catherine of Aragon was to say, I don't want others to tell me what someone else believes. If I want to know what any church has to say about another church, I'll find it myself. I prefer to know what a Church says about herself, officially and authoritatively.
I find those who are so concerned about "outing" the errors of an institution are not, necessarily, secure in their own belief system. Please do not respond to this. You have proven you have a bone to pick, you refuse to read what's written and you read things that do not appear in print. I see no further good in trying to make my point.
I will say this: I've read the website that has the "Seven things you don't know about Mitt Romney" and I've watched him campaign with class, courage and dignity.
I know others knock him, and I wish he were more conservative on several issues that I care deeply about but I believe he's a good man. A humble man. A man who Conservatives will be able to influence moreso than we ever would be able to with Obama in the White House another four years.
My prayer at the end of the day is for the Romney Campaign and for God to do His will, whatever that is.
I decided today that I'm going to fast for 48 hours before election day and pray often during that 48 hours. Sitting here in the People's Socialist RepuliK of Illinois, there's not much I can do for the Romney campaign, but I can do that as I plead to my Lord for a Good Man to lead this country.
LOL, how much are you going to twist things in service to Mormonism?
You already refuse to accept the respected Catholic sources, and now you reject THE OFFICIAL SITE OF THE CHURCH OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS?
You posted a link to a NON-OFFICIAL MORMON SITE and want it used instead of THE OFFICIAL MORMON SITE. The article is CURRENTLY posted, it is on the Mormon teaching on becoming GODs, it isn't like being written in 1971 disqualifies theological writings for a religion when the religion still offers it to you on their OFFICIAL site.
Where is your OFFICIAL rebuttal of this? For that matter, where is your OFFICIAL rebuttal of the Catholic sources? When do you quit playing dishonest games? Even your own wiki source doesn't rebut Mormons becoming Gods
""This is from the Church of Latter Day Saints themselves:: “The Prophet Joseph Smith taught: “God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man. … he was once a man like us … God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth. …”
“If Jesus Christ was the Son of God, and … God the Father of Jesus Christ had a Father, you may suppose that He had a Father also. … And where was there ever a father without first being a son? … If Jesus had a Father, can we not believe that He had a Father also? …
“He [Jesus] laid down His life, and took it up, the same as His Father had done before.”
Long before our God began his creations, he dwelt on a mortal world like ours, one of the creations that his Father had created for him and his brethren. He, with many of his brethren, was obedient to the principles of the eternal gospel. One among these, it is presumed, was a savior for them, and through him they obtained a resurrection and an exaltation on an eternal, celestial world. Then they gained the power and godhood of their Father and were made heirs of all that he had, continuing his works and creating worlds of their own for their own posterity—the same as their Father had done before, and his Father, and his Father, and on and on.
Nothing is more basic in the restored gospel than these truths that, because of recent events of space travel, are so timely. The great hope of the gospel for us is that we may come to a oneness with our Lord and our Father and partake of this same work and glory and godhood. Being joint-heirs of all that the Father has, we may then look forward to using those powers to organize still other worlds from the unorganized matter that exists throughout boundless space. Creating other worlds, peopling them with our own eternal posterity, providing a savior for them, and making known to them the saving principles of the eternal gospel, that they may have the same experiences we are now having and be exalted with us in their turn—this is eternal life. No wonder this possibility continues to fascinate and inspire Saints of all ages.”
http://www.lds.org/new-era/1971/04/people-on-other-worlds?lang=eng
MSSC, I appreciate the courteous tone of your posts.
However, with all due respect to you, there isn’t anything that will convince me Mormonism is Christian. It seems to fit their agenda to portray themselves as such, although that wasn’t always the case. But just about every Christian denomination recognizes that Mormonism is something other than Christian.
Like I said, we should pray for Romney.
Not yet. Be humble. And PRAY that it comes to pass. God has a way of dealing with the haughty. Let us be mindful of that and keep fighting for a Free and Just America.
Not silly in the least. Very powerful!
I agree, I absolutely agree. This article is just warming my heart. For this Nation to return to GOD is and will be the best thing that could possibly happen.
Surely MSSC6644 doesn’t think that Mormonism is Christian?
I thought that he was arguing that they aren’t polytheist, and don’t believe that they can become Gods.
Pope John II himself has already signed off that Mormonism is not Christian, the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith produced a decision and statement on that.
As a Catholic, do you trust THE CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH? Below is from their official statement on Mormonism not being Christian and Gods as formally endorsed by Pope John II.
"This divinity and man share the same nature and they are substantially equal. God the Father is an exalted man, native of another planet, who has acquired his divine status through a death similar to that of human beings, the necessary way to divinization (cf. TPJS, pp. 345-346). God the Father has relatives and this is explained by the doctrine of infinite regression of the gods who initially were mortal (cf. TPJS, p. 373). God the Father has a wife, the Heavenly Mother, with whom he shares the responsibility of creation. They procreate sons in the spiritual world. Their firstborn is Jesus Christ, equal to all men, who has acquired his divinity in a pre-mortal existence. Even the Holy Spirit is the son of heavenly parents. The Son and the Holy Spirit were procreated after the beginning of the creation of the world known to us (cf. EM, Vol. 2, p. 961)"
"The words Father, Son and Holy Spirit, have for the Mormons a meaning totally different from the Christian meaning. The differences are so great that one cannot even consider that this doctrine is a heresy which emerged out of a false understanding of the Christian doctrine. The teaching of the Mormons has a completely different matrix."
http://www.doctrinafidei.va/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20010605_battesimo_mormoni-ladaria_en.html
This truly is my last response. My posts have nothing to do with Mormonism being Christian. They have to do with ANYONE offering up the most negative of information to others in order to “disqualify” some other belief system. It’s one reason Catholics on this forum ask to have a place where they, and they alone, can discuss Catholic teaching.
I again apologize for any misunderstanding and for the lack of clarity of my posts.
I’ve been in prayer about the safety of our nation since forever. But with the election of B.O. to stink up the White House, I’ve asked others to pray for the same intention. I do not trust Mr. Romney. It’s not because he’s a Mormon, although knowing now how very important his faith is to him, I could add that to the already heavy pile of **** he believes. I distrust his namby pamby wishy washiness. There’s so little there, except for his ability to organize and understand finances that I can respond to.
My final point is after the last four years, at least I don’t believe he’ll set us up and sell us out to the true evil: Terroristic Islam.
**No way can that Kenyan and his assclowns steal our thunder.**
Or our prayers.
Our next President recognizes who his source really is.
What a crock, you have been fibbing for Mormonism, trying to lie about whether they believe in becoming Gods or not, you posted a weak source which agreed with me while you tried to say it didn’t, you dismissed every respectable Catholic source, you even dismissed the OFFICIAL Mormon web site, and now you won’t even acknowledge THE CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH as a source.
You are some type of pro-mormonism fake that will bend the truth and play games and pose, to defend Mormonism against being described accurately.
Why, is a mystery.
Don’t just post links to unknown videos, tell me what they say, what you are disputing or claiming.
To all of you obsessed with Mitt’s mormonism, please set it aside, even if it’s only temporary. This election is too important.
Jim Robinson himself has just said he is going to vote for Romney in the latest FReepathon thread:
“And I guess hell has frozen over because as much as I dislike Romney’s prior RINO positions, I’ve decided I will make my anti-Obama vote count in the only way it might actually do some good. I will mark my ballot for Romney and vote straight Republican right down the ticket.”
Please, I implore you to set aside your theological differences and join the thousands of Evangelical pastors urging their own congregations to stand up to the evils of the Obama administration.
There are choices before us of good and evil. They are not both evil.
I implore you, choose ye this day.
Ripliancum
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