Posted on 02/09/2003 7:23:45 PM PST by An Old Man
Sunday, February 9, 2003
Gun laws a minefield for military
By GORDON DILLOW The Orange County Register
As thousands of U.S. military personnel in California deploy to the Persian Gulf in preparation for war, some of them are having a serious problem.
They can't get guns.
Oh sure, the military provides them with an array of weapons: M-16s, grenade launchers, squad automatic weapons and so on. They're heavily armed.
But a lot of military types, particularly guys in special-operations units, like to supplement some of the standard-issue weaponry with privately purchased handguns and gun-related equipment of their own choosing. Often the handguns and equipment they can buy in the private market are better and more advanced than the standard-issue stuff.
But getting those handguns can be a big problem in California, which has some of the most restrictive gun laws in the nation. Although law enforcement personnel are exempted from many of the restrictions on purchasing firearms, military personnel stationed in California are not - even if they're on their way to a combat zone.
"It's a sad state of affairs," says Evan Carolyn, a former Marine who owns Evan's Gunsmithing and Shooter's World in Orange. "There's no way for us to assist these guys in getting the best stuff they can."
For example, recently some members of a special-operations unit - I'm not supposed to say which unit - told Evan they wanted to buy some compact 9-millimeter handguns as personal backup weapons before they shipped out. Unfortunately, there's a 10-day waiting period for firearms purchases in California - and the unit had to leave before the waiting period was up.
And even if they had bought the handguns, they would have had to make do with 10-round magazines instead of the 13-round magazines the weapons are capable of holding. That's because California law bans the sale of "large capacity" magazines - more than 10 rounds - to anyone but police officers.
"We're seeing this kind of thing all the time," Evan says. "This is how we're treating the military in California."
Spokesmen for the state Attorney General's Office, which regulates firearms sales, told me they were aware of the problem involving military personnel and firearms restrictions - but there's not much they can do about it. Even if he wanted to, the attorney general can't waive any of the statutory restrictions on gun sales - not even for guys headed off to war.
And as for the state Legislature amending the gun laws to exempt military personnel under certain special circumstances - well, don't hold your breath. After all, they're the same guys who passed these silly, ineffective laws in the first place.
So that's the situation we have today in California. Apparently we trust our military personnel to handle tanks, machine guns, missiles, grenades, mortars, howitzers, aircraft carriers, submarines, jets, bombs and nuclear weapons. And after making them wait a week-and-a-half, we even trust them enough to let them buy a handgun that holds ten rounds.
But they'd better not ask for one that holds eleven.
Lol - Sounds like the way I would have handled it, but with my luck -- They would have taken them!
Yeh, all you said is true. I remember how guys used to write home wishing for sidearms during Vietnam, and how unauthorized weapons were confiscated.
The last I heard, no private weapons of any kind were alllowed on the air bases in Commifornia. Maybe elsewhere, I don't know, I just remember the problems & changes at Edwards.
My uncle claimed to have had a jewelled Nazi pin stolen out of his Army mail home during WWII. He said he chased that postmaster all over Germany!
We kept them in our own spaces in our own lockers, not the ship's armory. We were assumed to be armed at all times, no questions asked, with the blessing of our ship captains, who understood we were the best "ship's self defense force" possible. We were ready for short fuse contingencies on a minute by minute basis; as soon as a helicopter could wind up, we could be on it, and armed.
Some regs are meant to be broken. I served in Hawk missile battalions and the techs and system operators were issued service rifles. Some of us liked having side arms that weren't on the official LOE. Just in case.
Of course my day was a whole lot less politically correct than it is now.
True. They used to do it all the time and the prices were good! Nobody batted an eye.
But, that was years ago in another age and another time and what was another country - although the real estate is the same. America has had a sea change in attitudes since then (the 60s) and the military (US government, actually) has been leading the charge!
When I shot them I felt just like Humphrey Bogart.
Of course we had much more 'high tech and up to date' handguns as well, S&W Model 39s with hushpuppies, and some loose old .45s left over from WW2 I think.
No wonder we brought our own pistols!!!
Okay, I'll ask. Why are law enforcement personnel exempted from obeying laws they are suppose to enforce? Why are law enforcement personnel treated any different than any other law-abiding citizen? When did we become a monarchy with princes and dukes who can flaunt the law?
This is complete bull$h!t!
I've got an AWC anphibian wipeless .22 that I took to Beiruit in 83. Very handy unit IYKWIM.
"Regime change" maybe? (I wonder if there's any way we can get Gray Davis to threaten to develop WMDs...)
Roger - this is a goofy article. I agree Kali is The Devil, but arguing that our SOCOM troopers are somehow in grave danger because they don't have enough personal firepower is just misguided.
No SFDET commander would officially permit private weapons - not to say it doesn't happen, but the idea our soldiers -spec ops or otherwise- need to arm up at the local pawn shop is *bass ackwards*.
If they need *more guns* they will get them as the mission requires, complete with 30 round magazines and full auto selector.
Give them a little more time, I think half of Mexico lives in Southern California all ready.
(And if you need one at all.)
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Title XLVI
CRIMES Chapter 790
Weapons And Firearms View Entire Chapter
790.051 Exemption from licensing requirements; law enforcement officers.--Law enforcement officers are exempt from the licensing and penal provisions of this chapter when acting at any time within the scope or course of their official duties or when acting at any time in the line of or performance of duty.
CHAPTER 790
WEAPONS AND FIREARMS
======================
790.001 Definitions.
(8) "Law enforcement officer" means:
(a) All officers or employees of the United States or the State of Florida, or any agency, commission, department, board, division, municipality, or subdivision thereof, who have authority to make arrests;
(b) Officers or employees of the United States or the State of Florida, or any agency, commission, department, board, division, municipality, or subdivision thereof, duly authorized to carry a concealed weapon;
(c) Members of the Armed Forces of the United States, the organized reserves, state militia, or Florida National Guard, when on duty, when preparing themselves for, or going to or from, military duty, or under orders;
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AND if you can produce your DD-214 you don't have to take the CCW course. God, I love the South!
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