Jobs come and go, and sometimes they just go

Seattle Post Intelligencer ^ | December 26, 2002 | BILL VIRGIN

[RLK]

Whaen the forum ctivity level incrases in the morning the free-trade kooks wil come on the thread to tell us these are buggy whip industries that should be exported while the displaced workers should become high level investment bankers talking to each other over telephones.

[freeper12]

I have the same opinion of companies that move there jobs overseas as I do for people that smoke...I know in the long run its not going to be good for us, but not sure I want to pass any laws to prevent it. After all, it is supposed to be a free country. Unfortunatgely, I do agree that in the not-so-long term this movement of jobs overseas is eventiually going hurt us real bad (worse than it has already).

Afterall, when all those jobs are overseas, who do these companies think is going to be left to buy there products?

[RLK]

Afterall, when all those jobs are overseas, who do these companies think is going to be left to buy there products?

----------------------

Bingo!

[waterstraat]

Pat Buchannan and Ross Perot did not get very many votes, and still would not get very many. Those 2 were the strongest supporters of American jobs, and who were against NAFTA, etc.

I dont think most people care that Americans are going to lose all of our manufacturing and technical jobs.

[Mr. Jeeves]

Kaiser Aluminum last week announced a deal to sell its Tacoma Tideflats smelter to the Port of Tacoma, which will likely flatten it to use the site as a container terminal; that smelter once employed more than 350 workers.

How many will the container terminal employ? Given the salraies earned by ILWU longshoremen ($80K+) this could be a net gain for the local economy.

[NewLand]

"He [Buchanan] was sent in by the Republicans to destroy the Reform Party."

Better watch out for those black helicopters over your house right now...

This 1960's mentality of "everything is a conspiracy" is boring. Get a new act.

[gcruse]

Unions and their goons drive up the cost of their labor to the point it becomes more productive to have it done out of the country. Then they wonder why their jobs go away. Funny how it works.

[DoctorHydrocal]

Keywords in article:

"steelworker"
"miner"
"lumber mill"
"smelter"

Key quote:

Jobs come and go, companies come and go, industries come and go; that's one of the hazards of living in a system with a certain degree of economic freedom. They come and go for reasons too timeless to call a trend -- the business cycle, bad or short-sighted management, changing technology or customer tastes, depletions or shifts in raw material supplies.

Could government play a huge role in why jobs come and go? Specifically government regulation in the environmental area?

Let's face it; the United States and particularly liberal Democrats want to kick the steel, mining, logging, and smelting industries to the curb. To anyone with money, the local steel mill, surface mine, sawmill, or smelter is a bad neighbor that could just as easily exist in a foreign country. NIMBYism and its government attendant are hammering many of the nails into the coffin of America's basic industries.

[dtel]

As much as I would like to blast the simplicity of your remarks, I will instead direct my attention to said article.
I think the article is spot on and is really a remarkable piece of journalism in this day and age, when everyone has an agenda.
It speaks of the jobs going away, and speaks of the unintended consequences should we try to artificially retain these jobs.
America is staring a neutron bomb dead in the eyes.
You idle the greater middle class, by unemployment or even more importantly underemployment, and you begin to introduce doubt into the great American experiment/dream.
You introduce too great of a degree of doubt and negative things can result.
I would say one only has to spend a little time in an inner city slum, and not only will you see the doubt, but you can actually feel it.
To transport this feeling and anger to the middle class would be nothing short of national suicide.

[gcruse]

"steelworker"
"miner"
"lumber mill"
"smelter"

Revisit DoctorHydrocal's  Keywords in the article.

What they have in common is not only environmental  exposure,
but heavily unionized work forces..  

The people who put up the money and take the risk making
jobs possible have government imposing ever-increasing
environmental regulations on them on one side while on the
other side, corrupt labor unions drive wages ever higher to
satisfy the hungers of the Mafia.  Hillary Clinton's virtual
queen-hood over the laborer's union isn't an anomaly.

Excessive taxation drives companies offshore while those who stay
export jobs to remain in business in the international competitive community.
It really isn't that difficult to understand.

[dtel]

It isn't that hard to understand. And as you clearly indicate, it feeds off itself.
Now it has crept up to the average middle income family and after it consumes the middle class, it will move on up the food chain until it collapses upon itself.
We, as Americans, think we have stepped in the way and have for the first time in my lifetime elected the pubbies to control all three branches of gov.
This is an attempt to stop the ball from rolling downhill and gathering momentum, if this fails, what are the recourses left?
This is why these issues are important and will decide the future destiny of the country.

[nanny]

Unions and their goons drive up the cost of their labor to the point it becomes more productive to have it done out of the country. Then they wonder why their jobs go away. Funny how it works.

This union bashing makes some feel good - but it is not true. Are you trying to tell everyone that every job we have lost is a union job? Of course not. Also, I am amazed at the huge salaries that are quoted for union jobs.

While the union did have something to do with work going overseas, that argument is way outdated and overexaggerated.

Try greed, corporate and political. Try government involvement in this debacle. Try the government uses our tax dollars to grease the way for these companies to move overseas.

The old "union is to blame for all our problems" is years out of date.

[gcruse]

As Mark Steyn (?) quoted Fred Reed in one of Steyn's articles, freedom is its own destruction. That is, it promotes the human tendencies towards self-interest and larceny. In time, it may be necessary to tear everything down and reset government back to 1776. Ballots are supposed to allow us to do that, but as the rape and pillaging of the Tenth Amendment proves, ballots are not effective when the only viable political parties place power above restraint.

[gcruse]

Look at the types of industry in the article. These are unionized industries.

[nanny]

Look at the types of industry in the article. These are unionized industries.

As the article did point out certain industries - I got the gist of the article as the sheer number of jobs being lost and not replaced. Now once again, not all jobs that go overseas is unionized - not by a long shot. Therefore, you cannot lay this at the feet of the evil unions. AS popular as it was a few years ago, it is just outdated.

How do you explain the loss of non-union jobs - what did they do wrong that they deserved to loose their jobs?

[gcruse]

"What did they do wrong to deserve to lose their jobs?"

Forgive me, but I would expect something like that at DU, not here. Capital flow isn't about what someone deserves to be doing with their lives. I began finding myself less employable
when I crossed fifty years of age. Now I am looking at an uplanned, early retirement. My skills never stopped improving yet I am forced out of my industry at the height of my abilities. To use words like 'wrong' and 'deserve' when dealing with marketplace realities is too far to the left for me.

[dtel]

"I began finding myself less employable when I crossed fifty years of age. Now I am looking at an uplanned, early retirement. My skills never stopped improving yet I am forced out of my industry at the height of my abilities. To use words like 'wrong' and 'deserve' when dealing with marketplace realities is too far to the left for me."

I too, find myself in a similar situation and I am in my mid 40's.
I worked very hard at what I did and was quite accomplished, hung a few skins on the wall as they say.
It doesn't matter now, I downsized and am raising some fine Longhorns now. It is a whole lot more fun and the animals are as intelligent or moreso, than 90% of the people I used to work with.