Posted on 11/25/2002 5:30:08 PM PST by AFA-Michigan
Edited on 05/07/2004 7:09:09 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
PONTIAC -- Republicans young and old shouted at one another. Fire alarms were set off twice to disrupt voting. In the thick of the fray, a man tried vainly to call order by tapping his ChapStick like a gavel.
That was the scene at last week's raucous Oakland County Republican Convention, as GOP stalwarts fought over what most Metro Detroiters will regard as a novel concept: County Executive L. Brooks Patterson is too liberal.
(Excerpt) Read more at detnews.com ...
This type of thinking shows a level of political naivete and self-destructiveness that has harmed conservatives for years. The idea that one should not suggest that the conservative ideas are the middle of the spectrum - that conservatives are by definition a fringe - is silly. That one would admit to not knowing what she is talking about, but wants to be rid of a proven, very conservative vote-getter and party builder like Brooks Patterson because he dared suggest that the GOP should try to get lots of votes, is very disappointing.
The idea that one should not suggest that the conservative ideas are the middle of the spectrum - that conservatives are by definition a fringe - is silly.I agree with this thought. The reality is that McMillan is closer to the center than Patterson. The fact that conservatives let conservatism be portrayed as being out of the mainstream is part of our problem. Being a liberal is portrayed as being moderate and normal; being a conservative is portrayed as being neanderthal, regressinve, and fringe. But most people oppose abortion on demand. Most people want to be able to protect themselves. Most people do not want to pay a lot in taxes. Most people don't want homosexual couples to be as prevalent as heterosexual couples.
We aren't the fringe. They are. And it is silly to act differently and when we accept that language we lose.
For example, Oakland County GOP chair Brooks Patterson and the left-wing homosexual Triangle Foundation co-hosted a news conference last year to attack the Republican Legislature for not adding "sexual orientation" to Michigan's "hate crimes" law.
Tom McMillin's position on that issue is the same as President Bush's and a majority of the Congress, plus Gov. Engler and a majority of the Legislature, plus the GOP national platform.
Patterson's position is far to the left of the mainstream on this issue, yet Renneslaer (must be a closet member of the news media, who've perfected this art) portrays Patterson as the mainstream conservative and McMillin as out on the fringe.
Gee, I guess I missed the media coverage of Brooks Patterson calling for a public debate on the topic of man-boy sex. I eagerly await your proof of this.
"Last year, while serving as county GOP chair, (Patterson) co-hosted a news conference with the Triangle Foundation, a far-left homosexual activist GROUP, to attack the Republican Legislature and Gov. Engler for failing to add "sexual orientation" to Michigan's "hate crime" law. This is a GROUP that recently called for a public debate on 'intergenerational sex,' their euphemism for adult-child sex (but they're not too radical for GOP chairman Patterson)."
Upon second reading, I'm sure you'll see that what I said was that it was this GROUP (the Triangle Foundation) -- not Patterson -- who called for a public debate on "intergenerational sex." The fact that Patterson would publicly align himself with such radicals lays waste any outdated claim he may have to being "conservative."
As to proof re: Triangle's stance on "intergenerational sex," here ya go:
CREDO
News for Catholic and other Christians
Ann Arbor, Michigan
December 3, 2001
GAY RIGHTS DEBATED
Photo: In their debate over gay-rights legislation, Gary Glenn, president of the Michigan chapter of the American Family Association, and Triangle Foundation Executive Director Jeff Montgomery discuss their views on the age of majority. Montgomery refused to say he disagreed with efforts of radical homosexuals to lower the age of majority so that older men may legally have sex with teens.
ROCHESTER, Mi. -- In a debate with American Family Association’s Gary Glenn over the necessity of gay-rights legislation, gay-rights activist Jeff Montgomery refused to give a particular age when asked what the legal age of consent should be for boys to have sex with men. Montgomery said simply, “We need recognize that young people have a voice in this discussion and we should listen to young people when we are having it.”
The debate, entitled “Sexual Orientation Non-Discrimination Laws: Are They Needed or Not?” took place Nov. 12 at Oakland University in Rochester, only a week after homosexual activists claimed victory at the ballot box in three area cities: Huntington Woods, Kalamazoo and Traverse City.
Montgomery, executive director of the Triangle Foundation, Michigan’s largest gay-rights activist organization, and Glenn, president of AFA of Michigan, were on the front lines of those battles, but this was their first face-to-face debate.
The arguments put forth at the debate varied very little from those that have been heard in the media for the past few months. But new ground was broken when the opponents had the opportunity to ask each other a question.
Glenn brought up the European discussion of “intergenerational” sex that is making its way into the U.S.
“Britain is in the process of lowering the age of consent to 16, it’s even lower than that in some of the other European countries,” Glenn said. “What does the Triangle Foundation believe the age of consent for sexual relations between adults and minors to be?”
In his response, Montgomery declined to mention any specific age, saying that it “is a very realistic question today.”
“We are living in a society that needs a great deal more discussion about sex in general,” he said. “It’s a good debate (intergenerational sex) to have and one I hope everyone can participate in.”
Approximately 100 people attended the debate, the majority of them non-student gay-rights supporters.
Original article online at:
http://www.credopub.com/archives/2001/iss20011203/20011203p05.htm
(Since I was a participant in the debate reported above, I also have a tape recording of the "intergenerational sex" exchange. Montgomery is the very guy with whom Patterson held a news conference to blast the Republican Legislature.)
Proof enough?
“Isn’t the problem really in Oakland County, I’m going to turn things around, Brooks Patterson?
"He goes around bashing everybody in the party in Oakland County who doesn’t agree with him and frankly, I think he’s been a disaster as a Chairman.
"You don’t want a chairman like that...Brooks Patterson has gone around with a club, and he asked for what he got. He was an accident waiting to happen on your convention night.
“And by the way, (Auburn Hills Councilman Tom McMillin) was a big success on election night, November 5th. Tom McMillin knocked off an incumbent Democrat County Commissioner.
"How is the right wing supposedly, if that is what it is in Oakland County, such a bad thing? Sounds like they did pretty well.
Full video and audio of entire broadcast available at:
http://wkar.org/offtherecord/current/index.php
Well, I'm sorry, but you do tend to go on and on...
"...county GOP chair Patterson co-hosted a news conference with the Triangle Foundation, a far-left homosexual activist GROUP... This is a GROUP that recently called for a public debate on 'intergenerational sex,' their euphemism for adult-child sex (but they're not too radical for GOP chairman Patterson)."
Now wait a minute. Brooks Patterson had a newsconference with a guy who, according to CREDO (snicker)made an outlandish statement advocating a public discussion about "intergenerational sex." So, therefore, you're attributing the same sentiment to Brooks Patterson? If that ISN'T what you intended, why did you mention it at all? Here, I'll do you one better. Phyllis Schlafley's son is gay. You support Phyllis. Therefore, you are gay. Neato! I like this game of yours! Can we do Dick Cheney's daughter next?
As to proof re: Triangle's stance on "intergenerational sex," here ya go:
CREDO <----nutbucket vanity rag that no one ever read and finally folded this year because it lost so much money
December 3, 2001
GAY RIGHTS DEBATED
Photo: In their debate over gay-rights legislation, Gary Glenn, president of the Michigan chapter of the American Family Association, and Triangle Foundation Executive Director Jeff Montgomery discuss their views on the age of majority. Montgomery refused to say he disagreed with efforts of radical homosexuals to lower the age of majority so that older men may legally have sex with teens.
I'm gonna go slightly off topic and ask WHAT efforts are radical homosexuals making to lower the age of majority? Are they lobbying state legislatures? Wooing governors to their cause? Handing out petitions in malls? Is there some massive phone-and-fax campaign going on? If they are, then the gays are failing miserably in this task. Okay, back to the show:
ROCHESTER, Mi. -- In a debate with American Family Association’s Gary Glenn over the necessity of gay-rights legislation, gay-rights activist Jeff Montgomery refused to give a particular age when asked what the legal age of consent should be for boys to have sex with men. Montgomery said simply, “We need recognize that young people have a voice in this discussion and we should listen to young people when we are having it.”
FINALLY, I see how you came to your Brooks-supports-talking-about-pedophilia statement. A reporter asked Jeff Montgomery his opinion as to the age of consent, and Montgomery didn't answer, other than to say that, when discussed, that topic should include the viewpoint of minors. Ergo, in your words: "This is a group that recently called for a public debate on "intergenerational sex,"... but they're not too radical for GOP chairman Patterson.
I think it's a stretch to link Brooks to this topic, don't you? First, it's a stupid subject. Age of consent laws aren't going anywhere and no one is actively calling for them to be lowered. (At least not north of the Mason-Dixon line. Or doesn't it count if the young lady in question is also your cousin.) I once had sex with a 17 year old girl. I was 17 at the time. Obviously, my opinions on that topic would be far different back then, than now, so I agree that minors have an instant-bias and don't have the maturity to weigh-in on this topic. (Of course Texas will execute that same immature 17 year old if he commits murder, but that's another thread.)
Proof enough?
No, I still think that you aren't fit to polish Brooks' shoes. Worse, even though AFA and I share the same views on a couple of issues, I think that, in Michigan, you guys are the kiss of death for any subject you get involved with. I mean, damn, guy, you lost Traverse City. Sheesh! Let's all hope you don't do an anti-gay proposal in Mississippi. Tupelo would probably become the next Provincetown for gay vacationers.
1. The homosexual activist group Triangle Foundation is so radical that, among its multitude of other left-wing stands, it called for a public debate on the issue of "intergenerational sex" (euphemism for adult-child sex)...as reported by the conservative Catholic publication CREDO, as tape-recorded by Oakland University, as witnessed by yours truly.
2. As radically left-wing as this group is, county GOP chair Brooks Patterson has no qualms about co-hosting news conferences with them to publicly attack the GOP legislature for failing to support the homosexual agenda.
Just my opinion, but I think this lays waste any claim of his being "conservative" in today's arena.
Don't worry. We won't be signing up to shine Patterson's shoes any time soon, and we'll leave kissing his feet to you and Renneslaer.
As with all political struggles, you win some and you lose some. In Oakland County -- the locale at issue -- AFA-Michigan and Tom McMillin won ballot campaigns to defeat so-called "gay rights" ordinances in both liberal Ferndale (51% majority) and Royal Oak (68%), in the latter despite "conservative" GOP chairman Patterson's having joined homosexual activists (once again) in endorsing the ordinance.
With Patterson at the helm, Oakland County voted for Gore and for the Demo candidate for governor this year. And the supposedly inconsequential McMillin left Brooks looking for his jock. From a Repub standpoint, surely it's time for new leadership that can actually get the job done.
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