Skip to comments.Disciples of Pope John Paul (Faculty of Gregorian University Gripe About Piety of New Seminarians)
Posted on 04/13/2005 8:24:06 AM PDT by marshmallow
A generation of seminarians expects to continue a conservative approach that was the signature of late pope
ROME - Just as Karol Wojtyla came to Rome to study before taking up a post in his first parish in Poland, so thousands of hand-picked young seminary students and priests from all over the world come to Rome to continue their theological educations.
They are the elite. They may not become pope, as Wojtyla did in 1978, but many will likely go on to become bishops and cardinals, as the schools' graduates have in the past.
And if the graduates stick with their current convictions, the future Roman Catholic Church will likely be as conservative as it has become under John Paul II. This generation of young men is part of his legacy. They are his spiritual and philosophical sons and disciples, and with many, even the introduction into conversation of some of the issues raised by reformist members of the church produce unease sometimes bordering on hostility.
One young deacon, from Ireland, forcefully told a reporter that he didn't think an interview should focus any longer on the issue of condoms and HIV. At another point he demanded that a reporter read back from his notes the deacon's comments about why women should not be ordained as priests.
In interviews with students from Argentina, Germany, Hungary, Switzerland, Angola, Ireland and Sudan over the past few days, eight young men in four colleges spoke almost as one about key topics they will face in their careers: the future direction of the church, the kind of man they would like to see elected pope, and the controversial topics of sexuality, personal morality and the role of women in the church that have many Catholics concerned that traditional stances will alienate existing and potential Catholics.
(Excerpt) Read more at newsday.com ...
Yikes!! Piety in seminarians!!! What a disaster!!!!
It's time for a counter-revolution to throw out all these jokers like the professor.
Since the concept of genuine piety and devotion is foreign to this professor, all piety must be superficial piety. Sheesh.
Amazing, I wonder if he can pick lotto numbers too
Too bad, kind of like the Church keeping it's light under a bushel basket or something...
Kind of a return to piety, kind of a superficial piety, kind of a supercalifragilistic piety. This guy is a maroon.
I think it's rather ironic for a professor at the Greg to make this complaint, when he himself probably has had less contact with parishioners than the typical priest.
That's why it's important for the professors to just teach the concept and the basics, and leave the 'piety' up to the Holy Ghost and it's recipient. If one is going to teach religion, one must realise that piety is real, or at least a desireable option open to some.
Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach.
Maybe suffering form superpiospantheisticheritctheosis.
The JPII legacy grows!
I can't wait until this generation becomes priests. I sent this funny article to my Gregorian seminary deacon friend in Rome. Should prove fruitful for discussion as it is passed throughout the seminary.
Does anyone know specifically what these convictions consist of? I would be curious to know. This is good news.
And this is a problem how?
Santo subito! Giovanni Paolo il Magna!
Based on the negative comments of some of the people quoted in the article I would surmise that the convictions revolve around fidelity to the magisterium and Scripture. If this proves to be true it is indeed good news.
The Greg's faculty has been regarded as less-than-orthodox for quite a while, with the usual exceptions.
There were a bunch of leftovers from Paul VI's reign, and then the inbreeding continued for a while.
I don't know if JPII ever really reversed the direction.
One of my college friends entered the seminary and completed his studies in Rome where he was ordained. He is now a parish priest here in Virginia at his second assignment. Not only was he heavily influenced by John Paul the Great, but he is a solid Reaganite to boot. (He served as my College Republican Vice Chairman one year.)
The African students were emphatic about the ban on rubbers...
The more one reads from the article, the more it becomes apparent that the reporter REALLY tried hard to get one of them to wander away from doctrine.
Must have really had the reporter PO'd when he couldn't...
I personally know 13 seminarians - two of which were sent to Rome under this very same program - and let me tell you, the Church in the next 20 years will be in very capable hands. The true affect Pope John Paul II had on the Church has yet to even be realized yet...
Arlington had an excellent Bishop and Voc Director for a number of years.
IIRC, your current Bishop is not the same kind of guy as his predecessor and has allowed a few tweaky things; but there are so many good men out there (including at least 1 from Milwaukee) that the Diocese should remain solid for quite a while.
As opposed to the professor's piety? Lead by example, my good man!
Right on, deacon!
Can we now begin to question reporters' obsession with making anal sex 'safe'? What's up with that? Is that all you think about? It's never gonna happen, reporter dude!
What person in their right mind imagines that HIV victims were obedient on condoms but not disordered sexual relations? Completely insane!
"I heard with my own ears someone say the pope was a thief because he didn't fight AIDS," Dobos said. "But if everyone lived the way a Catholic should live, there would be no AIDS."
A good example of today's young priests are on EWTN everyday.
A Roman Catholic seminary is the only institution in the world that can take in a man and turn out a boy.
Pastoral experience will change these young priests. They will also be serving under pastors who are tempered by life, and human encounters.
Maybe the delivery, but hopefully not the message. Bending the Truth to meet "realities of the world" is one of the reasons we have so many problems today.
The essence of the Christian message has to be presented in a way that ears will hear.
The model here is John Paul II, right?
The article is pointing out that these young men are inspired by him and seek to model themselves after his example.
We don't want pastoral experience to change that, do we?
The late Pope showed us that piety and contemplation are compatible with pastoral zeal. The whining of the seminary faculty is essentially the "Martha" complaint of the gospels. They seem convinced that too much prayer and communion with God will ruin these young men.
It is they who are out of step.
Pastoral experience and prayer will temper the dogmatism and infuse it with the sensitivity that JPII exhibited in his writings.
I had lunch with a nun about a month ago from a local parish. Her general comment, when we were talking about the young priest who joined her parish last summer was,
"These new priests coming out of the seminaries are 'so conservative, just so conservative!' Even some of the other priests are complaining about them."
It took all I had not to spew my ice tea and howl with laughter.
It was then, I knew that this was good news.
Sounds wonderful to me!
Can we borrow him for a few years?
I was really struck at Anna Quindlen's editorial in Newsweek this week. She makes it clear she is catholic, and then finishes up her article on Pope John Paul II like this:
"When the pope appeared to be channeling Leviticus, standing for orthodoxy simply for orthodoxy's sake, he appeared less like a spiritual leader and more like an ecclesiastical politician. seeing only the trees and not the forest."
She admires him for being a good man, but chastises him for not being in the current thought of liberal philosphies.
Quindlen continues to get wrong. (She also exclaimed a few weeks ago, during the debate over Terri Shindler Shiavo, that there is no such thing as a culture of life.) These "Catholics" don't seem to want to conform to the teachings of the Catholic faith. We need to continue with the education of our faith, with men who are going to remain faithful to the doctrine of the Catholic Church.
Keep those seminarians coming.
One of Justice Scalia's sons is a young parish priest in the Arlington diocese, as well. i am kinda betting he is conservative ; )
This is good news, my friends.
Loverde squashed the supply, but the priests that made it through the system before he (fully) took over are excellent. Also shows that orthodoxy (Keating) begets vocations, squishyness and modernism (Loverde) do not.
I pray the next Pope will continue his legacy. This is one of the things about the Church people tend to forget. The 2,000 year old Church reacts slowly because it thinks in terms of generations. A corporate CEO would have responded in Trump-like manner ("You're fired!") to the recent scandals. The Church, it appears, has decided to let the liberal priests and bishops die-off and have more conservative priests in training to replace them. Not the immediate response people want, but a long-term solution nonetheless.
I also concur with your thoughts of the younger generation coming up.
Having taught CCD for the past number of years I see a very devout core of students who are very conservative in thought and deed.
This is so true! I keep hearing that the world has changed, but it has not changed for the better. When you used to get married, it was assumed it would be for life. Yes, there was divorce but it was so looked down on that it was rare. You considered yourself a failure if you got a divorce. It made people a little more careful when choosing a mate. It made you really try to work things out before you headed to the lawyer's office.
Birthcontrol pills led to promiscuity, the kind that is common now and accepted. There needs to be something in the middle.
Just wait until these (so called) orthodox seminarians reach the real world (their diocese). Orthodoxy will be squished out of them like a grape.
What makes all these wonderful young people so orthodox? Because they aren't homosexual? I suppose that's a start.
Conservative = Orthodoxy???
I know it's hard for some traditionalists to accept, but that can be found in Parishes where the Mass is offered according to the Novus Ordo. They really should try to wrap their minds around that concept.
TRADITIONALISTS HAVE NO MONOPOLY ON ORTHODOXY.
I have pretty much abandoned the nonsense that the Religious education text books try and promote. Our latest edition, as of two years ago, does more promoting of Native American traditions than the Catholic Doctrine and theology. I'd love to just toss the book in the garbage can.
We spend much time on the Catholic Mass, Eucharist, the Altar, and the different aspects of the church.
We explore the new testament, and work towards the 4 Gospels.
During Lent we create a trial of Christ. The students take either the prosecution or defense. We put Christ on trial, but we don't have Christ. We use witnesses from both sides. The debates are lively and educational. It is usually done during Holy Week.
Our last few weeks have been on the rosary, and of course the impact of Pope John Paul the Great.
From the Greek "ortho", which means straight or correct and "dox", meaning belief or opinion, orthodox refers to the approved form of a philosophy, ideology, doctrine, religion, and so on.
Try to find "correct belief" at any CCD class. How can a Church that teaches junk religion on Saturday, be orthodox on Sunday?
IMO, orthodox also refers to the liturgy. How you pray is how you believe. The TRADITIONAL liturgy has been thrown aside - and with it orthodoxy.
It's almost scary to think that people believe the NO to be orthodox. I imagine in a few years it will qualify as traditional, and then it will be orthodox.
Awesome news, thanks!