England has worst crime rate in world

Telegraph, U.K. ^ | 01/12/2002 | David Bamber

[ElkGroveDan]

England and Wales have the highest crime rate among the world's leading economies, according to a new report by the United Nations.

The survey, which is likely to prove embarrassing to David Blunkett, the Home Secretary. shows that people are more likely to be mugged, burgled, robbed or assaulted here than in America, Germany, Russia, South Africa or any other of the world's 20 largest nations. Only the Dominican Republic, New Zealand and Finland have higher crime rates than England and Wales.

According to the comparison of international crime statistics produced by the UN's Office for Drug Control and Crime Prevention, England and Wales had 9,766 crimes for every 100,000 people in the year 2000. America had 8,517, South Africa 7,997, Germany 7,621 and Russia 2,022.

During the period 1998-2000, Britain went from fifth to fourth worst in the world league table. An analysis of total recorded crime figures before 1998 also suggests that England and Wales have moved sharply up the league table since Labour came to power in 1997. Crimes fell from 5.5 million in 1993 to 4.5 million in 1997. By 1999, total crimes had risen again to 5.3 million.

Last night Oliver Letwin, the shadow home secretary, said: "This does rather blow a hole in David Blunkett's claim that New Labour has crime under control. It is a damning picture."

The UN reports also shows that England and Wales are the second-worst places in the world for assaults, with 851 people assaulted per 100,000, and seventh for burglaries and car theft, with 1,579 burglaries per 100,000 population.

Criminologists believe that a note of caution needs to be introduced into analysis of the data, because of the different ways in which UN member countries record crimes.

A Home Office spokesman said that officials had not yet seen the report and so could not comment.

[ElkGroveDan]

Must be a mistake in reporting. Guns are totally banned in England, so we know that they've done away with crime.

[Pearls Before Swine]

That might not be the only mistake. New Zeland and Finland are, according to this article, supposed to be even worse. That doesn't sound right to me.

[NEWwoman]

Gun issue aside, aren't Britians in great peril from prosecution of the government if they attempt to defend themselves from criminals, period?

Criminals prey on the weak and helpless and the British government is a genious in ensuring everyone is weak and helpless.

[yankeedame]

Higher than in South Africa? Cheeze louise...!

[RANGERAIRBORNE]

This is not surprising if you have read Anthony Dalrymple's extremely depressing book, "LIFE AT THE BOTTOM".It is directed at the breakdown of civilization in the UK due to the welfare state, but has a chapter on crime in New Zealand that is a real eye-opener.

I heartily recommend reading this book before you set up a trip to the UK or New Zealand.

[proxy_user]

I have read this book. However, I still cannot believe there is five times more crime in England than in Russia. These official statistics must be BS.

[xlib]

Not only is crime up in England, the criminals are bolder. 53% of burgaries in England occur while the vicim is at home. By contrast, only 13% of US burglars strike while the victim is at home. They can argue that other factors affect the overall crime rate, but it's clear that the likelihood of armed resistance is the reason for the relative timidity of American burglars.

[samtheman]

All of Western Europe is playing the "lie about crime statistics" game. If the truth were fairly published, England wouldn't be the worst, just as bad as all the rest. In France, police ignore criminals to keep the arrest rates down.

[beaversmom]

Britain will just have to establish some more gun laws--it's obvious they just don't have enough.

[BenLurkin]

[aristeides]

Times sure have changed. When I studied in England 1972-4, it seemed extremely safe compared to the States.

[beaversmom]

I've heard Britain does some tinkering with the crime statistics.

[aristeides]

I think police departments in this country played the same statistical games under Clinton.

[SamAdams76]

Pick up practically any Charles Dickens novel (i.e. Oliver Twist) and you will see that grinding poverty and high crime rates are nothing new to England. I think that the lack of guns definitely emboldens criminals wherever stringent gun control laws are in place, but much of urban England has been a cesspool for centuries.

[beaversmom]

I don't know much about New Zealand, but I'm surprised that they have so much crime. I pictured it as just a really green country with lots of sheep--shows what I know.

[Neil E. Wright]

BANG and BUMP!

±
Toward FREEDOM

[beaversmom]

I think you are right. I did a little reading on the internet about Jack the Ripper. The area in which he committed his dirty deeds was terribly impoverished--morally and financially.

[pabianice]

Another 'gun control' success story...

[general_re]

Only the Dominican Republic, New Zealand and Finland have higher crime rates than England and Wales.

Oops. Well, when Clark lets NZ society get a bit too 'Clockwork Orange'-ish, the backlash will be inevitable, I suppose... ;)

[Doctor Raoul]

AIN'T GUN CONTROL WONDERFUL?

[The Iguana]

I spent all of '94 there - mostly in Wellington - and I did not perceive a large crime problem. I could walk Wellington's worst streets at night without any fear.

But perhaps a lot can change in 8 years.

[FreePaul]

Gun laws are only a symptom of the problem in the UK. The real problem is an attitude of too many that any self defense is an assault on the criminal and should be prosecuted.

Several years ago an acquaintance in England was assaulted by two thugs trying to rob him (he resisted), one with a knife, one with a razor blade. He ended up having around five hundred stitches. In the struggle he managed to stab one of the thugs in the leg with the knife while it was still in the thugs hand. He ended up being tried (and acquitted) for assaulting the robber. Really a deterrent to crime.

[Shooter 2.5]

After the Jack the Ripper murders slowed down, one victim with multiple stab wounds was written down as a suicide.

After Oak Park, Illinois banned guns, a guy tried to break into my neighbor's house through a basement door. When the lady was alerted to the noise by a family pet, she called the police and the police just let the guy go because he claimed he was looking for his cousin.
Throught a basement door at 2:00 AM. Yeah, sure.

[cynicom]

That is what is causing the rise. Homeowners are becoming criminals by resisting home intrusions etc. They should know by now that they must not resist.

[beaversmom]

It's hard to believe that the English would be that stupid but it's also hard to believe that 50 percent of the people voting in the U.S.2000 election voted for Al Gore. We don't need a war on crime--we need a war on stupid people.

[Jakarta ex-pat]

When I was back in the uk this year, my nephew related he story of when he visited a cashpoint in London.

"Hey Nike"

Nephew ignores and keeps on walking.

"Hey Nike give us a tenner" (nephew is wearing a Nike t-shirt)

Nephew keeps on walking.

Withinn 10 minutes, my nephew, approximately 25, enters a cafe and is reminded "I aint leaving till you give me 50 quid"

To cut a long story short, he gave the perp 30 quid ($50) and the perp left.

My sister (who I love very much), thinks her son did the right thing.

And before everyone states what they would have done, I would like to remind everyone he is happily alive.

However, this isn't a gun issue.

This government, and successive governments(including Maggie Thatcher's) chose this route.

The decision to diversify Britain, as one head of the BBC called Hideously White ,has proven to be a disaster of titanic proportions.

Unfortunately, the question remaining is not if the ship goes down, but when.

[freedumb2003]

That might not be the only mistake. New Zeland and Finland are, according to this article, supposed to be even worse. That doesn't sound right to me.

I sort of agree. I suspect this is done by similar self-haters in England as the liberals we have here. As long as things are "bad" them there is even more of a reason to need yet MORE paternal government. Its the game they play here, and I suspect they are playing it there to a T.

Remember: There are lies, damn lies, and statistics.

[Man of the Right]

This is a prime example of misinterpreting statistics. In crime-ridden areas, people don't report crimes and the police don't tally them.

[Fiddlstix]

Must be a mistake in reporting. Guns are totally banned in England, so we know that they've done away with crime.

Yep!

[TC Rider]

(I posted this on another UK thread earlier today)

We just got back from a 2 week UK vacation. What a sorry situation.

Our first day in London, while eating dinner, we caught an 'immigrant' with his hand in my wife's purse. I threatened to cut him, if he didn't depart hastily and he was dumbfounded. I gathered they are not used to victims fighting back. This was in South Kensington, a supposed 'good' area, near a tube stop. We did look for a cop on the street after dinner and never spotted one in the neighborhood the entire 5 days we stayed there. (I took my Benchmade Griptillian folder with me and carried it the entire time in my back pocket. I did not show it to the lowlife with his hand in my wife's purse, but was prepared to..)

Everywhere in London there are posters warning the 'sheep' to watch their bags and belongings, but none warning the miscreants of the consequences of their actions.

There are posters everywhere warning the population against verbally or physically assaulting minorities, immigrants, women, gays and other protected groups. This is now considered a serious crime.

BTW, by recent decree of Parliament, homosexuals are now known officially as 'those attracted to those of the same sex'.

Things were better outside of London, but the thought-crime posters are everywhere. Overall we had a good time, but I doubt we would ever go back.

Oddly enough, we found the people in Paris more open and friendly when we visited there, 5 years ago.

I may decide to post a new thread about all of my observations while there.

[bat1816]

You think they do...I know they do. There are several well-sourced books available that illustrate the disparity of crime rates among races in the US. That, of course is a huge sore spot for liberals. But don't worry, they've taken steps to ensure crime rates are evened out...at least according to "official" statistics.

It's well known that blacks are in the highest crime rate, Hispanics in the middle, and whites below them. So to correct the huge gap between black and white the Federal Department of Immigration and Naturalization Service now does interesting things with crime statistics (actually it's been done for several years now.)

When an illegal alien (most commonly of Mexican descent) commits a crime such as auto theft, robbery, assault, etc. that person is not identified as Hispanic, but rather as white. Conversely, if the victim is an illegal alien of Mexican descent, that person is correctly identified as Hispanic, not white. It's merely a numbers game. In effect, white crime rates become wildly inflated.

[Age of Reason]

I wonder how closely the increase of third-world immigration to England would correlate with England's rising crime rate.

Looks like diversity at work, if you ask me.

[Ditter]

Hey Shaggy your country is being maligned.

[Age of Reason]

Pick up practically any Charles Dickens novel (i.e. Oliver Twist) and you will see that grinding poverty and high crime rates are nothing new to England.

Errr, you always base your views on "facts" found in works of fiction?

[Ditter]

bump for shaggy!

[ChadGore]

But, but, but, how can this be ? They've grabbed all the guns and have big brother cameras on every corner! < /sarcasm >

[samtheman]

I think police departments in this country played the same statistical games under Clinton.

All the more reason to keep and bear arms.

[Ditter]

I went to New Zealand last year & your vision is correct. Its a very green country with lots of sheep & not many people. I'm shocked by the crime revelation.

[Bahbah]

"I may decide to post a new thread about all of my observations while there."

That would be very interesting. Please ping me if you do.

[thinktwice]

we need a war on stupid people

Better yet, America could go back to the original U.S. Constitution and ... not permit stupid people to vote.

The Fourteenth and Fifteenth Amendments are the main items needing change.

[bert]

TheThe article is very curious. It did not say Britan, it said England and Wales. Scotland and Northern Ireland are apparently omitted.

one wonders why Scotland was omitted? Could it be to reduce the statistic /100,000?

[Jakarta ex-pat]

And as for your other comments, I don't believe it's a matter of color per se, but of the incompatability of certain cultures to rub along together. If a typical black mugger in London had been brought up by a typical English middle-class family he would almost certainly not be a mugger.

Thanks for the response.

I'll just concentrate on these statements.

First, I didn't state that the perp was black (though he was).

Secondly you mention if he had been brought up "a typical English middle class family"

Two things spring to mind here.

First, I was brought up a very much British working class family, but I believe I have been taught right right from wrong (that doesnt' mean I am or have ever been goody two-shoes).

Secondly, If he were brought up "by a typical English middle-class family", then he would be a Brit, right?

The guy who "mugged" my nephew is as much a "Brit" as my wife.

[ricpic]

Ang em in the public square I sez guvner. Blimey, ang em from the ighest yardahm while yer at it. That'll smarten up the lower orders guvner. Teach em respect it will. Bloody divels.

[Age of Reason]

At the end of the nineteenth century, some English politicians desiring a tightening of England's gun laws (which were then VERY lax) researched how many people were murdered in England by hand guns.

They found that something like three people in all of Britain had been murdered by hand guns in the preceeding year.

But it's not gun laws or their lack that has much to do with England's crime--it's the demoralization of society, which is abetted by the introduction of "diversity."

You soon end up with a population whose only common denominator of social prestige is not honor--but raw money.

And any means that gains someone more, becomes excusable.

Like we've become.

[PatrioticAmerican]

They also have the worst "food".

[Hal.009]

The "tinkering" you mention consists of downgrading crimes (calling a burgulary simple vandalism, and mugging and rape reduced to minor assault), the english police also classifying multiple crimes as a "single crime" (if four apartments broken into they make one report of the incident, four people robbed... one report) and they have gotten to the point where they now "refuse to take a crime report on assaults and muggings".

The mayor of Atlanta Georgia perfected this last tatic. We had a rental truck broken into in front of our hotel in Atlanta. We needed a police report for the insurance and two different police officers refused to write a report. We were told to "phone it in".

After three calls and an hour and a half on hold the lady reluctantly took the report. I found out later that the new practice of "no reports" lowered the citys crime rate since no report, no crime.

[Age of Reason]

Doesn't Japan have low crime despite tough gun laws?

How diverse is Japan?

(Strangely, I have heard that the crime rate among Japanese Americans is about the same as for Japanese living in Japan.)

Could criminal behavior be genetic?