Old And In The Way (Decline and Fall of Europe)

American Enterprise Magazine ^ | December 2002 | Karl Zinsmeister

[Nick Danger]

I think you're half right. I didn't see the lack of mention of Russia as an issue. Russia is imploding demographically even more rapidly than Europe is. According to Pravda, "the Russian population can be expected to drop to 25 million people in 100 years." Their birth rate is not just low, it is in free-fall decline. My personal belief is that Russia cannot maintain its territorial integrity with that going on; its vast geography almost begs for invasion from China or elsewhere. Whether that is done militarily, or simply by immigration and propagation, almost doesn't matter. The result will be the same: a "Bigger China" where a lot of Russia is now.

I was as surprised as you were that Zinsmeister did not mention the "Islamization" of Europe. The population implosion among ethnic Europeans is not occurring in a vaccum. One might even argue that the undemocratic nature of the EU machinery is an attempt to forestall an inevitable imposition of Islamic law -- via popular vote -- in European countries. By surrendering sovereignty to an unelected bureaucracy, the "elites" can perhaps maintain some power over their lives while their countries slowly devolve into Islamic Republics.

[kitkat]

bump

[Podkayne]

One final comment. The UK is at one of the great crossroads of her history. She's going to have to choose between EUrope and America. Which way she chooses determines her future, if she is to have one.

This same statement was made on CNN intl yesterday by the French delegate to the EU in a 4-way conversation with the German and British delegates and the CNN moderator. The Brit was very relaxed and young and affable and didn't need to point out that the Brits will do as they will in their own self interests without making 90 degree course corrections.

Another elephant in the living room: Fundamentalist and proseletyzing Christianity is outlawed in France and to a degree in Germany. Baptists aren't allowed to seek converts and standard American run of the mill "christian" lifestyle is near illegal and frowned upon.

Breakdown the barrier to fundamental christian renewal in both protestant and catholic traditions and you will see the rebirth of Europe. Otherwise all you will have is Medieval oppression without the Christian overtones. Ditto for Vatican organization - self censorship in Europe and Canada and propaganda distribution is at an all time high.

[Mamzelle]

A great read, but he does not take into account the flood of Muslim immigration into Europe, which will easily overcome the impact that distaste for childbearing has had on Euro-pop. Old Europe will then be a threat to us, perhaps within a couple of decades, because it will be Dar al Islam.

Or, perhaps it won't be an Islamic threat for awhile. Beating up on the native Euros will keep the new immigrants busy for awhile.

What a charming thought.

[longjack]

Thanks, tictoc.

German bump

longjack

[Friend of thunder]

[tictoc]

Only a week ago I saw a French poster on another discussion board reminisce -- seriously! -- about the good old days when the court of Charlemagne (today's France and Germany) maintained cordial relations with the caliph Haroun al-Rashid in Baghdad, exchanging emissaries bearing gifts.

Many French are so deluded, it isn't funny. In their minds, the counterweight to U.S. power will be French brains, German engineering, Arab manpower, and Gulf oil money.

To them, this notion is entirely sane.

[Southack]

"I was as surprised as you were that Zinsmeister did not mention the "Islamization" of Europe. The population implosion among ethnic Europeans is not occurring in a vaccum. One might even argue that the undemocratic nature of the EU machinery is an attempt to forestall an inevitable imposition of Islamic law -- via popular vote -- in European countries. By surrendering sovereignty to an unelected bureaucracy, the "elites" can perhaps maintain some power over their lives while their countries slowly devolve into Islamic Republics."

I'm still unconvinced that those events are related. It might just be that Old Europe is on a fool's errand to have its United States of Europe counter-weight to the U.S.A., while simultaneously it is being filled by Islamic immigrants who want to take advantage of its welfare, relative standard of living, and moral vaccum.

[pepsionice]

Probably the one article a year that stands as a legendary piece of work.

There is no doubt about the European mentality sinking off into the sunset. In May 2005, the US base closure list will arrive...and most of the 70k troops in Germany are leaving. My guess is that we will try to leave two or three installations in Germany (Ramstein is one)...but the German parliament will ask that they all leave. And by 2006...we will be gone from Germany...and the new beginning will start. The Germans and France have troubled economies...and no one to blame but themselves...and this is when the riots will start in the streets. What they have done...is their own handiwork...and they can face the task ahead alone. We came when called in 1918 and 1942...but we need not rush back for another episode...let them discover what values we have on relationships.

[pepsionice]

One of the fascinating things about the German moral argument about the war...less than 5 percent of German population go to church on a regular basis. While 50 percent may go around Easter or Christmas...the bulk of society simply pay their state-required church tax and never say a word (if you don't pay, you can't get married in the church or have a church funeral...so they all pay for nothing). Whatever moral argument they are digging up...its nothing to do with Christian values...or they'd have to say something about Saddam's killing of his own people (but they'd never do that). The only values they appear to be choosing...are leftist social values...which appear to be in the losing column.

[longjack]

I just saw a report from the dpa that Merkel has said the US would fail if they tried to run Iraq without the UN. Evidently she took too much of a hit in the polls with he US stance.

I agree with what you say. The US and Germany are no longer allies.

longjack

[Michael81Dus]

Ok, pack your things and go.

[Michael81Dus]

You´re kidding.
1. The German parliament will not call the US troops to leave unless America declares war on my nation.

2. I agree, in 2006 we will have a restart: (lately) in that year, the German parliament will vote a new Chancellor. A Chancellor who is member of a party that stood always at Americas side.

3. How do you define riots? people demontrating against the economy policy? That´s what we had already.
Riots in the sense of violant, aggressive demonstrations? No. That won´t happen.

[Michael81Dus]

How can YOU say that? You should know better.

[Anamensis]

I heard the following joke attributed to Bono (meaning even a commie can see what's up here).

An American and an Irishman are walking down a road together and they come upon a huge, beautiful house.

The American says "Someday I'm going to own this house!"

The Irishman says "Someday I'm going to get the bastard who lives in this house."

That is the difference between Americans and Europeans. It says it all, IMHO.

[longjack]

I consider Germany as I do France and Russia. I don't think they are allies.

longjack

[edsheppa]

Russia is going to be just as badly off as the rest.

As for Muslim immigration, the Euros are bigots. There's a good a chance that they'll slam the doors on it, maybe even expel some of their "guests."

What worries me that the author didn't mention is that there are three nuclear nations in Europe. Of course that will come to mean less as time goes on.

[tictoc]

LOL

[Brian Allen]

<< I heard the following joke attributed to Bono. [Meaning even a commie can see what's up here]

An American and an Irishman are walking down a road together and they come upon a huge, beautiful house.

The American says "Someday I'm going to own this house!"

The Irishman says "Someday I'm going to get the bastard who lives in this house."

That is the difference between Americans and Europeans. It says it all, IMHO. >>

Scary, eh?

But no need to go so far and find an Irishman? Start with a Canadian and a Mexican. That's my experience of the difference between an American and the rest of the world.

Please God we begin to appreciate that simple fact.

Though not to care.

Best ones -- Brian

[Anamensis]

Don't even get me started on Canadians. I had a Canadian roommate once. He's buried in the backyard now.

Well, if I had my way he would be.