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Seeking FReeper Tech Advice (Vanity)
5//5/02 | Mr_Magoo

Posted on 05/05/2002 9:33:24 AM PDT by Mr_Magoo

I am starting the process of converting my Internet connection from dial up to cable modem. At the same time I am going to Network 2 computers to the connection.

I can get a $10/month discount by using my own cable modem. So I want to go that route. Also I want it to have a good firewall. What brand and model cable modem will work best? Also, is there any other equipment I should get?

I have 3 weeks to purchase everything and set up the network.

I already have 10/100 NIC cards for both computers, and enough Cat5 cable to wire a city block.


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; Technical
KEYWORDS:
I did the math and a cable Internet connection is actually less than a dialup when you look at the total cost of the dedicated phone line and the ISP fee.

If I don't respond for a while it is because I am posting this and then going outside to roto-till the back yard. I will check back here later this afternoon.

1 posted on 05/05/2002 9:33:24 AM PDT by Mr_Magoo
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To: Mr_Magoo
Firewall: ZoneAlarm. It's free, works great, blocks incoming and outgoing, can't say enough good about it.
2 posted on 05/05/2002 9:35:25 AM PDT by Clara Lou
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To: Clara Lou
I currently use Zone Alarm. The only gripe I have with it is that I also use McAffee virus protection and McAffee don't like Zone Alarm. I need to start the computer 2x or 3x to get them to play nice with each other.
3 posted on 05/05/2002 9:41:20 AM PDT by Mr_Magoo
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To: Mr_Magoo

i've had real good luck with Linksys stuff.
good price points, reliable, easy setup.
spend $100 for the router/switch - hardware NAT (firewall) is built-in.

4 posted on 05/05/2002 9:44:15 AM PDT by tomkat
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To: tomkat
I second the Linksys motion. I work in Internet security and the Linksys is what I use and also what I recommend to all my friends, techie and non-techie alike. It's fast and simple to set up, yet you have several advanced options available through it, such as DHCP, port forwarding, filtering, DMZing, etc.
5 posted on 05/05/2002 9:48:20 AM PDT by xrp
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To: Mr_Magoo
The cat 5 cable from the modem goes to a router. A cable from the router goes to a 4 or 8 port ethernet hub. All of your computers/printers are also connected to your ethernet hub. Voila.
6 posted on 05/05/2002 9:48:59 AM PDT by aviator
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To: Mr_Magoo
I expect you will love cable. I do. I used Zone Alarm for awhile without trouble. When I updated to Windows XP I started using XP's firewall and PC-cillan for mail/site checking. I get free rental on the RCA box AT&T provides, so I didn't buy one.
7 posted on 05/05/2002 9:50:03 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
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To: xrp
Another Linksys bump. I work in the industry, have Linksys at home and have had zero problems. If you have a laptop, (or plan to get one at some point) a Linksys router/wireless acess-point is something to consider as well.
8 posted on 05/05/2002 9:50:31 AM PDT by 2 Kool 2 Be 4-Gotten
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To: Mr_Magoo
If you want an internal local area network (like for a second computer), go with a hardware-based firewall like the Linksys or SMC Barricade. Both with give you 4 or 8 Ethernet ports, and the WAN connection for your cable modem.

Personally, I don't like the idea of script kiddies and hackers knocking on the back of my Ethernet card, protected only by a piece of software (like ZoneAlarm or Tiny).

I run the Linksys firewall, several computers attached to it, and Norton Personal Firewall on my main machine. Norton PF blocks cookies, JavaScript, and ActiveX while you're browsing. The Linksys gets everything else.

BTW, once you go on cable or DSL, hackers will be trying to scan/hack your system all day long, every day of the week. Using the above for more than 1 1/2 years, I've never had a problem.

9 posted on 05/05/2002 9:50:54 AM PDT by angkor
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To: xrp
I second the Linksys motion.

Sure, I own the Linksys myself, and it's generally quite good.

However myself and several other techie friends have had sometimes persistent problems running stuff like SSH, VNC, and the occasional VPN.

We all concur that the Linksys has some sort of undetermined buffering problem. One of my pals went to the SMC Barricade and suddenly everything worked.

10 posted on 05/05/2002 9:54:23 AM PDT by angkor
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To: Mr_Magoo
I rent my cable modem from Adelphia ($5/month).

From there the signal goes to a just recently purchased Linksys BEFW11S4 switch which provides a hardware Firewall.

The switch has 4 ports for hardwired computers (I use 3 of the 4), and also has wireless access for our notebook. The notebook has the Linksys WPC11 ver3.0 card.

A few years ago I hardwired our house with about 500-600 feet of cat 5. With the wireless switch all that work is no longer necessary.

11 posted on 05/05/2002 9:54:47 AM PDT by Balding_Eagle
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To: angkor
re linksys

when's the last time y'all did a firmware update ?

12 posted on 05/05/2002 9:57:52 AM PDT by tomkat
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To: Mr_Magoo
It would appear that you haven't done this before. I haven't either. But I can suggest you do this in stages. Get the cable modem/firewall installed and settled down. Get some experience with it. Then start the networking project. Or, alternatively, you could do the network first and then do the cable modem/firewall.
13 posted on 05/05/2002 9:58:25 AM PDT by upchuck
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To: Mr_Magoo
I currently use Zone Alarm. The only gripe I have with it is that I also use McAffee virus protection and McAffee don't like Zone Alarm. I need to start the computer 2x or 3x to get them to play nice with each other.

Consider Norton's Anti-Virus. I use this and Zone Alarm (Win 98) and they play nice together. If you decide to do this, don't bother with Norton's 'suite' products. Get just the antivirus.

Oh, and keep you virus definitions up to date. I do mine once a week.

14 posted on 05/05/2002 10:03:33 AM PDT by upchuck
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To: Mr_Magoo
i've had real good luck with Linksys stuff. good price points, reliable, easy setup. spend $100 for the router/switch - hardware NAT (firewall) is built-in.

I've used the Linksys BEFSR41 router for years with great success, and their routers are even better now with better security built in. Good choice on going to cable modem, You'll be amazed at the speed. A lot of transfers that used to take hours using an analog modem will now take minutes or even seconds i/o hours.

I've found that WinNT, 2000, and XP are even faster with a cable modem for the simple reason that they have better networking built in. Welcome to the world of broadband and good luck with your setup.

15 posted on 05/05/2002 10:03:54 AM PDT by quesera
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To: Mr_Magoo
I do a similar thing at my house. I put a Netgear Firewall/Router FR314 between the modem and my PCs. A simple router using NAT will block all but the most determined hack attempts. The FR314 uses packet inspection also, adding more protection. Netgear also sells a filtering package for their FR series for $50 per year. I didn't buy it because I could not get it to be as granular as I wanted. I added Symantec's Norton Internet Security for additional firewall and virus protection.

All this is low-end on the cost scale but works fine for my peer to peer network. You can spend less (slightly) or lots more. Wish I could afford a SonicWall myself. I can tell you that--in addition to some very good virus protection--you definitely want some kind of protection from hacks. My FR314 sends me a daily log of sweeps, scans and attacks. That log contains 30-200 hack attempts daily.

I really wish I was smart enough and had time enough to write hack and virus programs. I would use that knowledge for something worthwhile and be a very rich fat man.

16 posted on 05/05/2002 10:09:25 AM PDT by NerdDad
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To: tomkat
RE: firmware, I just upgraded. I read the release notes and saw many of the VPN issues have been addressed. Do you know if this buffering problem was ever solved?
17 posted on 05/05/2002 10:22:23 AM PDT by angkor
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To: angkor
believe that's what was causing a bit of a problem when
i installed this new one-holer (BEFSR11) down here in TX.

loaded the firmware update and it worked like a charm.

18 posted on 05/05/2002 10:26:08 AM PDT by tomkat
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To: Mr_Magoo
Permission to revise and extend. Not sure how your cable company does it but cableone only allows 3 devices. Get your network installed and stable. Then hook up the modem. It will only see the network router/firewall. I did mine wrong. I had run one box on the modem for a while before adding the router. The router was counted as my second device.

Get a modem that has a standby button. When noone will need Internet access, put the modem on standby. Hackers hammer cable modems non-stop. They can't get to you if they can't get to the modem.

19 posted on 05/05/2002 10:27:02 AM PDT by NerdDad
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To: Mr_Magoo
I currently use Zone Alarm. The only gripe I have with it is that I also use McAffee virus protection and McAffee don't like Zone Alarm. I need to start the computer 2x or 3x to get them to play nice with each other.

I have Norton Anti Virus and it works great with Zone Alarm, also it is much easier to use the McAffee. At least for me

20 posted on 05/05/2002 10:47:07 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: HairOfTheDog
My Dell came with Windows XP and I use ZoneAlarm Pro3.0 and it works great on my machine
21 posted on 05/05/2002 10:50:22 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: Mr_Magoo
Install the NETBEUI protocol on the computers, and use it for networking the two systems. Limit TCP/IP to just the internet connections, and do not bind it to the MS Networking components. NETBEUI is a non-routable protocol, which means the networking components will not be accessible through the cable modem as long as this is the only protocol they use.
22 posted on 05/05/2002 11:01:58 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tomkat
The Linksys router on the left is the one I have. It works fine, was easy to configure, and doesn't require a whole lot of upkeep.

Nevertheless, I hesitate to endorse any particular brand because it's often been my experience that what works for one person doesn't necessarily apply to another.

So take it for what it's worth.

23 posted on 05/05/2002 11:42:56 AM PDT by IronJack
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To: Mr_Magoo
I have had the Linksys BEFSR41 DSL/Cable Router since it first came out, and it's great. Their service is okay, too, if you should have questions. But I've found SMC's service to be even better: native English speakers in Southern California versus the call-centers in India used by Linksys and Netgear. You'll have more of a wait on hold with SMC (10-20 minutes) but the whole process goes smoother thanks to superior technical and communications skills on the other end.

I've installed Linksys, SMC, Netgear and Belkin Cable/DSL routers for friends. They're all good. A pal just got a Belkin which, after rebate, was $35!

As someone already pointed out, the beauty part is that the router is the only device "seen" by your cable or DSL provider. Don't expect your broadband provider to offer any support for getting things working. Fortunately, it's easy. My personal setup is currently:

--DSL modem from the DSL people (it was free);

--Linksys BEFSR41 with 4 ports (I paid $179 when it first came out);

--GigaFast 500-S switch/router with 5 more ports to accommodate my ridiculously over-wired household ($27);

--NetGear ME102 802.11b Wireless Access point ($119 after rebate), selected for superior ratings for range. Alas, the NetGear's current firmware does not allow an encrypted-only wireless connection. This appears to be a fault shared with several other 802.11b WAPs that use the Intersil chipset, which currently dominates this market segment.

One thing I do recommend is that--whatever brand you buy--you don't use the setup CD. These things are configurable via your web browser. Just forward through the manual until you see instructions for typing "http://192.168.1.1" or something similar in your browser. Those setup packages cause more troubles than they solve, IMHO. If you can't figure out how to configure things with a browser, you can always return to the CD, but I've never had to.
24 posted on 05/05/2002 1:18:37 PM PDT by RightOnTheLeftCoast
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To: tomkat;xrp;aviator;HairOfTheDog;2 Kool 2 Be 4-Gotten;angkor;Balding_Eagle;upchuck;quesera...
Blast reply.

Thanks for the info. My current setup is 2 computers using dialup for Internet access. The cost for the 2nd phone line plus the ISP fees is $43 a month. If I network the 2 computers and use cable access, the cost is $41 a month. $31 a month if I provide my own cable modem. The reduced overall cost is a big factor in this decision.

There are other reasons to network the 2 computers. One of them has a scanner, the other has the laser printer. Currently if I want to transfer an image or other files between the two, I have to e-mail it to myself. (that sucks)

The install date is in 3 weeks. So, I've got 3 weeks to purchase whatever, install and wire it all, and debug it. From looking at the Linksys web site, it looks like a BEFCMU10 cable modem feeding into a BEFSR41 Cable/DSL Router with 4-Port Switch would do the trick. I think I can even put the laser printer on the network so both computers can use it by using the PPSX1 10/100 PrintServer.

As I see it, the thing to be careful of is FIREWALL. Need to be sure the network side is safe from hackers.

Again, thanks for the replies. I hate to post and run like I did, but I had to get a start on this.

25 posted on 05/05/2002 5:36:13 PM PDT by Mr_Magoo
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To: Mr_Magoo
Well, here's my two cents. I prefer a rear tine to a front tine, lots easier to handle. At least 6.5 horsepower, 19 inch tine width if you can get 'em, although you won't notice much difference if you get the 17 inchers. Now, wheel size is important, try to get 16 inchers. Oh, and you'll definately want one with a reverse gear. Counter rotating tines are nice too........ Hey, wait a minute..... I think I got confused about what exactly your question was.

Cable modem? Router? Sorry, don't have a clue. {;-)

26 posted on 05/05/2002 5:53:52 PM PDT by Hoosier Patriot
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To: Mr_Magoo
read up a little on NAT to allay your security concerns.
HERE is as good a place as any to start.

unless you anticipate huge print queues, you'll prolly be
able to save some bucks by foregoing the print server.
i've never needed one w/ +/- 6 boxes in a home LAN.

27 posted on 05/05/2002 6:08:33 PM PDT by tomkat
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To: tomkat
have to agree with magoo here. linksys router will get the job done. no need for a firewall (as it's built in to the hardware with a web admin interface). if you do want to keep track of ingoing/outgoing connections you can always get yourself a copy of 'tiny' personal firewall (free) let us know what you decide on!
28 posted on 05/05/2002 6:15:13 PM PDT by anka
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To: anka
uhmmm, think you might have me and magoo mixed up ...
29 posted on 05/05/2002 6:23:42 PM PDT by tomkat
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To: angkor;2 Kool 2 Be 4-Gotten;tomkat
I'm thinking of getting linksys wireless router for my home ADSL setup.

But a few weeks ago BellSouth (my provider) sent me a letter saying that they were going to start offering routers to their customers that needed more than one hookup. The letter was worded as if you have to pay extra if you rout the connection to more than one computer. Even if you buy and install your own equipment to two 'puters.

Can they do this?
1. Practically, meaning, can they tell if I install my own router.
2. Legally, I don't remember seeing any thing like this in my original agreement. (other than terms subject to change at any time, blah, blah, blah)

30 posted on 05/05/2002 6:24:55 PM PDT by avg_freeper
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To: avg_freeper
pretty good deal for them:

'give' you a $30 piece of hardware,
then whack ya for another $20/pc/mo or so in service fees.

my $0.02 ?
get your own stuff and laugh all the way to the bank ...

31 posted on 05/05/2002 6:57:02 PM PDT by tomkat
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To: tomkat
Thanks for the info on NAT. Will read it tonight.
32 posted on 05/05/2002 6:58:03 PM PDT by Mr_Magoo
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To: Hoosier Patriot
LOL!

Actually it was a front tine 18" 8hp. The tiller was not so bad, the 4' rake afterwords was killer! One more task off the to-do list. . .

33 posted on 05/05/2002 7:00:44 PM PDT by Mr_Magoo
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To: avg_freeper; Mr_Magoo
"...terms subject to change at any time..."
...usually means Yes, they can, whenever they decide to.

They can also tell how many computers you have depending on what you do with them. My wife and I play games on battle.net and in order to play together (and "see" each other when we do) we needed to get seperate ip addresses for our computers.

We have cable access, Zone Alarm (replaced BlackIce) and a Lynksys hub between our Best Data cable modem and our Dells. Even with ZoneAlarm disabled, sites like Shields Up! can't probe our ports so we have pretty good security somewhere in that chain of hardware.

34 posted on 05/05/2002 7:02:10 PM PDT by Drumbo
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To: Mr_Magoo
You're more than welcome! FR has lots of knowledgeable folks, as you've seen, and we're happy to help.

You don't need a separate print server. First, some Cable/DSL routers--like SMC's--have a printer server built-in. Alternatively, Windows will let your PC with the laser printer attached share the printer on your LAN. You'll need NetBEUI and file/printer sharing turned on in your network setup. Then--maybe a reboot or two later--just tell the machine to which the printer is hard-wired to share its printer. On the other machine, add a networked printer, and browse to find it. Done. The only circumstances this won't work is if you have a lame printer (like my otherwise-excellent Epson 2500) that won't let you share it reliably, or if you have XP on the second machine and there's no an XP-compatible driver available for the shared printer (also a problem with my Epson). The only drawback to this approach is that the computer with the printer attached must be turned-on in order for your client machine to print.
35 posted on 05/05/2002 7:08:47 PM PDT by RightOnTheLeftCoast
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To: angkor
That's odd. I run an FTP server on FreeBSD, a Jedi Knight 2 server on FreeBSD with Linux compatibility package, an SSH daemon on FreeBSD and VPN and never have had any problems. Are you running the latest firmware from Linksys?
36 posted on 05/05/2002 7:36:52 PM PDT by xrp
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To: Mr_Magoo
Sounds like the setup you describe will work great. Wait until you get cable modem, you'll never want to go back.

An FYI, I've learned that under certain circumstances the modem needs to be 'rebooted'......I just unplug, wait a second or two and plug it back in.

Also you didn't mention your operating system. 2000, and XP are setup for easy networking, computers, sharing printers and scanners is a breeze.

Good luck!

37 posted on 05/05/2002 8:14:46 PM PDT by Balding_Eagle
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To: Mr_Magoo
Yet another plug for the Linksys BEFSR41 DSL/Cable Router. I installed this in January (at the advice of Freepers) and have had zero problems so far and I share the cable connection with three computers with no apparent loss in speed. The only tricky part of the installation is "cloning" the MAC address to the Linksys (to avoid the cable company charging extra money for having more than one computer online). Basically you take the MAC address the cable company gave your computer and clone it to the Linksys so that the cable company thinks the Linksys is your computer. You can probably avoid this however by getting the router first and having the cable guy set the connection up on the router instead of on the computer.

You will be amazed at the speed of cable.

38 posted on 05/05/2002 8:26:18 PM PDT by SamAdams76
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To: Balding_Eagle
As for OS, one computer is win 98. The other is a duel boot win 98/Linux.
39 posted on 05/05/2002 8:28:19 PM PDT by Mr_Magoo
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To: Mr_Magoo
Have to agree with all the linksys router folks,the only way to go,
NAT is built in but I also use Sygate's personal firewall
It's free,I used Zone Alarm for a couple of years but the newest version seems a little buggy.
The Sygate product has given me no lockups or conflicts so far.
Enjoy your broadband,I've had road Runner for about 2 years,I'll never do dial up again.
40 posted on 05/05/2002 8:33:36 PM PDT by damnlimey
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To: xrp
Updated yesterday, will try again.
41 posted on 05/06/2002 1:42:03 AM PDT by angkor
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To: Mr_Magoo
Win 98, or Win 98 Ver2?

As I recall, Version2, or release 2 contains the ability to network. W2000, and XP make networking (including printer sharing) a breeze.

I have 3 printers (one HP2100 laser, one HP Paintjet for 11x17 pages, one Epson for high quality color) 2 connected to one computer, one on the other. The networking works so smooth that I no longer even think about where the printers are connected, I just 'point and print'. After years of waiting, many of the ease of use features are finally working for me.

42 posted on 05/06/2002 6:54:53 AM PDT by Balding_Eagle
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To: tomkat
you would be correct sir ;)
43 posted on 05/06/2002 1:36:18 PM PDT by anka
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To: avg_freeper
I just happen to work with BST. They're offering a supported ADSL setup where they take responsibility for the network. They'll provide all the stuff you need and maintain the system basically.

At least that's the way I took it. That's handled by corporate. Being a regular flunky I don't fool with the networking.

I have mine set up with a router and I have no problems. Just as long as I don't abuse the 1 IP address they assign me I'm cool with them.

44 posted on 05/06/2002 5:45:19 PM PDT by Bogey78O
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To: Drumbo
Well as long as you keep that one IP address they give you and don't abuse it they don't care.

I remember they used to check to see if anyone was cheating on their bill by checking capacitance on the line. They could count how many phones you had connected. And since they used to charge per phone they'd pay attention. Then they stopped charging that way and now they don't care.

45 posted on 05/06/2002 5:48:20 PM PDT by Bogey78O
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To: tomkat
Linksys and their related generic brand is the main hardware used in my area for DSL. If it's the choice of Bell then it's gotta be good.
46 posted on 05/06/2002 5:50:48 PM PDT by Bogey78O
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To: Mr_Magoo;ALL
Well, bought a BEFCMU10 cable modem and a BEFSR41 Cable/DSL Router today. Now to make the wire runs.
47 posted on 05/06/2002 6:23:48 PM PDT by Mr_Magoo
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