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Evacuations for 180K+ people near Lake Oroville to stay in place
KCRA Sacramento ^ | February 14th, 2017 | Sarah Heise

Posted on 02/14/2017 6:09:46 AM PST by Mariner

While more than 180,000 residents remain evacuated from their homes in Butte, Sutter and Yuba counties, there is no timetable as to when people can return home as water officials and engineers assess the damage and situation at the two damaged Oroville Dam spillways, the Butte County sheriff said Monday.

As tensions remain high around the area, some good news came early Monday morning when water levels at Lake Oroville dropped below capacity, stopping water from spilling over the potentially hazardous emergency spillway.

However, officials are still looking to lower the lake another 50 feet to less than 850 feet elevation to allow space in the lake for the upcoming storm, projected to arrive Thursday. Dropping the lake levels that much without increasing outflows could take several more days, KCRA meteorologist Dirk Verdoorn said.

(Excerpt) Read more at kcra.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: california; dam; evacuation; evacuations; lakeoroville; oroville; orovilledam
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To: Kay
They were correct. Lakes had evaporated.
California was bone dry. Millions of trees dead. Orchards and evergreens.
On the opposite side of our globe, there has been snow in deserts of the Arab world.

Oh Oh :-)

41 posted on 02/14/2017 8:19:40 AM PST by Oatka
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To: Mariner

The sad part is to save Sacramento, they may have to deliberately breach the levees west of the Sutter and Yolo Bypasses to relieve the pressure. In short, the towns of Knights Landing, Woodland, Davis and possibly even Dixon may have to be sacrificed to save the much bigger Sacramento.


42 posted on 02/14/2017 8:26:01 AM PST by RayChuang88 (FairTax: America's economic cure)
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To: detsaoT
Actually, take a good look at the emergency spillway which is also earthen and not reinforced. That is the biggest problem at the moment as the water has cut back almost to the concrete and about to undercut it near the parking lot side. Whoever built that parking lot there lower than or level to the spillway was an idiot. That will go long before water washes over the face of the dam itself.

The second problem is that the emergency spillway has cut a path higher up and across the spillway itself which you can see when you run videos of the last hours of high water flow down the emergency spillway. It is about to cut a path under the concrete spillway, which will cause another tear on the spillway high up at a weaker point in the dam if that emergency spillway runs hard again.

The third problem before even getting to the point of reaching the top of the main dam is damage points to the left of the dam where that both spillway areas cover that might have leaks. The least of their worries is the earthen dam itself overflowing but the undercutting of it on its side.

Earthen dams are risky to begin with but this one has some huge danger point now even before the main part of the dam overflows which is usually a horrible thing for an earthen dam. I am not saying that this dam will break, just that it has some very dangerous points that are visible at the moment and major concerns that are not visible at the moment before you even worry about overtopping the earthen dam which is never good.

43 posted on 02/14/2017 8:35:30 AM PST by Lady Heron
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To: Lady Heron

True true - There are definitely “lesser” scenarios that will be nearly as devastating as the failure of the dam itself. We will just have to watch, see, and most importantly: pray!


44 posted on 02/14/2017 8:41:55 AM PST by detsaoT
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To: Lady Heron
I still think the worst case scenario is that the emergency spillway is undermined to the extent that around 30' to possibly 50' are released from a breach. This would obviously create massive flooding and a wide swath of destruction, but it's a much better alternative to any possible compromise of the main dam.

Consider this: if the primary spillway began to cut back too close near the dam, they would by necessity have to shut the gates. That means the emergency spillway would become the fail point. In that case, would you allow chance to take place to determine the outflow point, our would you dynamite the section nearest the parking lot in an attempt to have the outflow carve a huge canyon, but still stay 200-300 yards away from the primary spillway complex and main dam?

45 posted on 02/14/2017 8:50:21 AM PST by semantic
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To: Lady Heron

Ok, the damaged spillways are separate from the dam itself. the dam itself is not experiencing problems - the spillways are.
the main spillway was severly damaged but has been demonstrated the ability to still allow 100,000 cfs and they could push it higher as good bedrock has been encountered.
The emergency / auxillary spillway is what cause the evacuation. erosion of the hill side was approaching the concrete weir of the spillway crest. had it reached it, it could have resulted in tunneling under the concrete and making direct connection to the lake. the weir is about 30 feet high. this is the catastrophic failure that concerned everyone.
Please the dam itself is not in trouble.


46 posted on 02/14/2017 8:52:37 AM PST by Godzilla (1/20/2017)
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To: pinkandgreenmom
I have had Atlas Shrugged collecting dust on my bookshelf for years but never read it. I will start today.

It is a book that everybody should read at least once in their lifetime.

I've read it three times and it's on my list to read a fourth time. Fountainhead well worth checking out too.

47 posted on 02/14/2017 8:55:51 AM PST by SamAdams76
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To: Lady Heron
The sad thing about that emergency spillway is that engineers knew years ago, as dam engineering knowledge grew, that it needed to be redesigned away from the front of the dam to spill over into a long flat area before going down hill as these emergency spillways are not reinforced. Not to mention that the spillway itself needed fixing as the concrete where it failed was crumbling and did just what everyone knew it would do if ever it had to be used....fail.

California and dam maintenance are the criminals in this situation as none of this was unexpected if water rose to danger levels for this dam.

48 posted on 02/14/2017 8:58:15 AM PST by Lady Heron
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To: Mariner

My friends who are in the danger zone: wife has evacuated with valuables. husband knows what will happen if they leave the ranch/farm completely uninhabited. He has stayed behind, armed.

There are a lot of folks there who will NOT leave their property completely unprotected. I pity the fools who think they’ll take advantage of supposed unoccupied homes.


49 posted on 02/14/2017 8:59:27 AM PST by SparkyBass
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To: SparkyBass

I hope he has a boat.


50 posted on 02/14/2017 9:00:23 AM PST by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: Godzilla

I agree, except that the dam is leveraged to the wall that the spillway and emergency spillway are on. It is the spillway areas weakening that are the concern.


51 posted on 02/14/2017 9:03:16 AM PST by Lady Heron
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To: Mariner

He does! and also (I find funny) he used to be a professional undersea welder, so he’s got scuba gear :) not that it would help much.


52 posted on 02/14/2017 9:04:21 AM PST by SparkyBass
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To: SparkyBass
Make sure he is gone by the time the rains start on Thursday - things will devolve rapidly from there. If he's in the floodplain, in a worst case scenario, he will be under four hundred feet of rapidly moving death.
53 posted on 02/14/2017 9:04:32 AM PST by detsaoT
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To: Mariner

Study of Feather River Basin runoff processes

https://pubs.usgs.gov/sir/2004/5202/sir2004-5202.pdf

http://www.sacriver.org/aboutwatershed/roadmap/watersheds/feather/upper-feather-river-watershed


54 posted on 02/14/2017 9:05:57 AM PST by Ray76 (DRAIN THE SWAMP)
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To: detsaoT

Knowing him, he’s smart enough... just hope he’s quick enough! Saw a map showing the time-to-flood from the time-of-failure... he is in the 45 minute area... and he knows back-roads through the ranches and farms. He has a very good chance.


55 posted on 02/14/2017 9:08:33 AM PST by SparkyBass
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To: SparkyBass
Again - Things can all be replaced, insurance or not. Lives cannot. He should under no circumstance stay underneath that dam until we know for sure it remainst standing after the next storm system passes through. There is zero chance to survive the magnitude of flooding that is possible under the absolute worst case scenario here.
56 posted on 02/14/2017 9:08:38 AM PST by detsaoT
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To: SparkyBass

OK - Prudence is always the best idea. I’ll keep him (and everyone else over there) in my prayers!


57 posted on 02/14/2017 9:09:13 AM PST by detsaoT
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To: semantic
They can not use the emergency spillway if they can at all help it, as it is cutting into several places and creating several dangerous areas including almost cutting to the spillway and damaging it in a second place which leaves only the spillway they can use which has cut a huge hole into the bedrock lower down and closer to the dam.... that being safer than what is happening higher up on the dam. That is an amazing thing when it comes to dams.

I have no clue after that what their options would be dealing with a breach. I can just tell you what I see happening and what I have been told in the past about the dangers of dams.

58 posted on 02/14/2017 9:13:27 AM PST by Lady Heron
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To: Lady Heron

Once you have erosion at the top, it always makes it way down to the river bed.

Eventually.


59 posted on 02/14/2017 9:29:08 AM PST by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: Mariner

And cuts a wider, deeper path as it escapes.


60 posted on 02/14/2017 9:31:24 AM PST by Lady Heron
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