Tridentine Mass "Not a Priority," Says Cardinal Arinze (Vatican Synod)

Zenit News Agency ^ | October 13, 2005

[NYer]

VATICAN CITY, OCT. 13, 2005 (Zenit.org).- No one at the Synod of Bishops on the Eucharist has addressed the issue of the "Tridentine rite" Mass that the Latin Church used before the Second Vatican Council.

The prefect of the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Sacraments, Cardinal Francis Arinze, mentioned this at a press conference today when he evaluated the first phase of the synodal assembly.

"No synodal father has mentioned this point," said Cardinal Arinze, the co-president of the assembly. The so-called Tridentine rite was approved by Pope St. Pius V.

"If there are groups that desire the Tridentine Mass, this is already provided for," he said. "Bishops may allow it for groups."

"It is not a priority for the synod, as no one has spoken about it," the cardinal concluded. "The problem we have discussed is that many people don't go to Mass, and those that come don't understand -- they go to Communion but not to confession, as if they were immaculate."

[Dominick]

Yeah, what he said.

Very well written. Nice critique.

I think we may also include that not every change that is a problem in the Mass is a official change. Just yesterday we had a fellow tell my daughter's CCD class in front of me that kneeling is going out the door, and officially, nobody in europe kneels. I leaned to another friend who also attends Indults and asked, "What GIRM did he read?"

[murphE]

The article is a comparison of the original Latin text of the Novus Ordo translated into English vs. the text of the TLM translated into English. It is done to show the difference in the prayers of both masses. There is no straw man.

[jo kus]

Many of the Catholics I have met, can be bested by an 8th-grade Baptist kid who always went to Sunday School, in terms of Bible knowledge.

True. Fortunately, God does not judge us on our Bible knowledge, but on how we implement His Commandment of Love.

Regards

[mike182d]

Novus Ordo translated into English

That is the straw-man. The ICEL is currently having to develop another translation because of all the errors.

I mean, seriously...how do you get "We believe" out of the Latin Credo. I only took a semester of Latin and even I can tell the difference.

[murphE]

His attack on the Novus Ordo Mass is an attack on a straw-man

Did you read his whole article?

To criticize the Novus Ordo Mass is to say that Christ lied and that the Church failed to protect what was most Sacred

This of course is a false statement. Pope Benedict XVI himself has criticized the Novus Ordo.

[murphE]

That is the straw-man. The ICEL is currently having to develop another translation because of all the errors.

He's not using the ICEL translations - you didn't read the article. He deals with the ICEL translations in a different article though.

[mike182d]

This of course is a false statement. Pope Benedict XVI himself has criticized the Novus Ordo.

He criticized abuses, not the Mass itself. There's a big difference.

[mike182d]

So, you are admitting that the Church, entrusted with the protection of the Sacred as promised by Jesus Christ, messed-up the most Sacred event in the whole of the cosmos?

[Salvation]

BTTT!

[Petrosius]

The normative Novus Ordo Mass all but a fiction that is rarely, if ever, seen in a parish. Indeed, in most places if a priest were to attempt to celebrate is as you have laid out he would be immediately bounced. If the bishops wish those who are attached to the Traditional Mass to stop demanding it and accept the Novus Ordo then they, the bishops, should also respect the Novus Ordo AS WRITTEN and both allow and encourage it to be celebrated as a continuation of tradition in the manner that you have outlined. Otherwise, the Traditional Mass movement is being no more disobedient to the wishes of the Church than the bishops themselves.

[murphE]

He criticized abuses, not the Mass itself.

Not so, there are threads on this forum that quote his criticisms. Here is one:

To His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI : An Open Letter from Traditional Catholics

but you probably won't read it either, oh well.

[Salvation]

**"The problem we have discussed is that many people don't go to Mass, and those that come don't understand -- they go to Communion but not to confession, as if they were immaculate."**

Fantastic quote!

[mike182d]

It is clear, therefore, that this particular rite of the Roman Liturgy is the birth-right of all Roman Catholic priests and faithful..

The Greek/Maronite rite is historically the official birth-rite of all Roman Catholic priests and faithful. The Tridentine Rite is an "innovation" of the 16th Century.

[Pyro7480]

The Tridentine Rite is an "innovation" of the 16th Century.

Not quite. The Canon itself goes back to at least Pope St. Gregory the Great, perhaps even before that. The other elements were added gradually over the centuries. What Pope St. Pius V did was "standardize" the rite used in the Holy See, and apply it to the rest of the Latin church. Certain other rites, such as the Ambrosian and Mozarbic, are still around.

[Salvation]

You have been doing an outstanding job of finding news stories about the Synod. Thank you!

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[murphE]

So, you are admitting that the Church, entrusted with the protection of the Sacred as promised by Jesus Christ, messed-up the most Sacred event in the whole of the cosmos?

You accuse me of putting forth a straw man? Next you'll ask me if I admit that I have stopped beating my husband.

Is it possible to have a rational discussion?

[mike182d]

First of all, that letter was from Tradionalists BXVI. Beyond mere conjecture on their part, I did not see an actual quote of Pope Benedict's. Give me a quote from Pope Benedict stating that the Novus Ordo Mass itself is flawed, not its improper implementations.

Bottom line is this:
This is from the First Vatican Council, "Dogmatic Constitution on the Church"

"For in the Apostolic See the Catholic religion has always been preserved unblemished, and sacred doctrine been held in honor."

This is you and every anti-Novus Ordo advocate:

"The Apostolic See has not preserved the Catholic religion unblemished."

There's no other way around it. You cannot throw out the Novus Ordo without throwing out the whole of Apostolic authority within the Catholic Church, thereby making you no different than an Anglican. Yes, the Tridentine Rite should be able to be celebrated just like the Maronite Rite, but not at the expense of removing the Novus Ordo. The theological implications of such an action shake the foundation of Catholicism itself.

[mike182d]

"Tradionalists notBXVI"

*slaps forehead* oi vei!

[mike182d]

Not quite.

I know. That's why "innovation" was in quotes ;-)

[murphE]

Is it possible to have a rational discussion? I guess not.

I did not see an actual quote of Pope Benedict's.

You didn't look hard enough.