The Starship Builders (Speculation on UFO Propulsion methods by Physist)

Stardrive ^ | FR Post 3-15-03 (Article update 1999) | by Kim Burrafato

[vannrox]

Whether you believe in UFO's or not. This is interesting.

[Joe Brower]

[dark_lord]

Another interesting and potentially important propulsion development are the so-called "gravitational shielding" experiments. In these experiments small weights are suspended by extremely sensitive strain gauge devices. Placed closely underneath are rapidly rotating superconducting ceramic discs, which in turn are in a state of levitation due to the superconducting Meissner effect. It has been found in a number of different experiments that a significant fraction of weight is lost from the suspended materials. The effect was first discovered by Tampere University of Technology physicists E. Podkletnov and R. Nieminen, and published in paper entitled "A Possibility of Gravitational Force Shielding by Bulk YBa2Cu307-x Superconductor"(Physica C 203, 1992, pp 441- 444).

Podkletnov later published a second paper with colleague A.D. Levit, "Gravitational Shielding Properties of Composite Bulk YBa2Cu307-x Below 70C Under Electro-magnetic Field"(Tampere University of Technology Report MSU-95 chem, January 1995). This paper provides even stronger evidence for the weight loss effect. In this 2nd experiment, samples of different composition and weight (10-50grams) were placed at distances of 25mm to 1.5 meters from the rotating disk. The resultant mass losses went as high as around 2% -- undeniably a statistically significant amount.

I think a reason NASA is interested in this is that if such an effect is real, then potentially operating it out of a gravity well (e.g. where we send our space probes) means that it might be useful as a propulsion system. That is, something that can appear to reduce weight (it says mass but in reality the samples were weighed) in a zero gravity field might produce "negative" weight - that is, a propulsion effect. As Einstein pointed out, there is no measurable difference between the exposure to a gravitational field and acceleration (the elevator thought experiment.)

[JohnnyZ]

This is easier:

Find it and dig it up!

[Brett66]

Oh boy, this article is old, many things have happened since this has been written. Almost all of them bad. The BPP program at NASA has been terminated for several months, Ning Li pretty much was pulling a scam on NASA scientists and left the program a year or two ago. The studies that were completed of the gravitational shielding discs showed no new phenomenon. The one ray of hope is from Dr.James F. Woodward's devices that he's successfully tested that involve propellantless propulsion. NASA was funding him through the BPP program but that program is no more. I think some companies have taken intertest in his inertial propulsion ideas and are continuing studies on it. That may be for the best anyway, a private company is probably the best way to go about developing this stuff, if there's anything to it. The BPP sure was fun though. :(

Link to more info on Woodward's propulsion testing:

James F. Woodward: Mach's Principle Weight Reduction = Propellantless Propulsion

[boris]

"This new NASA working group adds an exciting dimension to the space program as we head into 21st century. One can only feel encouraged that the agency has chosen to go in this promising direction. It will take the kinds of breakthroughs discussed in this article, and soon to be studied in depth by the NASA working group, to get us to the stars. And one can feel confident that because of this, more startling theoretical and technological breakthroughs lurk right around the corner."

This new NASA working group has been dissolved and Mr. Millis reassigned.

===========================

My comment on "Starship Builders": If any of these schemes were feasible, intelligent aliens would have reduced them to practise thousands of years ago. We should observe their traffic (e.g., massive waves of Cherenkov radiation). We do not. Nor have they landed on the White House lawn and requested a private audience with the interns.

Hence either none of these schemes is feasible or there are no intelligent E.T.'s.

This is a version of the 'Fermi Paradox' (FP) and is easy to construct once you've understood the FP.

If UFOs are cruising our skys from, say, dozens of Starship Building alien cultures, it is curious that all of them are so shy and seem to be fixated on anal probes.

On the other hand, were I a shy alien in a UFO, the best way to appear unobtrusive would be to build my ship in the shape of a 747 and go flying around at 550 mph...

--Boris

[Brett66]

the best way to appear unobtrusive would be to build my ship in the shape of a 747 and go flying around at 550 mph

LOL! But where's the fun in that? I would keep the wierd saucer shape so I could spook people in trailer parks.

[Physicist]

UFO's have various methods of propulsion. Some are propelled by ignorance, some by imagination, some by fear, and some by wishful thinking.

[Hoplite]

Please be outside your residences this evening: a jet will lay a contrail overhead, so wait 15 minutes and then breathe deeply.

I haven't had to do this much damage control since 'Heaven's Gate' somehow got the impression that I was flying around in a vintage De Havilland and was looking for someone to hand out peanuts.

[techcor]

Probes and people will travel across the stars as femtobyte electro-magnetic waves (cosmic rays) ala Rudy Rucker. It's the only way to travel.

[Kerberos]

Bump for later read

[Gary Boldwater]

LOL!!!!

[BenLurkin]

[Jonah Hex]

On the other hand, were I a shy alien in a UFO, the best way to appear unobtrusive would be to build my ship in the shape of a 747 and go flying around at 550 mph...

Yeah, but imagine how cool it would be if you built your ship to resemble a huge black monolith, especially with an external dimension ratio of 1x4x9....

[BenLurkin]

[BenLurkin]

[staytrue]

If any of these schemes were feasible, intelligent aliens would have...

The dinosaurs possessed some level of intelligence for 200 million years and developed no technology that we know of. Intelligence to create technology may be a very rare or even perhaps unique event.

[Frank_Discussion]

Question for you boris: Do we have Cherenkov-detectors placed around the planet, either on it or in near space? If not, perhaps such evidence just hasn't been collected. This is truly something to consider, and I'm asking in all seriousness.

However:

"Nor have they landed on the White House lawn and requested a private audience with the interns."

C'mon. Denegration isn't required here. I participate (lightly) on a YahooGroup that is looking at Alcubierre's work and subsequent refinements, and they are pretty well on track. They take it very seriously, get published, and don't surrender to hype or UFO cults.

That's reminds me of something I noticed about this paper. One of the frequent criticisms of papers that reference the Alcubierre breakthrough is that his idea requires more negative energy than the total (positive) energy of the universe! Certainly a show-stopper. However, the metric-engineering mentioned in the the article is a big focus of refinement of this field, and as researchers/theorists have moved forward new metric treatments have reduced the energy requirements to concievable levels.

My focus is on the engineering aspects of building the equipment involved, but I'm only recently looking into it. What I find interesting is that if the theories are systematically digested, they aren't that hard to understand. Eating the elephant one bite at a time, as it were.

[Dialup Llama]

I really enjoy the Billy Mierer photos. They look soooo much like a pie plate tethered on a string, yet when his followers get on Art Bell they are treated with such deference and are given every benefit of the doubt.

[InterceptPoint]

Wonderful stuff. I just hope I live long enough for this to become real science with a solid theory that is well understood and the experimental data to confirm the theory.