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To: KarlInOhio; Nachum; Cindy; G8 Diplomat; AdmSmith; Dog; nuconvert; Straight Vermonter; dervish; ...

Thank you for the post.

There were three approved routes A, B, and C. The “A”, southerly route is the most direct and the most used.

Correct, there were a number of heavy cell thunderstorms covering A and B so they flew the C (most northerly) route that day.

What has not been released is that there had been a total of 12 shootdowns in the previous months, but not above 7,000 feet, so no concern was noted.

However, last Tuesday there was a shootdown at 22,000 feet, indicating a vehicle mounted anti-aircraft system was in play.

There should have been an immediate air traffic advisory that was not done.

BTW, the separatists are known for drinking. Given the sloppy command and control, I would not be surprised if alcohol consumption may have been a factor.

Also, there was apparently no command vehicle that normally carries the aquisition radar for the SA-11 that could IFF the commercial and passenger carrier squak.


36 posted on 07/20/2014 7:46:03 PM PDT by gandalftb (Go Seahawks!)
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To: gandalftb
What has not been released is that there had been a total of 12 shootdowns in the previous months, but not above 7,000 feet, so no concern was noted.

However, last Tuesday there was a shootdown at 22,000 feet, indicating a vehicle mounted anti-aircraft system was in play.

In the words of a commercial pilot on another forum, "elevation is not your friend":

Ranges for MANPADs generally assume the target is high performance aircraft that can maneuver aggressively and deploy countermeasures (chaff, flares, jamming) in response to onboard and remote (e.g. AWACS) tracking, lockon, and/or launch warnings. Indeed, defeating a MANPAD these days is often more about geometry and maneuvers (at 6 to 9Gs) to bleed the missile of its finite supply of kinetic energy, something commercial aircraft are unable to do.

A fighter might be safe from recent versions of Manpads at 20,000, but a commercial airliner might not be 100% safe at 33,000. An SA11 would require well over 50,000 even with counter-measures.

No airline had any business flying over eastern Ukraine, even before the shootdown of the Ukrainian military transport.

42 posted on 07/20/2014 8:05:52 PM PDT by Praxeologue
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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Berosus; bigheadfred; Bockscar; cardinal4; ColdOne; ...

Thanks gandalftb for that reply.

The article is nothing other than a cover story to protect Putin and his thugs from the bad publicity brought on by their latest terrorist act.


77 posted on 07/21/2014 5:39:04 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (Time to purge FR at last of the pro-Putin agitprop regurgitators!)
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To: gandalftb
Any airline still flying over Ukrainian airspace is being cavalier with the lives of passengers and crew.

And that will cost Malaysian Airlines at least $500mil in court.

It's a war zone for crying out loud.

93 posted on 07/21/2014 9:55:32 AM PDT by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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