U.S. Navy: Please save the USS Ranger from the scrap heap!

change.org ^ | Rachel Shelton

[cva66snipe]

Very interesting. When they say Carriers are surrounded by other boats, I usually think of destroyers and stuff. Where do they keep all those utility boats?

The Boats are kept on double stack trailers on the Hanger Bay. Usually after a liberty port they needed some repairs so the Bosunmates, Enginemen, and Electricians, fixed them. BTW if needed those boats could have machine guns mounted on them. One guy told me about such an experience a MED Cruise or two earlier.

The boats are put into and taken out of water by one of two cranes. One is the fixed position Boat & Aircraft crane the other is a truck with a crane on it with a main purpose of putting aircraft over the side in event of fire. A burning Helicopter can burn from flightdeck all the way down through the bottom of the ship if now tossed over because of magnesium.

When underway we had destroyers and other ships close by many times in sight. When in foreign port we hit the larger cities that could handle several thousand sailors and the smaller ships with us went to smaller {better} ports.

[cva66snipe]

My recommendation? Turn it into a world class military academy AND museum. Everything needed is already there.

You likely have the most workable and economic solution. Ask for the Island, a berthing area, Engineering Central if possible or a Boiler Room Console booth. Those should be doable. Pieces of the Catwalk like the catapult controls and LSO Platform/Arresting gear controls sections. IOW a land based museum with sections of the ship and pictures of the other portions. Do things like a Sound Powered Phone System, DC equipment such as OBA's of the era, flame safety lamps etc. The Navy does release such things to Naval Bases like Great Lakes, San Diego, JAX, etc and could be a joint operations venture. It's a good back up option and really one that could be asked for simultaneously while seeking a museum hold.

[Salvavida]

Glad you think so.

Now start a web page, get a council of former officers and crew to project manage it. I know some federal money is available for the museum part of the operation.

In finding the berthing space: look for a politician the champion it in an area that isn't susceptible to hurricanes, has good harbor that protects from weather; has a demographic that can afford that type of private military boarding school, and is a good tourist location.

So basically, you are looking for San Diego.

Good luck.

[cva66snipe]

I found this http://www.uss-ranger.org/Reunion/index.html

[ConorMacNessa]

Signed the Petition.

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O stranger, tell the Lacedaemonians that we lie here, obedient to their command.

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[stevie_d_64]

I kinda have mixed feelings about this effort...

Yes, it had its ups and downs, a ship does get a Rep from some of its exploits while on the job...

All I remember about the Ranger was its nickname...And by no means is it an insult to those that served on her, but it does give you a chuckle from time to time...

“Danger Ranger”

But hey, I was not the one that came up with it, I do believe someone onboard came up with that one, and it stuck...

BTW, where and who would get this carrier for restoration and display???

[EternalVigilance]

I’m told that Long Beach wants her.

[naturalman1975]

Yea and you also forget how much you hated it while you were there LOL.

Back in the early 1980s I had a minor involvement in making a recruiting ad for the Royal Australian Navy.

It can be seen on YouTube.

I love the lyrics looking back at it.

"You'll be wet, you'll be homesick and frightened.
But the pride of the Fleet will be you!"

We told people they would be wet, homesick, and frightened to get them to join - and it seemed to work.

[stevie_d_64]

Sure...

But what gets me about these deals is , why have we not sold some of these “capitol” ships to allied nations, that could really use them...

Obviously some would require significant restoration and a good coat of paint, but hey, I bet Australia, France, and maybe even GB could use this and a few other old fossil fueled carriers for their continued effective assistance in future operations around the world...

I would even extend this offer to the Japanese who are getting closer to the point where they will need capabilities like this, regardless of the history...

Just my opinion...

[stevie_d_64]

Sure...

But what gets me about these deals is , why have we not sold some of these “capitol” ships to allied nations, that could really use them...

Obviously some would require significant restoration and a good coat of paint, but hey, I bet Australia, France, and maybe even GB could use this and a few other old fossil fueled carriers for their continued effective assistance in future operations around the world...

I would even extend this offer to the Japanese who are getting closer to the point where they will need capabilities like this, regardless of the history...

Just my opinion...

[tanknetter]

FDR was there being readied to go to a Kearney, New Jersey company yard for scrapping. Decommissioned 30 September 1977. Disposed of 04/01/1978. The rush to crush seemed to be based on a fear that Carter would try and re-commission and it could not handle more modern aircraft.

The FDR was pretty worn out by the time she was decommissioned and stricken. She was supposed to have had the same overhaul/upgrade that Midway had a few years earlier (Midway stayed in service until 1992), but after the costs of that ballooned it was determined that the money would be better spent on what became the Carl Vinson.

Coral Sea, being the youngest Midway and therefore "behind" Midway and FDR in the maintenance cycle, was in better overall material condition than FDR despite not having the Midway upgrades. She was scheduled to be decommissioned in the early 1980s, but Reagan's push to get to 15 decks saw her kept in service and modified to handle the then-new F/A-18. IIRC she was the first deck to actually take the Bug on an operational deployment. She was also one of the big players in the mid-80s dust-up with Khadafi/Libya (along with the Saratoga and your old ship, the America).

In fact, she was in decent enough shape that she was scheduled to replace Lexington as the dedicated training deck. Which was dropped when Berlin Wall fell, the Navy cut back on decks and the Forrestal became available early.

The Midways were really tough old ships. After she came home for the last time BuShips took Midway out and intentionally overstressed a lot of her systems to see where their fail point really was. Including running her full reverse for something like four hours. They couldn't break her, and IIRC the CO made them go on record as decommissioning a fully combat-ready ship. Then again, she'd really benefited from the TLC of the Yokosuka yard workers during her nearly 20 years forward deployment in Japan.

[tanknetter]

But what gets me about these deals is , why have we not sold some of these “capitol” ships to allied nations, that could really use them...

The manning requirements are atrocious. There really aren't any other countries, except maybe China and India, that can adequately afford to man one of these ships. The QE-class carriers that the UK is building are just about maxing out their manning capability, and that's assuming that one of the two ships is always going to be in some form of layup.

Brazil has the old French Foch, now Sao Paulo, and has issues keeping her in service. And she's basically a half-step between an Essex and a Midway, nowhere near a Forrestal.

[cva66snipe]

Ranger like our other conventional carriers has seen the expected life. I'll explain as briefly as I can why you can't give a CV away. The conventionals from Saratoga on operated on a 1200 PSI superheated steam produced by 8 Diesel Fuel Marine fueled boilers. {Forestall the first super carrier was a 600 PSI System} At 1200 PSI a steam leak the size of a pencil lead can dismember you and it can't be seen or heard. They've been repaired, re-tubed, relined, and patched up to get the 40-50 year life out of them.

Other ships such as destroyers, Amphibs etc we loan out, sell, giveaway, usually run on diesel engines are easier to repair and much less risk to operate.

The closer a carrier is to it's end life the less money is spend on upkeep. Repairs are deferred and in general the ships main propulsion system and Auxiliary systems are worn out.

[cva66snipe]

I wish I had high speed service I’d watch it. We’d play a Bob Seger song on the Night Moves album “Ship of Fools”. But the one priceless to me was Saturday Night Live Navy Skits.

[cva66snipe]

Really the only problem I could have seen with Midway class propulsion wise was the need for more power at the Cats. They built Forestall the first in it’s class but last 600 PSI propulsion system on a carrier.

[cva66snipe]

The manning requirements are atrocious. There really aren't any other countries, except maybe China and India, that can adequately afford to man one of these ships. The QE-class carriers that the UK is building are just about maxing out their manning capability, and that's assuming that one of the two ships is always going to be in some form of layup.

Yeap that too. The Engineering Dept alone would be over 400 persons. And you don't find BT's or MM's capable of training a crew just anywhere.

[stevie_d_64]

From an engineering standpoint you are correct...I did not get my ESWS badge on a CV platform, but got it on a DDG-993 class, which if I recall had some interesting main propulsion and aux plant systems...

Where our country doesn’t need the older conventional powered CV’s anymore, the other countries could, and those engineering upgrades and other system maintenance requirements could be appropriated since they would probably only be dealing with one flat top in their order of battle anyway...

I also see it as an opportunity, or better yet a “transition” ship to a more modern platform anyway, which is good for those countries that do produce them as a potential export...

Then they’d have crews that are trained up and used to working on a challenging ship like this..

Shoot, they could even get a refit to the newer catapult systems we are putting on our newer CVN’s to take care for those steam plants and plumbing that might be at risk for failure...Right??? If I caught your history on that correctly...

Its all about bringing up allies on our operating these carriers who have not had the opportunity to do so like we have...Sure GB, France and some of the others have history, and some of these other Navies have absorbed older platforms...

Sure, some of these Navies will be buying problems, but its like buying a used car...The utility you get out of it, at a reduced cost overall, might lend itself to looking at the future, while getting comfortable with the overall idea...

Then the new car urge kicks in...

That’s all I was alluding to...

BTW, I miss the Connie!!! And the Big “E”...FYI...

The idiotic idea we could scrap these constructions for such a cheap and insulting price for the scrap value quoted, to me, begs another look at encouraging these to be sold off for use (operation) in foreign navies...For as long as they can keep them up...

Again, just my opinion...

[editor-surveyor]

Bump

[topsail]

Nickname “Danger Ranger” ?
I was on the USS Coral Sea, CVA-43, during my second enlistment, 1963-1967, and we had another name for Ranger. We called it “Building 61” because it was always tied up in Hunters Point Shipyard and could not get underway to make it’s commitments.
Instead of staying in port to enjoy well deserved shore leave, the Coral Sea was ordered to sea in order to qualify Rangers squadrons because Ranger could not get underway. That didn’t go over too well!
I believe it was in 1966, on Yankee Station, Coral Sea was operating near Ranger when Ranger experienced an engine room fire. We closed to within sight of Ranger and could see black smoke coming out of the elevator doors.

Ranger had a strike returning but was unable to take them aboard so Coral Sea came to the rescue again and recovered Ranger’s aircraft.

I think ships do seem to have a personality, maybe not to the air group, but to permanent ships company who live aboard for several years. I have sailed in quite a few ships both in the Navy and as a civilian Merchant Mariner. Over time a ship seems to feel like it is a living thing. There is a constant small vibration and movement that gives it a feeling of life. Some I was happy to see them go and others a feeling of sadness to see these once proud warriors torn apart by scavengers who care not of that ship’s honorable record.

Just the thoughts of an old seafarer.

[cva66snipe]

To fix them where they would be safe would require new boilers and likely all new steam piping. The keel is laid then the boilers go in and the ship is built around them. The repair would cost more than a new construction and likely take longer. Back when we had four carrier builders we likely could have built to order carriers for allies that could afford them. We're down to one now.

The newest class of carrier will have an elector-magnetic catapult system. That means more generators. I don't see a retro fit as a possibility there. Another issue is hull thickness. 40-50 years of sea water and corrosion.

My old ship by 1992 was showing her age. Her S.L.E.P. was canceled and an early end of life choice was made. In 1994 she had a major boiler-room explosion at Pier 12 upon return from a deployment. She was our second newest conventional. Before that deployment she had two of six generators functional, No Radar {due to lack of electrical power for air conditioning operations} & fuel pumping issues. This was at half life. She was band-aided at NNSY and sent on one last deployment.

As for scrapping? No scrapper can afford to buy a carrier for salvage and make money. There is extreme cost thanks to government regulations in scrapping a carrier out. There's asbestos PCB you name it it's there.