Posted on 04/07/2022 7:00:13 AM PDT by marcusmaximus
Around 60 Russian paratroopers have staged a mutiny and refused to fight in Ukraine, local reports say.
The men, who were from key airborne forces headquarters Pskov in northern Russia, could now face jail sentences for the insubordination.
The refusenik troops had been moved to Belarus as part of the invasion force but after their mutiny were sent in disgrace back to their base in Pskov.
Some have been dismissed and branded 'cowards' while others are set to face the Russian equivalent of a court martial with likely jail sentences.
Defence minister Sergei Shoigu is reported to have sent one of his deputies to Pskov to handle the insubordination.
(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...
It is good that you qualify your post. After one idiotic unsubstantiated made up fantasy story after another many here are still unable to identify the hallmarks of propaganda from either side... This type of thing has only been going on for centuries to motivate populations to take up arms... And it still works. The Democrats feel that one of the best ways for them to stay in power is to spark WWIII
Consider the source. Daily Mail is the worst for overhyped this sort of stuff. They were the ones who started the “Ghost of Kiev” story.
“could now face jail sentences”
Better jail than being left to die in a foreign land by incompetent leaders.
Mutiny would be if the soldiers killed their officers, took them hostage, something like that. Simply refusing to follow orders is just insubordination, which is not usually not capital offense.
“As a side note, one reason Tsar Nicholas was deposed is that he insisted that his troops continue fighting in an unpopular war (WW I). I wonder if Putin has considered that as well.”
They were trying to get rid of him back in 1905, but were not successful. He was deposed in 1917 because of a perfect storm of factors against him.
Nicholas was just not a good leader, and was pretty incompetent in some areas. I’ve read many books on the Romanovs over the years, and there is no denying he was a tragic figure. He did not want to be Tsar, and he fully admitted that he was ill-prepared for it and not up to the task, but felt it was his duty to stay. If he had had his way we would have shunned the throne shortly after he had ascended to it in 1894 and before he was officially crowned in 1896. His ambition was simply to be a “country gentleman.”
Did you condemn people who defected rather than fight for the Nazis???
2 movie scenes: “Dr. Zhivago” where the army turned around and went home. Classic scene when the ‘replacements’ were told not to go by the ‘cowards’.
Next “The Big Red One”. Lee Marvin. The French Captain refused to shoot at the Americans. The Vichy General shot him and in turn got shot by an enlisted man. Loved them both for doing the right thing.
Oh yeah, that would work out really great for Putin. He kills his elite paratroopers, and the next squad of veterans who aren’t eager to die for Putin won’t disobey, they’ll go to Ukraine. Then they’ll just surrender to the Ukrainians, who will not put them in front of a firing squad.
True, particularly the British press. They’ve lost whatever credibility they ever had.
Tsar Nicholas might have saved Russia had he abdicated earlier. And Kaiser Wilhelm might have saved Germany had he abdicated earlier.
Too much ego, I suppose.
Hmmm. There is this uncanny resemblance to myself, being as I am Spanish, of course. The brute part goes without saying, but it has missed the charm, the wit, and the irresistible appeal to women.
“Mutiny would be if the soldiers killed their officers, took them hostage, something like that. Simply refusing to follow orders is just insubordination, which is not usually not capital offense.”
That is not accurate.
Definition of mutiny (Entry 2 of 2)
intransitive verb
“: to rise against or refuse to obey or observe authority”
A group decision to disobey an order is inherently mutiny.
“Tsar Nicholas might have saved Russia had he abdicated earlier. And Kaiser Wilhelm might have saved Germany had he abdicated earlier. Too much ego, I suppose.”
Willie (Wilhelm’s nickname) was indeed an egoist.
Nicholas was not. He was actually a very shy and reserved man, whom his father once described as having the demeanor and drive of a poet rather than a man of action. In fact, Nicholas’ father (Tsar Alexander III) once told an advisor that he (Alexander) feared what would happen to Russia if he died suddenly and Nicholas became Tsar. Well, Alexander did die, in his late 40s (49, I believe), and not all that long after making that comment. Nicholas was 26 when Alexander died.
The most hunted man wanted dead or alive?.
Pulling a definition from a standard dictionary isn’t really the way to go when you are discussing a legal term.
For example, in the US Code this is the definition of mutiny or sedition as a legal offense:
“(a) Any person subject to this chapter who—
(1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority refuses, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;
(2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or other disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;
(3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.”
So you can see, even though refusing to obey orders is an element of the offense, it’s not the only required element. They would have to also prove that the intent of refusing to obey orders was to usurp or override lawful military authority, or to destroy or overthrow the civil authorities, which isn’t going to be the case with the vast majority of people who refuse to follow an order.
They are soldiers, mutany is a capital offense. Doesn't matter which side you are on.
I condemn everyone who does not fight for their country.
You probably approved of the Nazi’s hanging German soldiers who didn’t want to fight anymore towards the end of the war.
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