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Martini gets OK as Federal Judge
The Record of Hackensack ^ | 11.16.02

Posted on 11/22/2002 10:15:58 AM PST by Coleus

Martini gets OK as federal judge

MITCHEL MADDUX

Former Rep. Bill Martini has been confirmed as a New Jersey federal judge by the U.S. Senate.

Martini, 55, a Republican who lives in Clifton and practices law in Newark, is a former federal prosecutor who also has served as a Passaic County freeholder.

A member of a prominent Passaic County family long involved in politics, he serves as a commissioner of the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey.

Martini will have to resign from the agency, and Governor McGreevey will name his replacement on the 12-person board.

Martini said Friday he looked forward to beginning another career as a jurist.

"I'm actually excited about the new undertaking and the challenges it will present," he said.

Sens. Jon Corzine and Robert Torricelli, both D-N.J., said Martini and four other judges confirmed late Thursday night will add "new voices to New Jersey's federal courts that will reflect our state's intellectual, geographic, and ethnic diversity."

Martini played a key role in the state as a fund-raiser and organizer for President Bush's 2000 presidential campaign.

He began his political career on the Clifton City Council, where he served from 1990 to 1994. He was elected to the Passaic County Board of Freeholders in 1993.

A year later, Martini won a congressional seat in the 8th District, which covers most of Passaic County and some of northern Essex County. He lost the seat two years later to former Paterson Mayor Bill Pascrell, a Democrat.

Martini also has served as an assistant Hudson County prosecutor and spent three years as a federal prosecutor in Newark. Most recently, he has been practicing law at Sills, Cummis in Newark, specializing in litigation, government affairs, and regulatory work.

Bush nominated Martini to the lifetime position in June. It pays $150,000 annually.

New Jersey has three federal courthouses - Newark, Camden, and Trenton - and it was unclear Friday which courthouse Martini would serve in.

Of the four other judges confirmed by the Senate for New Jersey seats, three are magistrates: Stanley Chesler, Freda Wolfson, and Robert Kugler. The fourth confirmation was of Essex County Superior Court Judge Jose Linares.

Chesler, a Republican who sits in Newark, has been a magistrate since 1987. He was a federal prosecutor investigating organized crime from 1980 to 1986, and an assistant district attorney in the Bronx from 1974 to 1980.

Wolfson, a Democrat who sits in Trenton, has been a magistrate since 1986. She is married to Douglas K. Wolfson, director of the law division in the state attorney general's office.

Kugler, an independent who sits in Camden, worked as an assistant Camden County prosecutor. His father is former state Attorney General George Kugler.

Linares, a Republican who sits in Newark, was the first Cuban-American judge at the Essex County Courthouse and former head of the New Jersey Hispanic Bar Association.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; Politics/Elections; US: New Jersey
KEYWORDS: 3rdcircuit; abortion; abortionlist; benny; bush; bushbabeslist; catholiclist; corzine; courtofappeals; courts; federalbench; federaljudiciary; judiciary; newjersey; nhs; nj; presidentbushlist; prolife; scotuslist; sprint; thirdcircuit; torricelli
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Thank you President Bush, yes, no litmus test for the Republicans and for Life, yep, just appoint pro-abortion judges as Clinton did. I know, don't waste your political clout on NJ since it's a hopeless cause with Corzine and Torricelli in control and NO Real Republican Leader in the State--Let the Children suffer because of Politics.
1 posted on 11/22/2002 10:15:59 AM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus
Course, you make no mention of the fact that Bush's executive orders have been the first EVER (even including Reagan) to actually REDUCE abortions. There are four separate EOs that have specifically reduced the # of abortions on military bases; without parental consent; in cases of UN aid (via funding); and there was a fourth I recall early on, but can't put my finger on it now.

Moreover, no mention of whether these judges are "strict constructionists," whose JUDICIAL views would take precedence over their PERSONAL views.

2 posted on 11/22/2002 10:19:42 AM PST by LS
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To: Coleus
I am ignorant on the suject of New Jersey local politics. What makes you sure that all 5 appointees are Pro-Abortion?
3 posted on 11/22/2002 10:19:57 AM PST by WaveThatFlag
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To: Coleus
Please post the correct title and support your accusations.
4 posted on 11/22/2002 10:20:13 AM PST by Always Right
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To: Coleus
Rather than lining up to oppose abortion policy over your posting, I find my mind trying to nail down your agenda, Coleus. Are you a libertarian by chance?
5 posted on 11/22/2002 10:21:38 AM PST by MHGinTN
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To: Coleus
Ah now, let's not be too hard on President Bush. He's Republican, dontchaknow, and therefore it's ok for him to appoint pro-death judges. As long as those nasty ol' Democrats don't do it.
6 posted on 11/22/2002 10:23:33 AM PST by Cacophonous
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To: Coleus
Yes, it's starting to happen!
7 posted on 11/22/2002 10:26:45 AM PST by Salvation
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To: Coleus
I guess I got that wrong. I thought it said pro-life rather than pro-death.

My mistake.
8 posted on 11/22/2002 10:30:02 AM PST by Salvation
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To: PaulNYC; tsomer; Mixer; MattinNJ; OceanKing; TomT in NJ; Coleus; agrace; Alberta's Child; ...
Bush has written off NJ politically, so he does not want to waste any of his "political capital" here in NJ. And given the fact that NJ has two Democrat Senators, he will have a hard time getting them to approve any pro-life candidate.

Federal judicial appointments are usually controlled by the senator(s) of a given state, but if they are both Democrats, then the ranking Republican in the state gets to make the calls, but there is a huge power vacuum in the NJ Republican Party right now -- no one's really in charge.

So, Bush cut a deal with the Democrats a year or so ago. Under its terms, the Democrats get to pick every other judge, and they get to disapprove the ones that Bush picks. In other words, the Democrats get to control 100% of the NJ appointments. This deal allows Bush to ignore what's going on in NJ, but still to get judges confirmed in NJ.

The Democrats agreed not to block his appointments, but he had to agree to let them make every other appointment, and to "vet" his appointments. Thus, no one gets on the federal bench in NJ unless the Dems say so -- which means that we will keep seeing more of the same type of judge (all pro-abortion). But those who are nominated breeze through the confirmation process very easily. (The five who were just confirmed had been rushed through the process BEFORE the elections, something that was not happening anywhere else in the country.) It is doubtful that there will be any change in this arrangement until either (a) the Democrats lose one of the Senate seats or (b) some Republican emerges as the clear victor within the party in NJ and lays claim to the appointment power.

The deal may relate only to district court judges (trial level federal judges) and may not apply to circuit court judges (appellate level federal judges). Nobody really does not know at this present time.

What about Bush's appointment of pro-lifers to the bench? Unfortunately, Bush never committed to this, contrary to the wishful thinking of pro-lifers who were not carefully reading his lips during the 2000 campaign. Bush said something like this, "I will appoint people who will follow the Constitution instead of interpreting it any way they want."

After the election battle left Republicans with only a narrow margin in the Senate (before Jeffords defected and things got even worse), Bush and his administration decided to concentrate on appointments at the appellate level, and not to waste "political capital" on battles on the trial court level.

In any event, rumors have it that it will be a cold day in hell before a known pro-lifer will get a nomination from this administration. So much for appointing pro-lifers to the bench! Although Bush has done some good pro-life things, he and his advisors are still very much adherents of the Republicrat/political school.
9 posted on 11/22/2002 10:31:08 AM PST by Coleus
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To: Always Right
Do you have evidence to the contrary?
10 posted on 11/22/2002 10:32:03 AM PST by Coleus
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To: MHGinTN
Republican
11 posted on 11/22/2002 10:32:43 AM PST by Coleus
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To: All
Martini named Federal Judge... President Bush yesterday nominated former Congressman William Martini as a U.S. Federal Court Judge. Martini served as a Repubican Congressman from Passaic and Essex counties from 1995 to 1997, and is a former Passaic County Freeholder and Clifton Councilman. He defeated freshman Democratic Rep. Herb Klein in the anti-Clinton 1994 elections, but lost his seat two years later to Democrat Bill Pascrell, Jr. Martini's confirmation will open up his seat on the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey to the McGreevey administration. (01/24/02)




http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/jersey/index.ssf?/base/news-1/1021108202131424.xml
Bill Martini (64), Appointed Federal Judge

White House readies relief for U.S. District Court in Jersey

Three new candidates for prestigious posts join two others awaiting formal nomination

Saturday, May 11, 2002

BY ROBERT RUDOLPH
Star-Ledger Staff

A judicial manpower crisis that has plagued the federal courts may soon be over in New Jersey with the pending nomination of three candidates to seats on the U.S. District Court.

Knowledgeable political and legal insiders say a political logjam that had stalled the confirmation of two pending nominees to the bench is expected to be broken shortly when the White House formally nominates the candidates.

Sources confirmed yesterday that the three new candidates, who include one Democrat, one Independent and one Republican, have already been contacted by the White House and notified of the Bush administration's "intention to nominate" them to the prestigious judicial posts.

Along with two other stalled nominations, it will mark the largest number of federal judicial vacancies ever filled at one time in New Jersey.

The move will help end the largest federal judicial manpower crush in the state in three decades -- the result of several judges stepping down or going on senior status. The situation had threatened to delay the processing of cases, and had already compelled some judges to work seven-day weeks.

The three new candidates have been identified as U.S. Magistrate Freda Wolfson, a Democrat, who sits in Trenton; U.S. Magistrate Robert Kugler, an Independent, who sits in Camden; and state Superior Court Judge Jose Linares, a Republican, who sits in Newark.

The Bush Administration had already passed the names of former Rep. William Martini and sitting U.S. Magistrate Stanley Chesler, both Republicans, to the Senate, but no action has been taken yet to confirm the appointments.

New Jersey's two U.S. senators, Robert Torricelli and Jon Corzine, both Democrats, have practical veto power over the nominations and had agreed to support the Bush candidates only on condition that the White House give them a voice in filling the additional three vacancies.

The senators have maintained that New Jersey is a Democratic state with a Democratic governor and two Democratic senators, so its judges should be picked, at least in part, by Democrats.

Kugler is the son of former New Jersey Attorney General George Kugler, a Republican, and had previously worked as an assistant Camden County prosecutor.

Wolfson is the wife of Douglas K. Wolfson, the newly appointed director of the Division of Law in the state Attorney General's Office, and has served as a federal magistrate since 1986.

Linares is the first Cuban-American judge in Essex County.

Kugler, Wolfson and Linares could not be reached for comment.

Martini is a former member of the Clifton City Council and the Passaic County Board of Freeholders. He was an assistant Hudson County prosecutor and an assistant U.S. attorney, and he served one term in the House before losing to William Pascrell in 1996. Martini represented the 8th Congressional District.

Chesler, who sits in Newark, has been a magistrate since 1987, when he was nominated by President Ronald Reagan. He previously served as a federal prosecutor in New Jersey investigating organized crime from 1980 to 1986.

Torricelli press secretary Debra DeShong refused to confirm the names of the three new candidates, but said, "Senators Torricelli and Corzine have been working very closely with the White House to ensure that the nominees reflect the ethnic, gender and geographical diversity of our state."

Alfred DeCotiis, a prominent attorney active in Democratic political circles, said the breakthrough "augers well for a strong and effective judiciary which will reflect the true face of New Jersey."

Donald A. Robinson, a former president of the state federal bar association, also hailed the elevation of the three judges to the district court, noting that the trio have proven to be "experienced, highly competent judges already."

Robinson said the state boasts the highest number of magistrates in the nation who have been promoted to the district bench, and added that the post has proven a valuable training ground.

The district court in New Jersey is divided into three venues: Newark, Trenton and Camden. Ten active judges sit in Newark, three in Trenton and four in Camden. In addition, there are seven senior judges. Judges who reach 65 are allowed to remain on the bench, keeping their office and staff while handling reduced caseloads.
12 posted on 11/22/2002 10:37:57 AM PST by Coleus
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To: Always Right
Looks like they changed the title very fast--within 2 minutes. I can I argue with you since you are always right.
What kind of support do you want? Only one has a congressional record. Just trust me.
13 posted on 11/22/2002 10:40:44 AM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus
Do you have evidence to the contrary?

That's kind of like saying you are a pedophile and asking to prove you are not. You are the one who made the accusation and thus have the burdon of proof.

14 posted on 11/22/2002 10:42:39 AM PST by Always Right
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To: Coleus
Look, It is the Lefts fault that Abortion is even a National issue, but lets not kid ourselves, the odds are That Sandra Dee, and Probably Stevens will not make it through a second Bush term, and Hopefully restoring Constitutionalists to Scotus will scuttle Roe, and Each individual state can decide for itself what should be, and the Job of winning peoples hearts over in the remaining states will be that much easier.
15 posted on 11/22/2002 10:45:21 AM PST by hobbes1
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To: LS
Moreover, no mention of whether these judges are "strict constructionists," whose JUDICIAL views would take precedence over their PERSONAL views.

Being opposed to the judicial activism by which the federal judiciary has taken away the states' right to choose to have laws against abortion--that IS a JUDICIAL view. A strict constructionist would not invent "penumbras" and "emanations" that create a right to abortion in the Constitution. A strict constructionist would adhere to the Tenth Amendment, which limits the powers of the federal government to those explicitly delegated to it in the Constitution. A strict constructionist would not let the federal government overturn legitimate state laws against abortion, as has been done since January 22, 1973.

That said, I do not have enough information on how or why these particular judges are being appointed, so as to comment on this matter per se.

16 posted on 11/22/2002 10:45:35 AM PST by Charles Henrickson
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To: Coleus
What kind of support do you want? Only one has a congressional record. Just trust me.

Trust you based on what. Do you personally know them? Have you've seen any of their rulings before. I know they are from NJ and it could be they are left-leaning, but state why you think so.

17 posted on 11/22/2002 10:45:49 AM PST by Always Right
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To: Always Right
Ok, all 5 are pro life, yea for Bush and Trent Lott rah rah rah
18 posted on 11/22/2002 10:48:08 AM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus
So far, not one thing you've posted addresses these judges on the issues of abortion on demand. I'm beginning to wonder what you mean when you use the term 'pro-life'. [You do realize, don't you, that there are rare cases in medicine when a physician should have the right to 'choose' termination of a pregnancy? Would such a physician be removed from some 'pro-life' list in your economy? Since I state that there are reasons for not outlawing completely the physician and woman's right to choose termination of a pregnancy -under rare circumstances, but still a choice- would you remove me from some pro-life list and malign me as a pro-choicer, a pro-abortionist, a pro-death RINO? Radicalization of our desire to drastically reduce abortion in our nation doesn't help the realization of such a goal.]
19 posted on 11/22/2002 10:52:02 AM PST by MHGinTN
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To: MHGinTN
Found one thing so far. Bill Martini as a member of the House voted FOR a ban on PBA.
20 posted on 11/22/2002 10:56:21 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: Coleus
Ok, all 5 are pro life, yea for Bush and Trent Lott rah rah rah

Thanks, I know what part of your ananomy you pulled your information from.

21 posted on 11/22/2002 11:08:45 AM PST by Always Right
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To: Coleus
From campaign 1996, when Martini lost to Pascrell.
Abortion House: Would you have voted for the bill to ban so-called partial-birth abortions, in which the doctor removes the fetus' brain tissue after bringing the fetus into the birth canal? Under the bill, doctors who perform the procedure could be subject to criminal and civil penalties. [H: HR1833. Passed, H vote: 288-139] Senate: Would you have voted for the amendment to a bill prescribing criminal and civil penalties for doctors who perform so-called partial-birth abortions? The amendment would have provided legal protections for doctors who used the procedure to protect the life or health of the pregnant woman. [S: Amendment to HR1833. Rejected, S vote: 47-51] here
Martini- YES, Pascrell- NO
22 posted on 11/22/2002 11:12:17 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: Always Right
"Sens. Jon Corzine and Robert Torricelli, both D-N.J., said Martini and four other judges confirmed late Thursday night will add "new voices to New Jersey's federal courts that will reflect our state's intellectual, geographic, and ethnic diversity."

With supporters like these, I don't want to know Martini. You don't really think for a minute that Corazine and Terror-celli would consider a pro-lifer as "reflective (of) our state's intellectual, geographic, and ethnic diversity"(Note the Abortion Party reluctance to address anything remotely religious...). No chance, in my opinion.

People's party doing for the children....again.

23 posted on 11/22/2002 11:31:34 AM PST by Freemeorkillme
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To: Freemeorkillme
Correction. That should be-->>
"People's Party doing it for the children...again"
24 posted on 11/22/2002 11:32:46 AM PST by Freemeorkillme
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To: William McKinley
Found 2 abortion votes for Bill Martini (lifetime ACU rating = 60):

1995: HR 2127, voted FOR the "Greenwood Amendment" which allocated nearly $200 million for "family planning". This was basically a payoff from the liberals in Congress to Planned Parenthood. The amendment passed 224-204 with the aid of several RINOs.

1996: HR 1833: voted FOR overriding Clinton's veto of the Partial Birth Abortion Ban. The override was successful, 285-137.

So that's one pro-life vote and one pro-death vote. By NJ standards, that makes Martini a staunch conservative.

DWG

25 posted on 11/22/2002 12:09:04 PM PST by DownWithGreenspan
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To: Coleus
Hello! I'm a first timer, be gentle!

We shouldn't be single issue supporters. There may be a difference between "Pro-abortion" and supporting legal precedent. We need to be consistent re litmus tests. Also, to put the issue of abortion to bed for good, we need law enacted to make abortion illegal except for very strictly defined situations, and then test it's constitionality with a mostly conservative Supreme court. If truly viewed strictly, I don't believe a conservative Court can read a right to an Abortion into the Constitution.
26 posted on 11/22/2002 12:43:10 PM PST by cookiemonster
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To: cookiemonster
Welcome, cookiemonster.

Ok, I'll bite....nibble, that is. Coleus is not a one-issue activist as one who were new or outside the Jersey seen may not realize. We all have issues that we hold closer to the heart than others. Afore a backdrop of conservative solidarity(no, not mind-numbed robots), most FReepers find their own niche/zone of sorts.

You will also notice that these contrasts in interests and backgrounds compliment eachother quite well and actually provide an interesting perspective when looking over the ideological landscape, quite like the topology of America from a bird's eye view.

Anyway, welcome and enjoy. Read, read, read. There is such a vast amount of information here.

Oh yeah, watch out for the jedi cult members.

Freemeorkillme
27 posted on 11/22/2002 1:03:46 PM PST by Freemeorkillme
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To: cookiemonster
Bill Clinton appointed 373 Federal Judges to the bench who are all pro-abortion. With the exception with, I think, two, all were pushed through by the Republican Senate.

George Bush ran as a pro-life candidate at the Republican National Convention who stated he found Jesus. He made us to believe he would not be like Clinton when it came to the life issue.

I go by actions not words, first it was the stem cell issue, now it's the appointment of 5 pro-abortion judges in NJ. He's not keeping his word and I have a right to express my opinion. It doesn't mean that I won't vote for him in 2004, he is messing up and we have to keep him on track and let him know that we are watching what he does and will not rubberstapm everything he does.

Welcome to the Free Republic. As you can see, not even we conservatives think alike and have many different issues, convictions and views dear to our hearts.

So, what's your favorite, Orios or Chocolate Chips?
28 posted on 11/22/2002 1:56:58 PM PST by Coleus
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To: William McKinley; MHGinTN
I am now looking at the 1996 Christian Coalition Congressional Scorecard. I knew I saved it for some reason.

vote 207 March 7, 1995, voted against tort reform

vote 350 May 24, 1995, voted FOR taxpayer-funded abortions
in foreign countries

vote 226 March 9, 1995, voted against tort reform again by not allowing caps on pain and suffering, remember he's a liar I mean lawyer

vote 460 September 28, 1993, voted FOR lifting Ban of Gays in the Military.

vote 91 March 24, 1994, voted FOR promoting Homosexuality to School Children. Amendment by Jolene Unsoeld (D-WA) to permit educational agencies to use tax money to teach children that homosexuality is a positive lifestyle alternative.

Vote 74 March 21, 1994, Voted AGAINST voluntary school prayer in schools.
29 posted on 11/22/2002 2:00:17 PM PST by Coleus
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To: LS
I think you are being unfair to Reagan. The Mexico City policy EO that Bush signed was actually originally signed by Reagan, then overturned by Clinton.
30 posted on 11/22/2002 4:29:46 PM PST by nickcarraway
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To: nickcarraway
Yes, I think you are right. But Reagan could have issued any of those executive orders regarding military bases, etc., that Bush issued, and did not.

Reagan is my hero, and the best president of the 20th century, but if you read his bio, "My American Life," you'll see that he was standoffish about the pro-life people and repeatedly sought to balance them with the "moderates" (his words). My point is that Bush has actually saved more lives than anyone.

31 posted on 11/22/2002 6:09:03 PM PST by LS
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To: LS
Of Course I didn't mention it otherwise you would have read it :)

The subject matter of my post had to do with Bush going against his word by nominating 5 pro-abortion judges in New Jersey, very quietly, I might add. He clearly led us to believe at the Republican National Convention that he found Jesus and was a pro-life Christian. Obviously, actions speak louder than words and by his stem-cell order and the appointing of these 5 judges to the federal bench leads me to believe he isn't standing by his convictions.

Oh, and slapping in the face all of us school voucher advocates hurt too. Remember he and Ted Kennedy shaking hands after wasting $15 Billion on his education initiative? Big Govt. yes, school choice NO. Great Republican signing the biggest budget in America's History.
32 posted on 11/22/2002 9:19:34 PM PST by Coleus
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To: Always Right
and support your accusations.>>>

You've got to be kidding?

Why don't you come to NJ and interview the 5 appointees and find out for yourself. Go to their offices and courts, then search the dockets in the court houses, search the congressional record for Martini then come back here with your evidence. This is not a court where the burden of proof lies with the prosecutor, it's a public bulletin board where people sign on anonymously using pseudonyms where people post articles for Discussion. Let me put it this way, 2 ultra liberal Senators approved the 5 judges without incident or comment. If you want more proof go and get it, unless you will hire me to be your consultant. Until then, my case is stated--they are not pro life.

I sincerely wish you can prove me wrong.
33 posted on 11/22/2002 9:25:34 PM PST by Coleus
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To: WaveThatFlag
The pro life agencies and attorney's in NJ who know them told me so. Martini was a congressman and his record is public. You will have to call the National RTL for further info. sicne the web site doesn't go back to 1994-95.

Ultra left wing NJ Senators Corzine and Torricelli approved them without incident. No litmus test since they are all pro-choice.
34 posted on 11/22/2002 9:33:40 PM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus
Thanks for the welcome. I appreciate good debate. I once for grins signed up at DU, posted once, didn't swear or call anyone names, and the instantly flamed me, called me a freeper, then promptly banned me!

Actually my favorite is oatmeal raisin, but my handle refers to computer cookies. I work a Tier 1 computer helpdesk, and do alot of browser cache deletions when users have web app login problems.
35 posted on 11/22/2002 10:01:19 PM PST by cookiemonster
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To: Freemeorkillme
Thanks also for the nice welcome. It sure beats the welcome I got over at DUfus.com. I was banned after my first post! I post and lurk over at L.com, and finally needed a little more variety.
36 posted on 11/22/2002 10:06:02 PM PST by cookiemonster
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To: Coleus
I like your anaylsis.
New Jersey is shot down the liberal toilet forever anyway, so Bush may as well dump a few scumbag judges on the place and pocket some political capital for when it matters.
37 posted on 11/22/2002 10:11:46 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: cookiemonster
How did you find the fr?
38 posted on 11/22/2002 10:25:47 PM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus
If actions speak louder than words, you are thereby ignoring the most important actions of the actual executive orders which have actually saved lives, vs. the "possible/potential" lives threatened by the stem-cell research and judges.

I suggest before you get your undies in a bunch that you weigh the number of actual lives saved by the EXISTING orders and let the future take care of itself. Seems to me you have no concern at all for those actually saved, but rather prefer a soapbox to scream "pro-life." This is disgustingly similar to the Democrats who prefer to have an issue rather than a solution. Bush has provided an actual solution in at least four specific ways where the number of abortions have been reduced. Until I see specific rulings from these judges otherwise, I value that higher than any other appointments or stem-cell decisions.

39 posted on 11/23/2002 6:12:10 AM PST by LS
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To: MHGinTN
It's not being radical, the facts remain as they are. Ultra left wing Torricelli and communist Corzine approved these judges without any discussion. It was a rubber stamp for abortion. William Martini was a congressman who ran as a Pro-choice candidate and voted for funding abortion agencies overseas. As I stated in other posts, many of NJ pro-life agencies labeled these lawyers as pro-abortion.
40 posted on 11/23/2002 9:35:07 AM PST by Coleus
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To: LS
I suggest before you get your undies in a bunch that you weigh the number of actual lives saved by the EXISTING orders and let the future take care of itself.>>>

With the type of left-wing federal judges he is appointing, I don't there there will much of a future for the fetus in NJ or elsewhere.
41 posted on 11/23/2002 10:47:54 AM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus
So you have, for a third time, either ignored the point of the post or choose to disregard the ultimate goal of saving lives. I submit to you one last time---and give you a chance to acknowledge your error---that Bush has, through ex. orders, already saved countless lives, while the judge appointmees, which have yet to rule in a single case in their new appointments, have yet to affect a single life in any way as related to Bush.

Are you ready yet to start focusing on lives saved rather than "potential" lives lost?

42 posted on 11/23/2002 4:11:14 PM PST by LS
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To: LS
And for the third time, your point isn't germane to the post. I'm sticking to the subject matter of Bush not appointing pro-life judges to the federal bench as he stated he was going to do and for LYING to the American people. So far he hasn't proved to be very truthful. The facts are the same and in NOT any error, Bush lied and appointed 5 pro-abortion judges to the federal bench in New Jersey. Bush made a serious error and I hope he asks for God's forgiveness.
43 posted on 11/23/2002 4:38:46 PM PST by Coleus
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To: William McKinley
Thanks, this question deals with partial birth abortion, the most extreme. Martini is pro choice with the issue of abortion.

From your link:

"Locked in one of the closest races in New Jersey, Martini has credentials that may invite crossover votes. He is endorsed by the Sierra Club for his environmental record--he led an effort to prevent development of the 17,500-acre Sterling Forest-- is pro-choice and voted to raise the minimum wage. Still, Martini won his freshman election by only 1%, and his popularity hasn't been tested against a challenger as well known as Pascrell"

Choice = abortion in my book.

Great fiscal conservative republican--He voted for an increase for the minimun wage too. If I didn't know him and read this paragraph I would have bet he was a Democrat.

44 posted on 11/23/2002 5:21:04 PM PST by Coleus
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To: DownWithGreenspan
Thanks for the research, as I said he's an abortionist. Most level-headed pro choicers voted against PBA.

Can you provide the links you used to find this information, thanks. Martini is worse than I thought.
45 posted on 11/23/2002 5:27:50 PM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus
Sounds like you are making things up as you go along. Not that I'm surprised or anything.
46 posted on 11/23/2002 6:23:33 PM PST by Republican Wildcat
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To: Coleus
This is very upsetting. Why isn't the RTL making a big deal of it?
47 posted on 11/23/2002 6:26:34 PM PST by WaveThatFlag
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To: Coleus
I hope you ask God's forgiveness for impugning people you don't even know, for criticizing Bush, who has already saved lives, yet you want to deal in hypotheticals. The Lord said "tomorrow has enough trouble unto itself."

You've shown me you aren't really concerned about the number of unborn who are saved, but making some political point.

48 posted on 11/23/2002 6:36:11 PM PST by LS
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To: LS
I've shown that bush is a liar, went back on his word and surreptitiously appointed 5 abortionists to the federal bench in NJ. If he had half a brain, and stood by his so-called religious/life convictions, he would have appointed nobody until Corzine and Torricelli acquiesced. Amen.
49 posted on 11/23/2002 6:55:37 PM PST by Coleus
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To: Coleus
You've shown that all you care about is an "issue," not reality. Reality is that Bush, true to his word, has actually saved lives. The more you rant, the clearer it becomes that you have no real concern at all for the unborn, or you would be praising Bush who---UNLIKE REAGAN---actually saved lives.
50 posted on 11/24/2002 6:21:04 AM PST by LS
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